Wanda felt like an outcast–didn’t speak the same language as the others, thought she didn’t belong. Many of the characters feel this way at some point, but in the end find that being with those they love is the way to feel useful and wanted, regardless of location. I liked Panova Mandelstam’s speech to Wanda:
And that also answers question #14, “In what ways were the demon and Wanda’s father alike?” Both eat up other people to fill their bellies, one literally and the other figuratively.
“Why did Wanda feel useless and unwanted in Vysnia?”
I never interpreted it as “unwanted” or even “useless” more just feeling out of place because it was such a different environment than she was used, than she was raised in - big city, different culture and language among the Jews, etc. Also, she had insecurities because of her home life and her father’s treatment of her. She felt worthwhile when she could be of use to someone. She didn’t feel valued for her other qualities.
I meant Wanda’s mother too! She seems to speak most directly to Stephon, but occasionally to others too.
I agree that Wanda had a great need to feel useful, and feared if she wasn’t useful, people wouldn’t want her around. The other women also needed to be useful. Miriam thrived on feeling like she was supporting the family. Irina wanted to be part of the men’s world of politics and ends up schooling the Tsar. Feeling valued is important to all of them.
It might not be a terribly happy match if the tsar’s chapter is any indication (chapter 20, p. 359). I was surprised he was given a turn at narrating, as the other narrators are all our team players: Miryem, Wanda, Irina, Magreta, Stepon. Even though the tsar refers to Chernobog in the third person, I hope he writes as a possessed person and not a normal one, because he comes across as petulant, sarcastic and generally unpleasant.
A chapter narrated by the Staryk King would have been interesting, but I guess that would have revealed too much of his personality (which was supposed to be somewhat mysterious until the end).
I felt like Irina was willing to embrace the tsar without the demon which surprised me as he didn’t seem to have redeeming qualities of his own except for good looks and power. Maybe Irina is a tad shallow, too - or just pragmatic? :-??
I vote pragmatic. And, she has limited choices.
In the beginning, she was one of my favorite characters, but her storyline didn’t develop as much as, say, Miryem’s. IMO
She seems to relish power and is good at managing politics and with a husband that just wants to draw and wear fancy clothes. I wonder how the tsar will adapt to not having the ability to create a new wardrobe through magic.
There are many folks who are happy with power and many not care much about “love” and other such items. Women generally didn’t have all that many options in those times.
Since the Tsar was possessed since before birth, his can one know the Tsar’s unpossessed personality? I’d think it would be forming and influenced by those around him, like Irina.
I see Irina as pragmatic. I don’t think she wanted power so much the ability to use her gifts. I think the Tsar might be redeemable, but I don’t see a love match there. I felt sorry for him, I love his line, “But she had a use for me, I’m so endlessly useful.” and later: “All I would ever be able to about it was what I’d ever been able to do about it: nothing. Nothing but to catch at those scraps of life when they came, and devour them, and lick m greasy fingers, and try to make life endurable when I had the chance.” He also seems to assume someone else might provide “stud services” other than himself. He sees himself as captive to Irina in this chapter at least. Of course he also makes it clear he cares nothing for Lithvas (understandably since he’s been a pawn to politics all his life.)
I agree with @Himom that the Tsar was possessed before birth. After the Chernobog left him, the Tsar started to see his wife as beautiful, so I really had hope for their relationship. He had never had a normal relationship with anyone his entire life up to that point. Remember, the Tsar always had new clothes because the Chernobog kept burning holes into his clothing.
One of my unsung heroines was the scullery-maid who took the bucket of sand and poured it on the Chernobog and snuffed the life out of him for good!! Strong women everywhere in the book!!
The quotes attributed to the Tsar earlier in the book are all when he was possessed, as were the cruel actions he performed.
It seems like he is born only AFTER the demon is killed. In my world, that makes him a bland slate.
Kind of some “Stockholm Syndrome” perhaps for these women wanting to stay with these men, particularly Miryam? There was never any sort of equal footing in the beginning. It’s not clear how things have/will evolve in the relationships.
I don’t know I see Miryem and Irina as having agency. I think the Staryk lord (I wish we knew his name!) intrigued her with his sense of honor and balance. But can he fix the relations between Staryk and our world? I don’t know. Clearly if some hungry kid kills a white animal out of hunger, I don’t think he deserves a death sentence!
While the quotes are from while he’s possessed, I think he has a mind separate from the demon, even if he can’t act on his thoughts. That said, once he’s free, he may find he thinks differently as well.
@HImom points out the unequal relationships between the women and their “kings” - a kind of Stockholm Syndrome at play. It bothered me less in Spinning Silver than it did in Uprooted. I actually like he-whose-name-we-don’t-know (Staryk King). He finds himself as much under Miryem’s power as vice versa which unsettles him at first. Uprooted though … one of my major complaints … Agnieszka and the Dragon … nope … I thought Stockholm Syndrome at the time. As I read this book, I noted the similarity again but think Novik skirted it this time barely. I wondered if I put a modern spin on the relationships in Novik’s books: perhaps in that time and place (i.e. her settings) many women made the best of the relationship given.
Between that and the raping and murdering, it’s clear the Staryks are governed by a harsh hand. Let’s hope that Miryem can instruct her new husband on how to temper justice with mercy.
The prohibition on hunting animals in the Staryk kingdom reminded me of Sherwood Forest. The tsar’s kingdom was no better – I recall a passage about neighbors who are severely punished for trying to keep the wood from a fallen tree. Both instances remind me of Sherwood Forest, and Robin Hood being outlawed for poaching a deer (there’s a little Hunger Games in there as well). It all has a factual basis, so I guess “kingdoms”, be they in the real world or the fantasy one, are just bad news:
Boy, if Miryem hadn’t “proved herself” with her problem solving skills, what would have been her fate?
Re: Irina. I was confused at the passage where the demon is no longer in possession of the tsar, and the Tsar gazes at her lovingly.
I wasn’t convinced it was gratitude & affection. I thought perhaps she had her Staryk jewelry on & he was under its spell as other people (men?) were. He didn’t “see it” when he was possessed.
I’d flip thru the pages to look for it, but I did audio.
^^^ Good point re the Tsar @Midwest67. I didn’t think of that.
@Mary13: I vaguely remember at some point someone tells Miryem - maybe the Staryk king or maybe one of the servants - that the Staryk who raid in the sunlit world shouldn’t - something along the lines of bad men exist in both worlds. The terrorizing and raiding aren’t condoned. Now when the Staryk King goes after Wanda’s brother, well, Wanda’s brother had stolen from him - at least by the King’s laws.
In Uprooted the heroine was only 17 when “chosen” by the wizard. She was an underage minor. In Spinning Silver, the women are also young but can’t recall their ages.
I know being kidnapped or held makes for drama but that is really not a good way to start a loving relationship, especially when the woman is threatened with death if she fails to perform as directed.
^^ Yeah but underage minor is a modern concept. In medieval times what we consider underage was considered “of age.” I agree with you though, particularly in Uprooted. I didn’t like the Dragon (a man, not beast) and felt the disparity in age and power. I didn’t feel it as much in Spinning Silver. Miryem holds her own oftentimes: she changes her crown to gold and helps place it on her head for example.
Still, the women aren’t given much choice initially in any of their situations—comply or die and likely cause dire consequences for your loved ones. Yes, the women all did show strength, cunning and amazing skills in Uprooted and Spinning Silver, but the huge power disparity and dire threats do not make for sound relationships.
The males were nowhere near in age to the females—dragon was over 100 years old, Staryk King was who knows how old. The tzar wasn’t terribly old but there was still a huge power differential—he dictated whether she could see her old nurse and pretty much everything. Irina only had refuge by praying and the mirrors and similar.
Both male “heroes” in Spinning Silver threatened to destroy their mates initially.
I got a little bogged down and bored once the demon (which reminded me of the smoke monster from “Lost”) took center stage and finished the book late. I’m not usually a fantasy reader, so I appreciated expanding my horizons. I enjoyed the beginning a lot, the ending not so much. Though I agree with @jollymama that it would make a great movie!
Back on page 277 Irina had said to him:
I think the author is telling us that the tsar has changed, and is no longer a fool. (Although I don’t actually buy it.)
I didn’t think the mother of Wanda and her brothers had literally become a tree. To me it was just a metaphor, because she was buried at the tree. People often visit cemeteries and have “conversations” with loved ones, so I thought the mother’s words were imagined speech. Maybe that’s not how the author intended it, but it worked better for me that way. 