Son not interested in college or work

Parents Forum
101

@browndeck – your child’s mental health should be your priority #1. How would you feel if he tried to kill himself? With kids with depression that’s not out of the question! You’d be appalled, terrified, and incredibly guilt-stricken, the kind of terror and guilt that NEVER LEAVES YOU.

No, you don’t want that for him - or for you.

Give him TIME. At this age, six months or a year can make a huge difference.

You can make it clear to him that you expect him to be engaged in his community, working, volunteering – whatever. But also assure him that college can wait. Millions of kids take a year (and more!) between high school and college and turn out just fine.

My own son’s psychological vulnerability was underestimated by his counselors/psychologists. We all paid for it with his complete nervous breakdown at the end of his freshman year of college. Despite what they said, my son could not cope with his anxiety and depression. He’s considered profoundly gifted, his IQ in the 99.9th percentile, and yes, before his illness became fully apparent, he was considered very promising. It took a long time for me and his dad to accept that his psyche may not allow him to fulfill that promise. His post breakdown meds and therapy helped, but not fully. He tried college again, but despite doing well, he dropped out, and got a full time job, something he could cope with. He doesn’t make much. But enough to live on very frugally.

And you know what? He’s never been happier, more confident, more connected to the world.

I will take my functioning and smiling college drop out over the bedridden college student any day. I’ve seen how devastating it can be to push him beyond his capabilities.

We have an agreement. IF HE’S READY AND WANTS TO, he can go back to school, with my full support. Until then, I will not pressure him. We talk about his work, his life, his plans – and I applaud every step forward that he makes.

For him, holding down a job, paying his bills, living his life – is all a huge accomplishment. It’s not the accomplishment I though we’d be celebrating years ago. But it’s an accomplishment nonetheless, and I applaud it.

Sorry for the long share. But I’ve been in your shoes, and hope you can get some ideas from my story. Wishing you the best.

102

I’m really curious about the pros who recommend that he should move forward. My D was in this position two years ago. She literally made the same comment about not asking to be born. Why should she have to go to school because society says do. Very existential things too.



She told us she thought college was dumb and a waste. Her therapist told us that our job was to just keep the ball in play. Keep her alive. She spent many days laying on the couch because deciding whether to shower was too difficult.



I was like you, anxious and fearful for how she could ever be independent. Should we show her some tough love? Were we enabling her?



We did a DBT course recommended by her therapist. She postponed even applying to schools. A year later she had held and quit several part time jobs, some with good reason and some because she just could not handle some aspect like dealing with difficult customers.



She found a volunteer gig that I did force her to try and she loved it. She tried one class at a local LAC and is now registered to attend there FT this fall.



I am cautiously optimistic. She learned a LOT of coping skills in these two years. She is two years behind her peers. But the ball is still in play. And if she drops out or has a crisis we will handle it when it comes.



It was truly awful seeing all her friends go on to the “typical” progression in life. So I feel for you. It takes a huge change in perspective to see an altered path for your child.



In the end, I’d really question why the pros think proceeding is a good idea and if they recommend and adjunct therapies.

103

Yes, I’m baffled that the professionals aren’t concerned about his suicidal thinking. I would be VERY concerned about it. Kids DO kill themselves. It’s one of, if not the top, leading causes of death for young people.

I have to tell you that all along the way, professionals have assured me my son would be able to do this, that, and the other. And he can’t. It’s been six years since his diagnosis, and he’s not doing what they told me he would be able to. So to be honest, I don’t put as much stock in what the professionals say anymore. They’ve managed to keep him out of the hospital, but he’s not moving forward.

104

thank you @MaineLonghorn . I agree. Therapists should be reacting more strongly to the suicidal comments.

105

Regarding his dog-sitting business, I have the feeling that the last thing you should do is step in and start inadvertently pressuring him and taking over with things like we site creation. You would only want to find a way to be helpful, but I think it would likely backfire.

106

As much as I agree with the sentiments expressed by so many to take this issue seriously, it is also true that none of us can diagnose the situation from afar, and I would seriously consider the judgment of qualified professionals, particularly if several of them agree on the situation. While all expressions of suicide should be taken seriously for evaluation by professionals, it is unfortunately true that some immature or manipulative kids make such statements without meaning, in an effort to get what they want, and professionals are very helpful in helping to assess the situation. Sadly, one of my neighbors is subject to a daughter who repeatedly threatens self-harm if she doesn’t get her way. Last week, she threatened suicide if she didn’t get a sports car. The BMW is in the driveway now. I have no way of knowing how serious OP’s son is in his situation, but encourage OP to continue to meet with all the professionals she can to get a handle on possible strategies. Do they have suggestions as to how to motivate him? Would a more therapeutic environment, without computers/cell phones/videogames or other distractions, be better for him and encourage him to read or take walks or practice mindfulness or whatever? Unfortunately, social media does little to improve mental health and can be responsible for its deterioration. Would it help to go camping as a family-all that outdoor activity? Ask for concrete suggestions from the professionals you hired, and don’t be afraid to pester them as needed.

107

While I don’t wholly disagree with you, @roycroftmom, I do think it’s better to over-react than under-react. You do not want to be that parent who loses a child to suicide even though professionals thought it would be unlikely. Counseling, psychology, psychiatry - they’re not fool proof. And professionals have been known to be wrong. I certainly regret listening to a few who, while my son was in high school, thought his issues were due to immaturity and growing pains. Had I intervened sooner, he may have avoided a lot of pain. Regrets: you don’t want to have them if it’s your child’s health that’s involved.

108

@roycroftmom I am not questioning the pros about his suicidal ideation, I am questioning their saying the OP son should plan to move forward with a job or college. I agree we can’t diagnose from afar, but I don’t understand the need to do something that may be way beyond the student’s ability while he is depressed. I would be curious what support and therapeutic interventions they suggest to help him move forward.

109

@browndeck I can’t remember, but are you in therapy, too? Not family, but individual? If not, I highly, HIGHLY recommend it.

He has a dog sitting business. That is HUGE. Why can’t that be enough right now?

College will always always always be there. The “experts” are wrong about him losing out on money if he doesn’t go right away. They should stick to counseling, not college financial advice.

Furthermore, I’m questioning what kind of therapist isn’t concerned about expressing suicidal thoughts. Maybe not concerned enough to get them admitted to a psych ward, but not concerned at all?

@roycroftmom there is a huge difference between threatening suicide to be manipulative and threatening suicide when you very clearly already have major depressive symptoms.

So don’t do it. That’s pretty simple.

Most teens and young adults who have mental health problems do go on to lead happy, healthy lives. I’m one of them. My roommate is one of them. He even did try to commit suicide and was a self-mutilator for years. His family did nothing for him and he almost lost his life because of it. Now he’s 26 and recently got a tattoo to cover up as many of his scars as he could. I, on the other hand, had an enormous amount of family help. It’s probably why I don’t have the scars that he does.* We both still take meds for our mental health.

*In no way am I blaming all families who have children who self harm. I am only speaking of our two situations where family WAS the big difference between us.

110

Yes I realize that romanigypsies. That is why I said all expressions should be taken seriously for professional evaluation. But neither you nor I are equipped to diagnose this student’s problems, and horror stories of incorrect diagnosis are unlikely to be of much help. Yes professionals of all kinds can make mistakes but OP is advised to consider their judgment particularly if several agree on the key points. In my experience professionals tend to err on the side of caution in these situations. Not always, but often.

111

I’m not a parent, but I am a student who experienced something very similar the summer before my freshman year at Cornell University. I was hospitalized, diagnosed with severe depression and anxiety, and enrolled in an outpatient therapy program. I didn’t want to get out of bed. For a time, college was so far out of the question that the mere mention of it sent me into even deeper depression. Mind you, I’d been a good student in high school, very involved with ECs and with a 4.0 GPA.

Long story short, I went to college as planned … and proceeded to be hospitalized twice in that first semester, which was partly due to an abusive roommate and partly due to my continuing struggle with mental illness. Then, surprisingly, my medication started to take effect and my housing situation was resolved, with a restraining order put in place for my protection. The rest of the year was rocky, but not nearly as bad, and things have been getting better ever since. I’ve learned healthier coping skills and no longer need medication. I’m now a rising senior who will be applying to graduate schools in the fall.

Would I recommend my approach to OP? Probably not – even though it worked out in the end, it was definitely the brute-force way of overcoming a mental health issue, and there were times when I did fear for my safety and when everything could have unraveled. Those months were tremendously difficult for my parents, who knew how ill I was but still respected my decision to attend college on schedule. Obviously, I’m not a medical professional and I only know about OP’s son’s diagnosis what OP has shared with us, but I hope that my experience is illuminating. If I’ve learned anything from having friends who took leaves of absence for mental health reasons, it’s that there does not need to be a fixed schedule for a student to attend and graduate from college. The process can be just as enjoyable if it’s delayed by a few years; the fog of depression really does a number on your ability to perform basic functions, let alone succeed at the collegiate level.

112

@ForeverFish - thanks for your input.

Quick question, when you went to Cornell, did you WANT to give it a try… or did you feel like you HAD to/SHOULD ?

113

@Consolation You’re absolutely right. Your advice made much more sense than mine.

114

He is a gifted, caring, funny 17 year old with an old soul. He is not narcissistic or doing drugs. I am torn and frustrated because I see my child struggling and it hurts me. There is no reason for us to kick him out, he has not done anything wrong but one of the counselors said if down the road, he is not working or going to school (assuming he is healthy) sometimes you have to push some kids out of the nest. He is a gamer but he likes games that are teamwork and strategy based, not violent (like COD, etc). He has a regular team of people he plays with online who are grad students, in the military, an attorney. He started an online community last year related to that game. I hope he gives college a chance because I think he will find his people. I think part of the issue is that he is done with high school.
His mood has greatly improved but he isn’t ready to make decisions about his future. We are not pushing him to go away to college and our goal has always to get in the big state school (very competitive) and you will have lots of choices. If he were to go away to big state school, I would be worried since he has had a tough year. I hope he will go to our local college and live at home awhile and grow in confidence and strength.
I regret some of the harsh things I posted earlier. It was late, I was tired and I’m sad that this is not an a time of possibility and excitement, mostly for him.

We will always do our best to support him

115

I wonder if he would be interested in game design. Maybe there might be a summer program (short term class or camp) that would interest him. Is he into sports or fitness at all? Would he be interested in joining a gym or local swim club. Any type of fitness routine will get him moving and reduce his stress/anxiety. It will uplift his mood, increase his ability to focus and be more productive. If these types of activities might be of interest to him he may do them without feeling as if he is being pressured. Small steps towards progress.

116

This is true, but not something you have to think about now.

Take it one day at a time. Then one week at a time. And so on. There isn’t a time table for when people become healthier. Some take to the meds and counseling right away, some take months, some never get there (but I don’t think your son will be one of those based on what you’ve written).

117

Well, starting an online gaming community and dog walking are good signs. I would encourage him to devote himself to his passions, any passions and tell him that he can go far, whatever those interests are, if he applies himself to them.



A classmate from HS spent most of his waking hours (and most hours that others were asleep) during his HS years playing computer games (and back then, they were really stupid ASCII-based games).

He went to college and graduated, but after that, he started a gold-mining company (winning equipment and stuff in online games to sell). Several years after building up that company, he sold it and became a millionaire.



Moral of the story is that parents are often shocked and surprised when kids don’t turn out the way they were or expect them to be, but the key thing is to be supportive and nurturing them to move forward.

118

Has it ever occurred to you to fire the therapists whose values don’t align with yours? You don’t have to kick your son out if that’s not what you want. If I were you, my goal wouldn’t be to get him out of the nest. It would be to heal him enough so he doesn’t take his own life. If the doctors couldn’t grasp my primary goal, then I’d find someone who could.

You don’t have to make your son pay his way through school if he doesn’t go right away. If he takes a gap year or two but doesn’t take any college courses, he’ll still be considered a freshman (and eligible for freshman grants) and not a transfer. It’s transfers who generally don’t get much aid. Even if he wouldn’t qualify for aid anymore, you don’t have to force him to make up whatever aid he’d be missing out on.

If you’re not suggesting these extreme actions, how are they coming up? It seems unethical to me for doctors to suggest kicking a mentally ill teen out of his home or to encouraging parents to make them responsible for thousands of dollars in educational costs. Are these their ideas or yours? You’re the one talking about disowning him, so maybe the doctors are just mirroring your opinions. In any case, if I were in your shoes I’d be shopping for new doctors.

119

I agree with austinmshauri. I was shocked to read that any mental health counselor would talk about kicking your son out of the house at any point. And I hope you will fire that professional .Tough love is not what is needed right now.

120

If he is “done” with high school, look into college! Maybe he can start somewhere close to home.

Also, I would ask the counselor who thinks you need to kick him out what that would look like: Pile his stuff on the front porch and good luck? Or is there an actual planning process you would go through? I don’t know of any mental health treatment where a good round of homelessness to knock some sense into them is recommended. Learning how to appropriately nudge him out of the nest is not committing yourself to doing that; it’s just understanding the option should you decide to pursue it. (And you’re the boss here, not the counselor.)