Came across a speech my mom wrote for her retirement ceremony. Mom was an instrumental music teacher, first in high school, then in middle school - very loved at her job and did well with various competitions, etc, in her day. We’ve heard from several former students who have fond memories.
The end of the speech?
She graduated from college in 1965.
Thanks, mom, for letting me choose my own path too. And I’ve certainly no regrets letting my lads choose their paths. Money is not everything and mom certainly had enough of it (no debt, etc, and some left over savings to pass around).
My Dad gave me 4 options; doctor, lawyer, engineer or accountant. He said he wasn’t paying for a degree in walking. So, I picked accounting because I liked math and it seemed the easiest of the four choices. I hated business school and did lousy. I actually did become an accountant and enjoyed working a lot more than studying. I was never a superstar, but efficient enough to climb the corporate ladder to middle management at a Fortune 500.
I really resented it for years, as this really isn’t my “talent”. It took me awhile to realize he was protecting me the best way he knew. He said if you ever get divorced I want you to be able to take care of yourself with a decent salary, I understand in his generation, these were the 4 choices to that path. So, I feel resentment no longer. He was doing his best.
My kids could decide whatever they wanted, but I did help guide them when they seemed confused.
I am grateful for my law degree. I did get divorced and it did allow me to provide for my family. That being said, I’m letting my kids choose their own paths but I do worry about them sometimes, just like your dad, @conmama.
I am grateful for my sociology and law degrees. Both have proven useful over my life, professionally and personally.
I’m bemused that my mom vetoed my initial Community Service and Public Affairs major but was OK with sociology and law school and here I am running a nonprofit I started! Life certainly is interesting!
My first love was piano performance but I realized I wasn’t good enough to be a solo pianist. I picked engineering. I think I probably would have done better as an accountant.
This is very interesting. I came from no money but was always told I am going to college, somehow. . Yes, I could be a Doctor, Lawyer, Accountant. Don’t even think engineering was a thing in the 60’s. By 1971 I was 9 and knew I wanted to work with children. Today I am a sports medicine doctor with a large pediatric clientele.
Today my kids are privledged to take any path they desire. But I have to admit I told both my son and daughter that they should never ever have to rely on anyone. They should be able to support themselves and be happy.
FWIW, my mom got divorced in the very early 80s (I was 11 when they separated in the 70’s). She got no support or settlement from my dad because we kids were split up. I lived with dad and sis lived with mom. Her parents died relatively recently with no major inheritance from them either.
Mom still was able to buy a house, cars, travel the world multiple times, pay for some of our traveling trips when she went with us post retirement (5 in our family), and enjoy casinos all over. The key wasn’t her salary. It was how she spent and invested her money as she went along. It also helped that being a teacher provided her with a good retirement income and great health insurance.
Plus there’s still some she’s shared with her daughters and grandsons. No one is rich, but we had a lot of really terrific memories going all the way back to her concerts and parades.
When I announced I wanted to be a hematologist, my mother laughed at me. My options were nurse or teacher. I chose neither but went on to get an MBA and have a decent business career.
My dad tried to force me to become a computer programmer or something computer related back in the mid-70’s. I had attended Bronx Science so was totally turned off to anything math or science related. The upside of having your parents refuse to pay one penny for your college education is that you get to study whatever you want because you are paying for it. I started as a journalism major but after the capture of Son of Sam, I realized that I couldn’t be a journalist, so I switched to poli sci, history and English. I then defied my father’s instruction to get a civil service job and went to law school. I love being a lawyer and can’t imagine doing anything else, but I sort of wish I’d become a lawyer in public service. Lower pay but better benefits and a pension!
I told my kids they could do and become whatever they want. Oldest son is career civil service with USPS, D gave up teaching for private industry, sons 2 and 3 are underemployed/unemployed while S17 is graduating next year and will be taking some civil service exams.
I’m a believer in you’ll thrive when doing what you love. D is a performing artist and wants to pursue that professionally. Very difficult road ahead, but I am 100% behind her following her dreams. That being said, she is very bright so we expose her to other potential ways to be involved in her love (writing, directing, teaching, etc.) just in case it proves to be too daunting. Looking forward to see where her journey takes her. She has the talent, but so do lots of others. Like professional sports, only so many spots.
I knew I wanted to go to law school, and I planned to go straight out of college. I really had no pre-conceived ideas about an undergraduate major. My mother suggested accounting because it was practical, and she thought I might be burned out after undergraduate school and felt like I should study something employable. She was right. I was burned out! So, I worked in public accounting for five years before returning to law school.
Dh’s dad pushed him toward engineering. As in, told him what he was going to major in. After one semester dh said, “No way,” and switched to accounting as well. Fil thought any kind of business degree was worthless. That’s what he had, and he thought a lot of the coursework was useless (keep in mind he had a generic business degree and some of his courses back in the dark ages were in things like “business machines.”). For fil it was all about where one could make the most money whether you liked what you did or not. I see a lot of that from that generation. The mindset that it is called “work” for a reason and that you aren’t supposed to enjoy it! Dh did accounting anyway and had a great career both financially and personally and retired at 55.
Fil also tried to push ds into medicine. Again, for him it was about what one could make the most money doing, and from his era, becoming a doctor was the best way to make money. Plus, that’s what the smart kids did. His mindset was very dated about the best way to become “rich.” Apparently, dh wasn’t smart enough to become a doctor but was smart enough to become an engineer - ha ha! But, ds was smart enough to become a doctor, and by golly, that is what he should do, and fil voiced this ad nauseum. My ds NEVER had any interest in that at all. Fil FINALLY quit talking about it but not without my yelling - HE DOESN’T WANT TO GO TO MEDICAL SCHOOL!!!
We told ds he could major in whatever he wanted to. For awhile in high school, he considered being a music major with piano performance. He was definitely in range to be good enough, but he decided not to follow that path around the middle of his junior year in high school. I think it’s good to discuss pros and cons of any career with your children. Going in “eyes wide open,” is what matters. If they choose something less lucrative that they love, so what? But, they need to be aware of how outcomes CAN vary. Though, they don’t always. There is probably a bit more certainty of steady employment with some degrees than others, but there are never any guarantees for anyone.
Interesting topic. I was raised by first gens - an engineer/teacher combo. I was raised to think (by the teacher) that engineering was the greatest profession ever. I was good and math/science. It was a no brainer what I’d do. I only applied to one school. The only twist was I thought I’d be aero, but going to school in a recession, I swapped out for civil. Always jobs there.
For the most part it has worked out, but I definitely don’t think it’s the best job ever. I don’t hate it, and it mostly pays the bills. But I think I would have been better suited as something else. After I pull my 30, I’m going to reassess. I do love data and analytics. I also love mapping (the GIS).
I have really tried to support and guide, but not choose my kids’ careers. It’s so hard because there aren’t many people to look up to for exposure here. Older DS was easier - he’s super with math (and everything), but doesn’t have the tinkering engineering personality. (like me) he does love money though. So something in the financial field made sense. I know nothing about that field, so exactly what he’s persuing is up to him. Younger s is your generic good at everything but no strong desire or idea of what to do. I tried to assess his strengths from my perspective and actually found his major. He loves the idea, but I try to impress that if he wants to find something else, that’s A OK with me…
OP’s maternal grandfather sounds pretty progressive actually, suggesting a woman (his daughter) go into science back in 1965! Not to mention wanting her to be self-supporting and successful and not just go to college for the “Mrs.” degree.
Here we are in 2019 and still talking about getting more women into STEM fields, so you have to give some credit to that grandfather for being pretty progressive even though he was pushing something his daughter didn’t want.
I’m on the opposite side. My parents paid for my college but gave me no guidance nor restrictions with what I could do, except that I could only be in for 4 years. Anything longer and I was on my own. I ended up bouncing around majors, even trying music for awhile, but settled with a business degree. I eventually became a math teacher.
While I don’t agree with parents pressuring their kids into a specific field because of salary, I do think there are too many kids going to college who have no idea what a particular major or field looks like as far as careers. When I taught high school, I often wished there was an internship program where kids could “try out” certain fields in order to learn if it would be something they’d enjoy. As high school is now there is so much focus on grades, EC’s, and sports that you have lots of kids who get into a major and realize it’s not for them. And with today’s high tuition costs that can be detrimental financially.
At the time I applied to colleges, both of my parents were recent immigrants with limited English ability who graduated from only elementary and high school. But unlike many recent immigrants, they never told me to study hard at school partly because they already knew my personality was not very suitable for academics and partly because they really thought one’s health and other things were far more important than studying. As long as I did not flunk out (even with missing 30% high school attendance), it was fine. As a result of my experience, I never told my kid to get good grades or get into a good college (except to tell him that good grades help to get into brand name colleges if that’s his goal) but made sure we read to him at an early age and that there were books around my kid at home, after having read somewhere that the single most important factor in raising a successful factor according to research was not income level, parents’ education level etc. but making sure your home is surrounded by books that the kid can read. I also encouraged every legal things my kid wanted to try: some he quit, some he stuck with. As a result (I think), our kid has no resentment towards us and is appreciative of us.
When it came to college applications, I only recommended to him to apply to several UCs and one Honors College, and he could apply to whatever college he wanted to. My only advice when our kid went off to college was “Try to find what area you like, go at your own pace and try to exercise regularly.”
There are plenty of free resources online for doing interest inventories and Meyers-Briggs type tests. For Holland Interest Inventory codes My Next Move through ONET is one. Truity is another. Obviously, you get what you pay for, but career exploration is certainly a good add-in for the college search and selection and admissions process.
Many kids have no idea what they want to do, what they are truly good at, or what they might like. Their sole job has been to earn good grades. Many are on auto-pilot and haven’t spent any time at all considering how their skills and interests should be factored into a college or college major choice.
@ucbalumnus. I know what your saying but as a young kid I never was asked or told to pursue it. It was accountant, NVlawyer, doctor, going into business or bust.
@anomander I agree totally. Grandpa was a farmer with 4 daughters and 2 sons. He insisted his older two daughters go to college. The oldest also became a teacher - elementary school for her. One of his sons joined the military (joined before being drafted - Vietnam) and has had a military followed by construction career. He owns a small restaurant now. The other son took over the farm. Sadly, there wasn’t enough money for the younger two daughters to go to college, so they went directly into the work force - secretary for one, various retail jobs for the other.
They’ve always been a close family and the two who went to college ended up with the best finances. They’ve helped their siblings along as needed. Those four did ok, but not to the level the older sisters did. Mom even had me giving the four some post death after making sure oldest wouldn’t feel left out if she didn’t get any. (She wasn’t sure how much she’d need for her health, so waiting until after to share.)
How Grandpa had the foresight to do what he did amazes me in that day and age. His parents immigrated from England. He farmed his whole life - I don’t think he even finished high school. To me, it’s amazing to see the difference college made - at least back then.
It also helps that they were teachers in NY. I’m aghast at how little teachers make in some states. Mom retired (1998) with a 51+K salary. (It’s amazing what one learns sifting through all that was left behind). She saved and spent wisely. Not much on things, but a fair bit on experiences and grandkids while making sure she had enough for herself. It’s what I model my own financial life after.