<p>“And why should a woman be walked down the aisle by her father (or parents)? And why should she be “given away”? Easy. As Tevye said, “Tradition!””</p>
<p>Yes, gifts of jewelry, especially rings, to solemnize engagement or marriage are indeed ancient traditions, common to many cultures. The idea that there has to be a diamond, and that men who don’t come from family wealth have to buy one commensurate with a big chunk of their income, is recent and came from Madison Avenue. If we like diamonds for aesthetic reasons or even because of a fashion trend, there’s nothing wrong with that. I just have a problem with making a marketing campaign into a cultural obligation, so that men feel inadequate and women feel unloved if the jewelry doesn’t match expectations. It’s as though we took McDonald’s “You Deserve A Break Today” and made it into a cultural rule that everyone who doesn’t take a break at McDonald’s is letting their family down.</p>
<p>Eh, not always, especially now that so many women outearn men, especially if they find their mates after they’ve finished with any level of school.
A 30 year old woman who has a graduate degree may be looking for men who are her peers in terms of education and income but a 30 year old man who is considered her peer, may not be looking for similar qualities or consider those qualities important in women. This is the reality in the millennials’ world.</p>
<p>“wholt idea of an engagement ring “upgrade” is foreign to me. I mean, it’s not about the ring, it’s about the symbol. I would never ever want to change my engagement ring. It’s what my DH saved up and bought and it is not something disposable.”</p>
<p>I’ve never had the desire to upgrade an engagement ring, but you know? That’s easy to say when I got a decent size ring in the first place. Maybe I’d feel differently if it was a small chip and our fortunes had increased considerably. Who knows? </p>
<p>I do think it’s important for the guy to know the girl’s tastes. When H had decided he wanted to marry me, he wanted to surprise me with a trip to a jeweler where he’d already have stones laid out. (This is my H to a tee. He loves to surprise.) HIS mother had an emerald cut, in platinum, with baguettes on either side. So naturally he thought that that was the height of everything that any woman would want (sarcasm) and called the jeweler and had that put aside. Then we went browsing one day and he “casually” asked me what I thought of certain rings. I kind of puked all over emerald cut and platinum and baguettes and said - oh, not me, not my style, I much prefer oval or round cut, yellow gold, and no baguettes or side diamonds please. He had to make an emergency phone call to the jeweler :-)</p>
<p>My BIL got kind of caught up in the DeBeers thing, and got my sister a ring with five diamonds in it - my sister is tall and can carry off bigger jewelry than I can, but it was still way too much bling. She debated, but ultimately decided to tell him that she’d prefer to have just the middle stone and the two end stones, and have the 2nd and 4th made into diamond earrings. It’s a lot better size now. Sometimes too big isn’t good either.</p>
<p>Not to mention many who are lucky to land biglaw jobs have at least around $200k in law school debt. And that’s not bringing up undergrad debt and compounding interest associated with the debts. </p>
<p>My H does not have a graduate or professional degree, which was somewhat concerning to my folks initially. (especially since I do have a professional degree. It never bothered H nor me, so we are happy that my folks have stopped being concerned about it long ago. H is one of the most interesting folks I know–he has a broad range of interests and knowledge. I’m glad we are still best friends and that he now is wearing his wedding band (since he is no longer working around things that could get caught on it). It’s a comfortable, simple band of gold with engraving.</p>
<p>My H doesn’t wear his wedding band and hasn’t for years. It’s completely impractical in the course of his workday, activities and where he’s putting his hands. I’d mildly like him to, but I’ve gotten over it. </p>
<p>We got engaged while still in college, so my engagement ring is quite modest. H bugged me to change out the diamond. Instead I asked for a diamond band for our 10th anniversary. I have very small hands (ring size 4.5), so a big diamond would overpower them. </p>
<p>Yea, H didn’t wear his for about two decades, but now that he’s retired, I gave it back to him at dinner last night when we were out with friends and he was going to demonstrate to the jeweler how it needed to be sized but lo & behold it fits again now! He’s wearing it now. I’m not that concerned about it but it seemed silly that it was sitting in a drawer in my dresser. His work made it dangerous sometimes for him to have anything on his hands, so he just took it off and it stayed off until now. :)</p>
<p>i don’t understand about " upgrading" either.
After all, I am still on my starter husband.
But since I’m having Thanksgiving with my sister n laws, who both had expensive rings ( but are now both divorced) Im now curious as to what they did with them, since resale is so low.</p>
<p>I don’t understand the “upgrading” thing either. But then, I went ring shopping with H and got a ring I liked and would be happy wearing forever in the first place. As I believe I said upthread, H–who had worked in NYC examining stones being imported for US Customs for a couple of years while in grad school, thanks to a prior stint in the Peace Corps–had very high standards for diamonds, and there was no way we were going to spend enough for a carat–I have big hands, and a tiny ring would not look good-- that he would approve of, and of course, I didn’t like diamonds much, so that was an easy call. </p>
<p>My sister initially had a classic Tiffany solitaire. Eventually they had it reset with flanking sapphires of the same size. It’s lovely.</p>
<p>Regarding Oldfort’s D, in previous discussions she’s said that her D expects her dates to drop her off in front of restaurants and find parking elsewhere and is highly offended if they think she might walk a block, pay to cab her around town rather than–gasp–taking the subway, and so forth. It seems that she is what my S would call “a bit of a princess,” and she is perfectly comfortable with that. To each his or her own. Personally, I think there is a vast difference between wanting to have input into a ring you plan to wear daily for the rest of your life and “demanding” a certain size diamond. I would also point out that to say she would put more into the apt is a bit bogus, since the ring is considered a gift and her sole property in a divorce, while the apt is common property, but whatever. A man who loves and wishes to marry this princess knows what he is getting into up front. I think that’s the best way.</p>
<p>At my neighborhood bookclub, 2 women shared what their 27 y.o sons earn. One son earns $450,000 a year. My jaw dropped. He could certainly afford to buy Oldfort’s D1 a 2 K ring or a car or whatever. Of course, Oldfot’s D1 would have to move to FL, live in an ocean or intercoastal home, but I think she would survive. :> </p>
<p>In some activist circles where issues like blood diamonds are a concern, wearing a diamond without clarifying would be viewed in the same light as if a movie star who purports herself to be an animal rights activist goes to the animal rights meeting wearing a fur coat* or someone who shows up to a lefty anti-corporate protest/political meeting wearing formal corporate wear and buttons/waving signs supporting the Koch brothers, Walmart, and Wall Street. </p>
<p>To put it mildly, it won’t go down very well and from what I’ve seen/heard in these groups as an observer tagging along with friends who are in activist scenes, the activists who pull such a faux pax…even accidentally tend to be scolded as there’s an expectation that the activists and purported allies don’t wear anything/behave in any way which could hint at hypocrisy against their espoused cause or worse, is viewed as ■■■■■■■■ them. </p>
<ul>
<li>This actually happened to Chinese actress Gong Li when she was widely derided in the Chinese/Asian and to some extent, international mass media for giving a lecture on environmental/animal rights issues while wearing a fur coat. Cries of hypocrisy were everywhere and even some of her supporters had to concede her critics had a legitimate point.<br></li>
</ul>
<p>Post upstream is very insulting. My daughter also expects her dates to treat her well.she learns some from me. My husband always drops me near a restaurant and then parks. And he always paid my way on our dates. And <em>I</em> was the main wage earner when we bought our first home…so naturally I contributed more. </p>
<p>I’m not a princess…but I expect to be treated well. So what? </p>
<p>We upgraded- twice (meaning the setting/sidestones and the center stone.) The current setting is a bigger version of the original setting, and the stone is a bit bigger, though of equal quality. We looked into moving to an updated contemporary setting (from the gold channel setting) but I never followed through.</p>
<p>My H and I picked out our rings together.
Aside of someone having a family ring that they want to use, I never understood the " romance" behind picking out a ring for someone else.
Maybe I am just too particular?</p>
<p>The idea of wedding rings, and even engagement rings, may be old, but the idea that your engagement ring has to be a big beautiful diamond was created by DeBeers. DeBeers is a cartel, and controls most of the world’s diamonds. Diamonds from Canada, Namibia and Botswana are produced by DeBeers, just as much as the South African diamonds. South Africa “annexed” Namibia to control it’s diamond mines and only left in the early 1990’s. To me it seems like oil or like corn - you may try to buy organic or environmentally friendly products but they are almost all hopelessly intermingled. </p>
<p>Diamonds are so pretty though that most Americans know this and buy them anyway. And if we didn’t? We’d probably turn to something else just as seemingly precious and be controlled by Madison Avenue anyway. Felling cynical tonight… </p>
<p>The OP’s future DIL may have seen this, which doesn’t even bring in blood diamonds:</p>
I’m not that concerned about it but it seemed silly that it was sitting in a drawer in my dresser. His work made it dangerous sometimes for him to have anything on his hands, so he just took it off and it stayed off until now. :)</p>