<p>@100%tuna: Do you intend to remain resident in Singapore bcoz that’s the real question to ask while deciding where to go. Anyway. Here’s how the unis you got in rank according to my “feel”:</p>
<p>1) UCL (Math+Economics) [Full Fee]
2) Warwick (Math+Statistics) [Full Fee]
3) uMich (MechE) [Full Fee]
4) NUS (Comp Engg). [with tuition grant, which cuts most of the fee)
5) UC Los Angeles (CompSci and Engineering) [Full Fee]
6) NTU (Comp Engg+BBA). [same as above]
7) Kings (CompSci+Math) [Full Fee]
8) Purdue (Comp Engg) [Full Fee]</p>
<p>@serf- Depending on what you consider competitive. I don’t know about NTU, but I know that despite high admission criteria for Law, Medicine and Dentistry, the criteria for spots in Business or Arts & Social Sciences are really pretty low. It’s almost like Business or FASS are where the rejected Law/Med applicants get turfed.</p>
<p>I’m an international student living in Bangkok and studying in an American school. I’ve applied to NUS/NTU faculty of engineering! I have over 2000 in SAT 1 and SAT 2! I really want to study in either one of these unis! And, I’m scared I won’t make it. Normally, people who have applied to NTU from our school have always had to write an entrance exam. But this year, they have removed the entrance exam. So is it a good thing or a bad thing? And, NUS is not looking at my final AP scores since they come out only in July. So,the are making a decision based on my high school transcript and SAT1/2 scores…and extracurriculars. So what do you guys think they generally expect in these areas in order to make it into NUS or NTU!?</p>
<p>i will be going overseas to carry on the equivalent of JC, and i was wondering if your would think of it as wise to try take the sat’s without any preparation to test the water(if the expressiion is correct) this may without any preparation? i noticed that the paper on a whole seemed manageble except for some maths questions and english…</p>
<p>Re: Applying for NUS/NTU with international qualifications:</p>
<p>I attempted to do that this year with IB (not AP, but the idea is there) to-be-completed in June and it was an…interesting process. I only applied to NUS because by the NTU deadline I’d already gotten into my top US choices, so keep in mind that these may not apply to NTU. NUS recently re-did their admissions website so while there’s more information on there some of it is conflicting, but here’s the impression <em>I</em> got:</p>
<p>If you are going to graduate in June-ish and want to start uni in Aug/Sep, forget about Medicine, Dentistry, maybe Law (and the double degrees possibly) because they won’t take you without your final qualifications, so it’s gap year or another subject. I’m not sure if APs make a difference because you’d already have some scores after junior year tests but that’s the impression I got with my IB predicted grades. Also interviews are conducted in April, i.e. during the US school year, and Singapore in general is <em>very</em> bad about giving advanced notice so generally don’t apply for MDL unless you’re equipped with a personal plane to fly to SG within two days or something.</p>
<p>90% of the spots in each course are given away on academic merit and 10% are for special consideration i.e. extracurriculars, SEA Games medallists, Physics Olympiad medallists etc. But they definitely care about AP scores - try to get all 5s in relevant subjects.</p>
<p>I seem to remember reading somewhere that they average out your SAT scores if you take it more than once and don’t superscore, so it’s not a good idea to ‘test the waters’ (good expression, BTW :D). Do a practice test instead. I know there’s the option of choosing the scores you want to send now but institutions can opt out of that and I’m not sure if NUS/NTU are one of them. For reference the application window this year was 2-20 February, but they also wanted mailed-in SAT score scripts (KEEP THESE - I nearly threw them away, thankfully my mother kept them as a ‘souvenir’) and a high school transcript in by the 20th which they of course do not tell you about on the home page so apply early and pray for the mail system to be nice. The online application is fairly straightforward so that’s good. Application fee is S$10 so very reasonable. Maddeningly enough NUS only tells you the results in “mid- to end-May” so you still have to apply to US unis and forfeit a deposit if you change your mind.</p>
<p>Final word of advice - think of the courses you want to do at uni, and choose the appropriate APs/IB Higher Levels + SAT subject tests. Remember you are competing with the A Level people doing a curriculum they trust and know well and who most certainly have been guided to choose the closest subjects. You’re on your own here to deal with a huge bureaucracy, so good luck (:</p>
<p>Most people can’t tell the difference between unqualified and hard to enter.</p>
<p>If you get As for subjects for your toughest A Levels load but can’t get in… that’s hard to enter. E.g. HYPSM.</p>
<p>Other than law, medicine, dentistry, double degree… show me some examples of people being denied a place at NUS/NTU with 4 As and at least a B4 for GP.</p>
<p>SMU is almost non-selective. I have a friend who was admitted to double degree in business and econs with just 3 As and 1 B, GP B3 ! He even got invited for scholarship (singapore uni euphemism for financial aid).</p>
<p>i’ll be graduating towards the end of may 2009! and i’ve already applied to NUS and NTU. I’ve mainly applied for the mechanical, electrical, and computer engineering streams. I think my last option was Industrial and Systems Engineering. The thing is my AP final scores come out in the first week of July. So, when I talked to NUS, they said that they will not be able to look at my final AP results since it will be too late for them. So they are going to make a decision based on extra-curriculars, transcript, and SAT 1 and 2. And as far as i know, i don’t think they conduct interviews for the engineering streams. do they? And as far as NTU goes, they have cancelled the entrance exam for AP students. And they said they will look at out final AP scores for admission. So I will be faxing the scores immediately after they arrive. And, i also had another doubt! Do they have a quota for each country (like a certain number of seats reserved for each country)? Like, since I’m in Thailand, would they have a certain number of seats reserved for Thailand? And, will I atleast get into NUS Industrial and Systems Engineering if not anything else? :)</p>
<p>^ Scholarship = Merit aid, not purely need-based FA (although some scholarships are biased towards need - i.e. the poorer you are the more likely you are gonna get it, ceteris paribus).</p>
<p>“A school in Singapore (ACSI) also did produce half the world’s IB 45-pointers so I would say the courseload (at the top schools) are very demanding compared to America.”</p>
<p>While it is very impressive that ACSI had 9 45 point scorers, this was 9/20 ish at the mid year sitting of the IB- which is not the IB sitting which the majority of test takers use. </p>
<p>Students in Singapore start taking standardized tests and begin learning how to learn so they can take tests in Primary 1. American students start taking standardized tests in 9/10th grades at the earliest.</p>
<p>8 years of extra experience in sitting standardized tests, 8 years more experience in cramming for tests. Performing better on tests and spending extraordinary amounts of time in tutorial programs does not equate with academic rigor. Sorry.</p>
<p>^ The TIMSS studies pretty much bear me out on the general quality of education in Singapore (and other countries) in the math and science subjects.</p>
<p>Standardized tests are probably the best way of assessing mastery in the core mathematics and science subjects. Not practising (either for tests or in general) is no excuse. Tutorial programmes (in Singapore and elsewhere) seek to reinforce concepts that have been learnt in schools so they can be mastered. Anyway, a lot of the high scorers in A-levels/IB have never taken extra-curricular tutorials before.</p>
<p>What you are saying sounds to me like this - “I cannot integrate 1/2 x^2, but that doesn’t mean I haven’t learn my calculus.” That is pretty much unacceptable.</p>
<p>I guess that’s what you tell yourself when you kids get their asses handed to them by internationals Whatever helps you sleep at night. Didn’t know that sour grapes could be used for sleep therapy, though what is certain that I can smell it all the way from over the Internet!</p>
<p>But seriously, are you listening to yourself? You’re in effect saying oh, so these other kids from other countries do better because they spend more time studying, so their higher scores are just merely due to… their devotion of most of their free time towards their studies! Well DUH?! Since when did school stop being about hard work, diligence and talent?</p>
<p>LOL this is just so funny I have to keep posting. Here are more of robyrm2’s golden nuggets of “knowledge” and “wisdom”, going by his logic:</p>
<p>**Tiger Woods has been No.1 only because he spends more time practicing his swings and putts than anyone else on the Tour.</p>
<p>Barack Obama was elected President only because he had more money, a better work ethic and a much more disciplined campaign organization. And oh, he speaks well. But nyeh, if he didn’t have all those stuff it’d have been McCain, so Obama’s victory doesn’t really count.</p>
<p>That guy spends 90 hrs a week at work and hasn’t called in sick for a year while I try every way to do the bare minimum for my paycheck. WHY THE HELL DO THEY PROMOTE HIM?</p>
<p>I’m probably every bit as capable as my boss but nyeh, he’s only my boss because FOR THE PAST 8 YEARS HE’S BEEN WORKING HIS ASS OFF AND I DIDN’T. Performing better at work and spending extraordinary amount of time at work does not equate with being work performance. Sorry.**</p>
<p>And how can we forget this: **8 years of extra experience in sitting standardized tests, 8 years more experience in cramming for tests. Performing better on tests and spending extraordinary amounts of time in tutorial programs does not equate with academic rigor. Sorry.
**</p>
<p>It’s hilarious to see how sour grapes and denial can screw with people’s heads, even for a doctor like robyrm2. The questions you should be asking yourself is this: if we can start testing at grade 1, WHY DO YOU WAIT TILL GRADE 8/9? You are barking up the wrong tree. China, India, South Korea, Singapore, etc are taking off thanks to a willingness to expose their children to the real world earlier. The world is leaving you behind and no, the world won’t slow down or stop just to pacify your complaints. Do something about it instead of this whole pathetic sour grapes act.</p>
<p>The problem is, Singaporeans are overwhelming the ranking table for math and science at junior classes but we have yet to produce a true blue singapore born, singapore bred nobel laureate. </p>
<p>even NUS and NTU is nowhere close to say a top tech schools in US. Our schools are decent, but that’s it with a huge “P” - period.</p>
<p>Screwitlah-no need to yell. I read and hear quite well. Also, no sour grapes. We are doing fine, thanks. Kid graduating an IVY PBK this year, for starters. Parents who manage to integrate and differentiate both. </p>
<p>Rigor=breathtaking confusion, inspiring teachers who push you to the absolute limits of your thinking while not robbing you of your passion for learning, taking risks, making mistakes and learning from them, exploring, questioning,getting a 17/100 on a organic chem class and being grateful, being divergent, synthesizing. A rigorous education produces as many questions as answers. You obviously have all the answers.</p>
<p>I am afraid to say that robyrm2 has a point. I have a few Singaporean friends myself, and all of them are nerds and most of them don’t do anything but study. I may be over-generalizing, and these people can never represent the entire Singaporean population but still. Please enlighten me.</p>
<p>AND just because people spend “8 years of extra experience in sitting standardized tests, 8 years more experience in cramming for tests” and “perform better on tests and spend extraordinary amounts of time in tutorial programs” AUTOMATICALLY MEANS an educational system that does not have </p>
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<p>Full marks for using one huge false dichotomy as a basis for all your logic and preconceived notions. Look where your education has brought you I can only hope your child does better than you in that regard, which shouldn’t be too difficult. No, I obviously don’t have all the answers, but at least I don’t go around making assumptions about other countries, and at least I live in the real world and not in denial! Haha!</p>
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<p>You are right, they don’t represent the entire Singaporean population. You are better than robyrm2 in that 1) At least you seem to have some experience with the education system 2) You acknowledge that you’re not all-knowing and 3) No sour grapes here.</p>
<p>hey hey hey! any singaporean going to UCLA/Berkeley/CMU this year (or has gone in previous years)? if any of your friends are- tell them there’s this fishy (tuna) character who’d like to know them!
(i might be going to one of the schools- or NUS! haha!)
PM me if you know anyone! Thanks!! :)</p>
<p>PS: where’s fiona? she seems to have disappeared from the forums! :(</p>
<p>Edit: DANG! I think i use too many smilies! haha! and yay! post number 2 hundred and 50! :D</p>
Whatever helps you sleep at night. Didn’t know that sour grapes could be used for sleep therapy, though what is certain that I can smell it all the way from over the Internet!</p>