Starting EC’s summer going into junior year too late for Ivy?

Applying to College
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Hello! I am currently a sophomore in HS / rising junior. I am now starting to focus more on building my resume for college aps. My first two years however were extremely busy for me, as they were my first two years doing club volleyball at a national level. This meant practice almost 6 hours a week and constant traveling for tournaments. I did not have time to do any extracurriculars.

To make up for lost time, I plan on getting an internship this summer and starting a passion project. I also plan to join a club during my junior year, and hopefully rise up to the ranks of a leadership position before my senior year.

My top schools are

  1. Columbia
  2. Georgetown
  3. USC
  4. Yale
  5. Northeastern
  6. NYU
  7. UC Berkeley

And more….but you get the gist, I just want to go to a top school! :joy:

So my question is, Is it too late for me to start these ECS and passion projects now in order to get into Ivies and Top schools? On my college aps I would basically have only 2 years of ecs, and I’m scared that will jeopardize my application. I plan on doing a passion project that will, hopefully, really make me stand out though. All in all, I just don’t want colleges questioning why I only have two years of ecs. However, I plan on starting these ecs THIS summer so hopefully that will count for something :pray:.

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National-level volleyball is an EC. If you continue jr/sr year it’ll be seen as such and they’ll understand you can’t do much more. Some D3 colleges may even give you a boost in admission if the coach recommends you (you can reach out to D3 coaches even now.)

Rather than a “passion project” - unless you have evidence that passion developed well before Jr year- you’d be better off finding a job and keeping it. Any job (stocking shelves, fast food restaurant…) will do as long as you keep at it, don’t quit, learn and are able to reflect upon the experience.

Unless you are a CA resident, cross out UC Berkeley. If you are a CA resident, start calculating your UC capped and uncapped GPAs jr year at this time of year and not before then - until then, it’s too early to know whether you can think about UCs (except Merced).

The hardest colleges to find are the likely ones - because they need to share essential characteristics with your dream schools but also need to be affordable. Finding 2 that you like is hard work.
For instance, if you like columbia for its core curriculum, you can look into St John’s at Annapolis.
If you like Jesuit/Catholic universities, Fordham and UScranton are 2 possibilities.
If you like Northeastern’s co-ops, UCincinnati pioneered this approach and has a solid Honors college.
Once you start identifying key characteristics people on CC can tell what colleges share similar characteristics without rejecting 90+% applicants.

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Are you recruitable for volleyball and do you want to play in college? At many schools you will get more of a boost from being a recruited athlete than for any “passion” project (and how much of a passion can something be if you have to make it up to appeal to colleges). You are still very early in the process - continue to do as well as possible in school as that is still the most important aspect of your application. And start to look at schools that aren’t hyper selective. Even students with perfect grades/high scores and outstanding ECs are routinely rejected at those schools so it is very important to have a balanced list instead of compiling a list of high reach schools which could lead to disappointment.

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To be very blunt, I don’t think there is any sort of EC formula the most selective colleges are looking for, and I think attempts to follow the sorts of formulas that are typically passed around by peers and families on and off social media are more likely to actually be counterproductive than helpful. Instead, your best bet is to do a small handful of things you truly enjoy and/or find very meaningful, with energy and dedication.

Indeed, the whole idea of turning the concept of a “passion project” into a formulaic box to check is on some level truly absurd. The original point was supposed to be if you ARE really passionate about something but there are not pre-existing activities at your school or in your community conducive to acting on that passion, then you can do something self-designed instead. But then some people turned that into the idea that you should start with the goal of doing a “passion project” because it will look good to colleges, and then you get a bunch of kids asking other kids what to do for a passion project because they are not really passionate about anything suitable.

OK, so the helpful understanding is you have all sorts of different options for how to spend your non-academic time depending on what you truly find enjoyable and meaningful. But you should be choosing among those many things based on what you truly find enjoyable and meaningful, not because you heard they will look good to colleges.

I would also distinguish the very most selective colleges from other very selective, but not that selective, colleges.

Like, suppose your passion is a performing art, and you are applying with that as your main EC, implicitly suggesting you will want to continue that at a high level in college–maybe not a major, but maybe a minor and wanting to participate in the top level activities at that college.

Well, at many Ivies, the truth is the kids who end up doing that stuff have like conservatory-level talent/ability. So it might be a problem trying to get into Yale, say, as a performing arts kids if you are not actually at that level.

But very quickly that sort of thing fades, and many excellent research universities and liberal arts colleges and so on might be perfectly happy to just see you have a normal amount of talent for your performing art.

And again, the problem is people see this and then start trying to kill themselves to reach that level of accomplishment in something, anything, to try to get into a college like Yale. And maybe it will work, but maybe it won’t, because it is truly hard to do that, and most smart, hard-working, talented kids who try fail anyway.

So the far healthier thing to do is again just do what you really enjoy and find meaningful with energy and dedication. If you end up one of those rare talents, maybe it will help you get into a Yale. If not, but you still do reasonably well, maybe it will help you get into a Georgetown. Or so on. But regardless, you will have a great childhood and then go to a great college, which should be the goal.

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Even if you were to become the editor of the yearbook and the president of the student council, it would make little difference. Heads of clubs are a dime a dozen.

Are you a good enough volleyball player that you could become a recruited athlete? Honestly, this is by far your best route into a highly selective colleges, because if the coach wants you, you only need to pass an academic pre-read, which is a far lower bar than admission on your academic merits.

If this doesn’t look possible for you, then the thing to do is to do what you love, and do it to the max. Only continue playing volleyball if you enjoy it - colleges won’t look at your application and say, “Oh, but this one played volleyball for four years!” Look beyond school! Honestly, ECs that you pursue outside of the tiny pond of school can look a lot more impressive than clawing your way to the top of a school club. You are interested in politics? Work on a campaign this summer and through the election, or work in voter registration. You’re interested in healthcare? Volunteer for a migrant clinic, or a homeless clinic this summer. Going outside the high school walls for your EC interest demonstrates maturity, the courage and initiative to engage with the outside, real world.

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Volleyball is a great EC and it sounds like that is your passion. Is there anything additional you can do with volleyball? Start a team of young kids and teach them? Organize a volleyball tournament for charity? That would be much more believable than something you start doing out of the blue and call a passion.

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OP- I’ve posted this before on CC but I’ll post it for you since I think you’ll find it instructive.

Local HS kid-- noticed VERY long lines at the local food pantry during Covid. Parents in all kinds of weather with their kids, waiting patiently, sometimes for hours, to get the box of food sitting out on the sidewalk, contactless pickup.

He realized this was a problem he knew how to solve. He made a simple website with a signup function (like any number of signups you’ve seen- “Take them a Meal” or other community volunteer efforts) and set up virtual meetings with the folks who run the food pantry to explain the problem AND the solution. They LOVED IT. Everyone got a 15 minute window-- show up, your package is ready. No more standing on line, getting wet, cranky children…

So they implemented it immediately-- and for almost everyone it was fantastic. There were a few recipients (mostly elderly) who did not have internet enabled phones or computers, so the social workers who handled their referrals logged on for them and then told them when their pickup time was.

But the rest of the story… the kid realized that he could solve another problem that they didn’t even know they had- which was the trucks and vans idling as they waiting for their turn to unload the pallets of donated food. The drivers wasted a LOT of time sitting in the driveway or by the loading dock, and the kid figured that if the grocery stores and restaurants and food manufacturers saw how efficient the unloading process was, they’d be encouraged to donate MORE- more eggs, more cans of creamed corn, more unsold loaves of bread at the end of the day.

That was a slightly more complicated technology problem to solve (he had to integrate his signups with the software the larger donors were already using to track their drivers use of the delivery vans and trucks) but he figured it out after more meetings and more persuasion and more “we can fix this” attitude.

THAT’S a passion project. See a problem, solve the problem. I’m pretty sure that if the kid had woken up one day sophomore year and said “Gee, I need a passion project so I can get into college” he’d still be sitting at his kitchen table.

What’s the moral of the story? You do you. You don’t NEED a passion project-- you need to be the best version of yourself that you can be. If that means coaching a peewee league volleyball team this summer- great. If that means organizing the archives of your local historical society- great. If that means scooping ice cream or being a lifeguard or folding sweaters at Old Navy to learn what it means to have a job and be responsible and show up and be respectful to your boss even if you think he’s a moron- great.

You do you. There will be a great college out there for you.

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I respectfully disagree. This is a person who is finishing sophomore year. It is totally fine for them to explore; in fact, this is absolutely the time to explore their interests, rather than feel that they must go long and deep on their sport in an attempt to convince colleges that they have “found their passion”. Of course, if they’re good enough to get recruited, that is a way in. And if it truly IS their passion, if their dream is to become a phys Ed teacher, or to work in sports-adjacent professions, sure. But they show no indication of that. They have played club volleyball, and they want to get into a good college. That doesn’t mean that they need to broaden and deepen their interest in volleyball, as opposed to exploring other interests.

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I agree they should feel no obligation to continue with volleyball, but I also think there can be an important distinction between truly exploring interests and trying to check boxes based on some formulaic “what colleges want to see” theory.

I also think in terms of timing, toward the end of sophomore year is ideally more toward the end of the prime exploration phase. Not that I would ever say kids have to follow a timing formula either, but the basic thing people should be aware of is that junior year will be the last year of actual activity experiences and outcomes that automatically get onto college applications, and when applying senior activities are mostly just prospective, although sometimes you can say if you will have a leadership position. Of course people do updates and such, but it is always unclear how much all that really matters once you have submitted your applications.

OK, so if the OP is tired of volleyball and wants to start new things as a junior, that is fine. And if the OP is really unsure what they want to do instead and so wants to try a bunch of things as a junior, that is also fine.

But I would discourage the OP from doing a lot of things as a junior just because that would check the most boxes, aka “build a resume” for college applications. Indeed if (but only if) the OP already had a couple non-volleyball things they really wanted to do for their own sake, I would encourage the OP to dive into those rather than trying to check as many boxes as possible.

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Club volleyball is a big home run.

Make no mistake - it’s great you have goals and desires but grades, test scores and the like are the main barrier.

Follow your passions. Be the best you that you can be.

Do things for you; not to get into college - i.e don’t try to game the system. Enjoy your life and pursue what YOU want.

And things will turn out fine.

You need quality (club volleyball), not quantity.

To answer your question - too late or not, you’ll never know. When you get into a school or don’t, you don’t know why - so don’t worry. Simply put your best foot forward, and when the time comes you need a balanced list (including an assured and affordable admit which you don’t have listed). If you have that and apply to all these, then you know you’re going somewhere. And it will all work itself out.

Good luck.

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Hi everyone, thank you all for the replies and advice! I just wanted to give more info about me that I seemed to leave out….maybe that would help with giving more advice? I am an above average student. I’m not just a volleyball player. I excel pretty well in school. I’ve been taking all honors courses since freshman year, this year I took Apush, and next year I’ll be taking AP Physics, AP capstone, AP lang, APUSH 2, and double mathing in Geometry and Pre-Calc. However I do fully understand that the schools I want to get into accept students that are either just like me, or even better. As for the passion project, I have tons of ideas that I actually like. I’m not just doing this because it would look good on my application. I think I’m a pretty good writer, my teachers have always commended me on such. I plan on writing for Malala Fund, and writing a research paper on a topic I’ve been interested in since forever. I am going to apply to other schools, not just the ones I’ve listed, however, those are my top schools that I am determined to at least TRY and get into.

I hope this information can further help with advising my question. And thank you all for the advice you’ve already given, I’m taking account of all of them.

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From my note immediately above - your last note doesn’t change anything.

Good luck

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You can do these things but understand they’re unlikely to move the needle much. It all depends on what it is you do and what its impact is.
If you research a topic of interest and write a paper about it, cool, but… no difference.
If Jr year as part of AP stats or AP research you learn&use a statistical modelling tool to analyze data you gathered over the summer on a small but topical problem in your town, then you have the beginning of sth that may move the needle.

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Here is a also a list of things I’ve been wanting to do since freshman year -

  • Research Paper on Ebonics, Ideology behind “white washed”, and Contemporary Racism - Publish it online and in school paper.
  • Building homes for the homeless
  • Pod Cast
  • Poetry book
  • Create a magazine (fashion)
  • form a Ted-Ed Club at my school with a teacher

(Just trying to give as much info as possible lol)

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For a student with average excellent grades, rigor, and, I will guess, a decent SAT score, you should list schools like U Richmond, College of Holy Cross, or Macalester as reaches. Most of the schools you listed are super reaches, and more realistically, super duper infinite reaches with no hook.
If you can play volleyball, that is your hook. If you can’t, then you need to have realistic expectations.
If you are full pay, that would help with some schools. Northeastern is the only school on your list that, to me, average, excellent, nonhooked kids get in with some regularity.

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These are all fine ECs, so do the ones that you most want to do. None of them are likely to carry more weight than club volleyball in an admissions decision. Are you still playing club volleyball? If so, do you want to play in college/pursue recruitment?

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Why? And what is a “top school” according to you?

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The research paper sounds like a cool Sr year project for an independent study period (or EE for IBD) but you’d need to take an intro to linguistics and intro to sociology or African American studies class through dual enrollment, then take Sociolinguistics, before your paper can be of any value (whether for college admissions or the wider public) though if you worked on it on your own you’d learn something. Just learning how to do a Review of Literature would be useful.

You can join Habitat for Humanity for sure and ask your closest shelter how you can help.

Depending on how good you are, volleyball would help with colleges like Tufts, Bowdoin, Babson, Smith, Case Western, URochester, WashU, St Olaf, Pitzer.
(Look them up if you haven’t heard of them - all are very to highly selective .)

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OP- as Nike says- “just do it”.

My suspicion is that if you really and truly wanted to build homes for the homeless (which is hard-- you need actual skills in carpentry, electrical, plumbing, setting concrete, etc. OR finding people who are willing to teach you) you’d ALREADY have done it. You’d have signed up for a crew already, you’d be on your way to learning how to install a toilet or hook up a kitchen sink. If you know how to do those things already-- fantastic- go online, find a Habitat crew, volunteer- and there you are!

Ditto the other things you’ve mentioned. None of these things require a college degree, special equipment (or at least equipment you can’t borrow somewhere in your community) or a lot of money. So none of these things is “too late”-- just do it!

So it’s either one or the other- you want to do these things out of genuine interest and passion (in which case- start TODAY!) or you think they are going to help you get into an Ivy or other competitive type college-- in which case I understand your hesitation to just get going since you need to figure out which of these is “the best” to meet your goal.

Trust me- none of them is “the best”. But you need to start! Everyone wants to help the homeless. But there’s a difference between the wanting and the doing.

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Yes I do still play club! I’m planning on playing until my senior year, and yes I do also want to play in college! I’m just figuring out what schools I would want to go to incase I choose not to play in college for some reason!

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