Tattoos- your thoughts on them

eastcoascrazy · May 20, 2014, 2:54am

“but I can’t imagine being so afraid of regretting something 30 years down the road that I won’t even try. We never know what is around the next corner for us. I don’t regret my two tattoos, and when I am old and they are wrinkled, I will look back with a smile at the way I wanted to step out of my comfortable” - Sseamom

Well, I’m not particularly religious, but I do happen to believe that my body is a temple. That it is perfect, just as it is. I don’t even have pierced ears. It doesn’t need a tattoo, or a piercing, or a surgically enhanced nose, or improved boobs.

That doesn’t mean a thing in terms of your own body or your desire for tattoos.

eastcoascrazy · May 20, 2014, 2:57am

An interesting amount of judging coming from those who have chosen to tattoo towards those of us who choose not to tattoo.

cosmicfish · May 20, 2014, 3:01am

For what do you feel we have judged you?

Niquii77 · May 20, 2014, 3:01am

Please share your observances, eastcoast.

eastcoascrazy · May 20, 2014, 3:14am

Judgmental:

"Unfortunately, eastcoastcrazy, you lost me there.

Is regret an end all be all? Are you not able to regret a facet of a decision but yet still overall enjoy it? I know some people with tattoos appreciate the fact that they’re able to look back at their tattoo and think of where they were mentally, physically, or emotionally at that moment." Niquii77

“but I can’t imagine being so afraid of regretting something 30 years down the road that I won’t even try. We never know what is around the next corner for us. I don’t regret my two tattoos, and when I am old and they are wrinkled, I will look back with a smile at the way I wanted to step out of my comfortable” - Sseamom

cosmicfish · May 20, 2014, 3:19am

I do not believe the purpose of either of those statements was to judge, but rather to offer a counterpoint, a response to your own statements where you indicated how you felt where those posters could tell how they felt. If they are judgmental, are not your own posts equally so?

Niquii77 · May 20, 2014, 3:24am

You lost me, again, eastcoast. It was a question, not a judgement. How was I judgmental.

sseamom · May 20, 2014, 3:44am

Cosmic caught onto exactly what I was saying. I think most of us, most of the time, about most things, do what we feel is the right thing to do at THAT POINT in our lives. I don’t choose my furniture, my decor, my car, my hairstyle, or my clothes with a look towards 30 years down the road. I meant it when I said that I cannot imagine ME choosing to do or not do something because I was afraid of what it would mean 30 years from now, whether about clothes or jobs or kids. We all really only live in the moment.

I look back 30 years and I might shake my head at my hairstyle or clothing and even my ex and wonder what I was thinking. But I am GLAD I met my ex and married him because otherwise I wouldn’t have my older kids. I’m happy that at one time I was slim and young and felt brave enough to wear that pink polka-dotted dress that turned a few heads. I’m glad I had so much more hair and had a chance to wear it all 80’s style over the top. But I don’t regret any of it. And I don’t regret my tattoos. They were part of who I was then. I’m glad I didn’t think of my 55-year-old self and put the brakes on who I was at 25.

eastcoascrazy · May 20, 2014, 3:47am

Well, I gave some reasons why I, personally, wouldn’t choose to get a tattoo, while acknowledging my understanding of why other people might want one. I said that I wouldn’t get one because I wonder about regretting it one day.

What I got in return were the following statements: “but I can’t imagine being so afraid of regretting something 30 years down the road that I won’t even try. We never know what is around the next corner for us…”

And "Is regret an end all be all? Are you not able to regret a facet of a decision but yet still overall enjoy it? "

Sounds a bit judgemental to me.

I choose not to add ink to my skin. I don’t care what you do to your own skin.

Niquii77 · May 20, 2014, 3:58am

Couldn’t have said it better myself, sseamom. Like, really, I couldn’t have. I don’t have my tattoo as of yet nor the years of life that has gone by with the tattoo. I look forward to the time I’m able to look back on daring moments and not feel a rushing wave of embarrassment. :))

cosmicfish · May 20, 2014, 4:17am

You had previously said:

You stated that those things were reflections of character in a manner that certainly did not sound like you meant good character, and then stated that they would be an “unfortunate choice” even as you pondered if one would ever realize it. Those statements sound no less judgmental than the ones you complained about.

Nonetheless, it is not my intention to judge you. It is your skin, your body, and what you do to it is your own business. I try to judge people only by what good they do for others, and what unnecessary harm they do to others.

And if that is what you truly mean, I do not think that the tattooed* will give you any trouble. The issue that I have is that some people on here DO care, to the point that they see tattoos as a reason to deny people employment and otherwise treat them as “less” than an untattooed person. And that is harm, and that is something I have a problem with, whether it is levied on the tattooed or any other group defined by superficial features rather than behaviors.

**: As a group, that is. Every group has jerks, can’t avoid that entirely. *

eastcoascrazy · May 20, 2014, 10:00am

Cosmicfish, good points. I didn’t say it was a sign of “good” or “bad” character, just that it is a sign of character.

Isn’t the ability to think about the future, something we hope our children learn to do? It seems that we spend a lot of time here on CC discussing our children and their lack of careful thought about how their futures will be affected by their actions today. So I don’t believe that me saying that, for me, part of the reason I wouldn’t choose to get a tattoo is because a tattoo is permanent, and that my thought process makes me personally wonder about whether I would like it in ten or twenty years. That doesn’t mean I don’t take any chances in life. And it doesn’t mean that I think anyone else should do the same thing.

Pizzagirl · May 20, 2014, 12:04pm

“The issue that I have is that some people on here DO care, to the point that they see tattoos as a reason to deny people employment and otherwise treat them as “less” than an untattooed person. And that is harm, and that is something I have a problem with, whether it is levied on the tattooed or any other group defined by superficial features rather than behaviors.”

So, you’re hiring cheetah-print-lady (who showed up in that outfit to the interview) to be your receptionist, right? How she presents herself doesn’t provide any insight whatsoever into anything about her judgment, which is part of her character?

docmom · May 20, 2014, 12:32pm

I honestly don’t see why someone would (a) judge me based on my having tattoos and then (b) think that this was a GOOD thing to do. Does my having tattoos harm you in any way? Does it mean that I am incapable of being intelligent, or polite, or professional?

No. But a tat in a non-covered place does mean you’re wanting to tell everyone something about yourself.

I am not concerned about how my tattoos look when I get older. When my skin is paper-thin, liver-spotted, and wrinkled, the fact that my tattoos are hard to read will be the least of my concerns. I will have enjoyed them for a long time by that point, and will not regret that people can no longer tell what they are.

Can I please get one of your crystal balls? I want to know how I’M going to feel about all my current decisions 30 years down the road.

I am not concerned that I will someday regret the content of my tattoos, because my tattoos were not selected solely for aesthetics. They represent my family, my profession, friends who are no longer with me, and there is no point where I will be ashamed of those or having marked them on my skin. And if at this point I did get a tattoo for aesthetic purposes, well, it would hardly be a big risk.

So it’s time to ask the question: why did you get them? What is the reasoning for putting something permanent on your body?

I am not concerned that they will impede my career. I have placed my tattoos so that they are covered under business wear, but that is just for customers - my employer knows about them and has no problem with them. And if they DID have a problem with them, then I would find another employer and make THEM money.

So…you are concerned they will impede your career. Otherwise you wouldn’t bother covering them for your customers.

I am not concerned that people will think less of me because I have tattoos. I am an educated professional, married, with good kids, good friends, and a good life. If someone sees all that and thinks “Whoa, he has tattoos, he has character flaws!” then that is a person whose opinion I do not care about.

This issue of defining character - there are large character flaws and small ones. So no, not defining your character but definitely getting the message you’re up for sending. Really, thank you for the information. I have my own character flaws and I’m just as happy to share those with the people I want rather than to anyone on the street. But don’t think you’re not sending a message about your own judgment with your tattoos.

I have definitely seen people with tattoos they regret, but I have yet to see ANY decision that the average person can make without some percentage regretting their choice. Some people regret getting a tattoo, or getting married, or taking a given job, or moving, or eating sushi, or joining the military, or… anything. The fact that some regret does not mean that everyone does, and if you go your whole life without regretting getting a tattoo, why would it have ever been a wrong decision?

Nothing in that list except tattoos is permanent.

Now, if you do not like the aesthetic of tattoos, or do not think they are worth the price, or cannot stand the idea of the pain, or cannot think of anything you would want to immortalize like that, then that is 100% fine! Don’t get one! I don’t personally like the aesthetic of ear gauges and would never do it… but I do not think that doing so is a character flaw, I simply go my life without getting gauges! I don’t judge people based on their decisions unless those decisions hurt people, and I have yet to see someone get hurt by someone else getting a tattoo. On the other hand, I would think poorly of someone who saw a good person and then denied them opportunities just because they have a tattoo, or a piercing, or a cheap suit.

Again with the character flaw thing. No one is saying they don’t like people with tattoos and in fact I bet all of us have lots of people we hang out with that have gotten them. We just don’t have to wait to get to know them before knowing about one or two of their judgment issues because they’ve chosen to give us a visual on that.

And, finally, I challenge every one of you who say you don’t judge people on their looks to spend the next week or two observing your own instant judgments of others based on how they look, what they wear, etc. Or that when you buy clothes you’re not thinking about what you want to project with them. I don’t buy it although if it makes you feel like you’re of a better ilk than the rest of humanity, go ahead.

Niquii77 · May 20, 2014, 12:49pm

Why?

Who has said they don’t judge people? Honest question. I must’ve missed the post.

To be honest, this thread makes me want my tattoo even more just seeing how much those who do have them appreciate them.

cosmicfish · May 20, 2014, 12:57pm

Absolutely.

I believe the poster in question was applying the same logic they had seen earlier from people in the anti-tattoo crowd, perhaps yourself specifically, perhaps not. It is about generalization. One person looks at a decision to get tattoos as indicative of a general lack of character or foresight or judgment. Another person looks at an absolute refusal to get tattoos based on concerns about the future as indicative of a general unwillingness to take chances. I do not subscribe to either of those absolutes, because I think they oversimplify a lot of things, but I think a lot of generalization has been going on here.

cosmicfish · May 20, 2014, 1:39pm

Your original sighting of this woman was not in an interview, nor in any professional context. As I have already said, I would NOT hire her if she arrived to an interview dressed as described, but I would try not to hold it against her if I saw her in a social setting dressed as described and then saw her at the interview in professional attire.

I separate judgment from character - judgment is your ability to arrive at the “right” course of action, character is your ability or willingness to follow through with it. You can arrive at a “wrong” course of action either by a failure in judgment (i.e., not knowing what to do) or by a failure in character (i.e., choosing, for some reason, to go “wrong”). Judgment is often highly variable dependent on the circumstances, character is not. You often see people who are professional competent but personally a wreck, and vice versa - not always for lack of character, but because they are only able to identify the right thing to do in certain areas.

This is why I have given you the answers I have given you on this. You are presenting a woman in one scenario and generalizing to another entirely different scenario, and presuming that behavior in the first indicates behavior in the second. I see no reason to assume that. If I saw this woman dressed as described at a school event, I would question her judgment in parenting because I believe that presenting herself in a highly sexualized manner around children is not a healthy thing for them, and I think parents should know that. But I would not then assume that she would show up to work or an interview dressed in that same manner - why would I?

cosmicfish · May 20, 2014, 2:04pm

Sometimes yes, sometimes no. A tattoo is a message, and some messages are meant for other people while other messages are meant only for a few or even just for yourself. Sometimes a tattoo is exposed simply because the person did not feel a need to hide it. Sometimes they are deliberately trying to send a message to everyone who can see it. There are lots of other possibilities.

I am not denying that there is risk in everything, as there definitely is, but that does not mean that I need either be paralyzed by the decision or act like the me of the future is some alien completely detached from my present self.

Not to go into all of them, but my first tattoo was to commemorate the best friend I ever had, the best man at my wedding, who died quite suddenly - I wanted to wake up every morning and see a reminder of all that he did for me in my life. My second tattoo was during a hard period for me professionally (I was actually very sick and did not at the time know it), and was again to serve as a reminder of what I was doing and what I was working toward. And after you have a couple of tattoos, the additional negative consequence of each subsequent tattoo winds up being pretty small.

Haven’t you ever heard “the customer is always right”? Customers are not required to act in a professional manner, and are often accommodated in a manner that would never be tolerated in coworkers, superiors, or subordinates. I have never had a job where I was expected to interact with coworkers in the same manner as I had to interact with customers. Have you?

And what message is that? If you do not think that the message is in part dependent on the recipient and on the environment then you do not understand how communication works.

Many of the items in that list are effectively as permanent as a tattoo. A tattoo can be removed or covered, or at least beaten down to the point where it is no longer obvious as a tattoo, and the expense of doing so is no more painful or pricy than getting out of an ill-advised marriage or move or career decision. I will always have a tattoo, or at least the remnants of one. I will always have my marriage, or at least the remnants of it. And if I cannot make decisions with the presumption that they will always for me be a good idea, then it certainly seems that many of the items I mentioned would be unacceptable risks.

For the sake of clarity, what are these “judgment issues”? If I die happy with my tattoos, did I exercise good judgment or bad? What crystal ball do you have that allows you to know the cost/benefit ratio of my tattoos across my life, and why would you presume that your crystal ball is better than my own in this regard?

There has been a lot of comments about “judgment issues” and “character” that seem to be presented in a negative manner, with said presenters then claiming that they meant “good OR bad”, so let’s drop the ambiguity. I have tattoos. Not knowing anything else about them, what judgment/character problem(s) does their existence indicate?

HarvestMoon1 · May 20, 2014, 3:26pm

I struggle with the whole concept of tattooing. To me in essence it is an “advertisement”. Big or small it still says I want people to KNOW something about me. We all have things in life that mean a great deal to us - hobbies, spiritual beliefs, children, spouses, boyfriends, girlfriends and on and on. But i am content with feeling that personal meaning. For me, it would almost diminish or cheapen it to “advertise” it.

docmom · May 20, 2014, 3:31pm

A photo on your bedside table serves capably as a reminder of a person you loved. There are many, many non-body marring ways to honor someone. Donating the tattoo money to their favorite charity is one that comes to mind. Notes are good reminders to ourselves - some taped to the bathroom mirror, or on our homepage on our phone. My mantra was so important to me and got repeated in my head so often that I don’t need notes to remember it. That’s how most people learn and integrate lessons of import.

You said you knew how you would feel about your tattoos when you were older. You can’t possibly predict that.

A tattoo in a non-covered area is a message you want sent to everyone.

Even if “the customer is always right” you still have to cover your tattoos so they don’t impede your career - they absolutely can affect YOUR particular career or you wouldn’t cover them.

The judgment issues are that, imho, people who get tattoos are at least a tad rash and immature at best and attention seeking at worst. The kid with the purple mohawk? Attention seeking. Me in a killer dress? Attention seeking. You with tattoos that show? Attention seeking (and in a permanent, can’t go back to your original skin way). It’s the permanence of tattoos that makes them anything of an issue. If they faded to nothing after a year, this thread wouldn’t exist.

I really don’t care if you or anyone else gets them. I don’t care what anyone else really does in their own personal lives. But don’t expect people to not make judgments about you for having them. That certainly had to be part of your careful decision-making process to get them in the first place, right? But maybe not, or you wouldn’t be trying to rationalize that part of the argument away so thoroughly now.

Tattoos- your thoughts on them

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