<p>Well, that’s very nice in theory but we live in reality. And, as everyone has already agreed. Everyone judges.</p>
<p>No one called anyone a “fool” or any other name. You just created something out of thin air to try to make a point. That’s a tad disingenuous, although every one of us acts foolish at times. But no one said that here.</p>
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I think that is a terrible thing to say. Everyone hurts people, and we should just be okay with that?</p>
<p>Yes, everyone judges. But that doesn’t mean that we cannot recognize that hurting people without cause is a bad thing that we should call a bad thing and try to reduce?</p>
<p>I am curious, those who think that “everyone judges” and that the argument stops there - do you have a priest, or minister, or rabbi, or imam, or ANYONE you look to for spiritual guidance? Have you broached this idea with them? What do/would they say about judging other people?</p>
<p>We are all imperfect, that does not mean we should either ignore or revel in our imperfections, it means we should be aware of our imperfections and try to be better.</p>
<p>“Yes, it does matter. Judging people on a fraction of their whole and then taking some negative action based on that fraction hurts them and diminishes you, and that always matters.” Amen to that.</p>
<p>Sure we all judge. But let it be you or your child judged on the very thing above - “a fraction of their whole” - and see if you might find yourself consciously being less judgemental. Be it their tatoo, their shaved head, their sexuality - whatever. Sometimes you have to live being judged before you can see the light in judging others - on a fraction of their whole. </p>
<p>I’m going to be glass half full and say “thanks” to this thread - I vow to look at every person I see with a tatoo and look for something else beyond that tatoo to form an opinion about them. Because falling into the group of people judging as some people here seem to do, is NOT a place I want to be. </p>
<p>Interesting twisting of my point. </p>
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How was your point twisted? Do you disagree with what I said?</p>
<p>One more time. Everyone judges. So, the person who needs every possible advantage would do well to conform. We all know this and do it in one way or another. It’s just smart unless you are uber-amazing or uber-rich. Chances are very good that the hiring official who hates tattoos is not going to overlook this when interviewing a candidate with a sleeve or neck tattoo. Some may say, “Well, I didn’t want to work there anyway.” Fine. If they are so lucky as to have other options. You can decide not to judge and that’s great but as I said I live in reality over here. Deciding not to judge because it not nice doesn’t change the fact that people are always going to be judged on their appearance. Much of our outward appearance is a choice.</p>
<p>We should all remember that a person may have a sensible reason for doing something that looks really stupid from the outside.</p>
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Ah, I see what you are saying here, but it is only half the message. You are saying “protect yourself from being attacked” and that is great, but I am saying “stop attacking other people” and I think that is just as important.</p>
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We should also remember that in general “stupid” and “sensible” are both highly subjective terms.</p>
<p>Right. It’s the only half you can do anything about. Although, I do agree a world with no attackers would be lovely.</p>
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Aaaaaaand we disagree again.</p>
<p>You, and many, many others on here have said that “everyone judges”. Some seem to delight in it. If everyone judges then everyone can work on judging people less, particularly in the most damaging ways.</p>
<p>This is not like rape, where there is a pretty clear delineation between victims and perpetrators. If “everyone judges” then we are ALL victims and ALL perpetrators, and that means BOTH sides of the problem are ours to do something about.</p>
<p>Note in particular that this part of the forums is as likely to include “people hiring” as “people being hired”, and that first group is the one that needs to hear the “judge less!” side more than anyone else.</p>
<p>While “stupid” and “sensible” are subjective, I think what needs to be emphasized in this thread that there is a sliding scale as to how many people think something is stupid or sensible. Let’s imagine that a person wants to get a tattoo to honor a deceased friend. Is this sensible? Well, some people would say it wouldn’t be sensible under any circumstances, but they would probably be in a minority. But how many people would agree that it was a sensible thing to do if you got the tattoo on your face? Not many, I imagine. As I’ve said before, I don’t like any tattoos. But I think tattoos on the face or neck are stupid in the vast majority of cases. I feel the same way about earlobes–I don’t really like pierced ears, but I reserve judgment of stupidity for gauged-out earlobes, at least in the vast majority of cases. I’d be fascinated to hear a sensible justification for having gauged-out earlobes.</p>
<p>What’s important anytime you do anything is what risks it entails and whether those risks, especially when they are for things that are important, are worth it. </p>
<p>My friend’s daughter is with a man with tattoos everywhere. He can’t get a job anywhere other than a tattoo parlor, in part because of them. Really limits him. My friend doesn’t like the sight of a heavily tattooed person, and doesn’t include him in a number of things where she does not like to see the tattoos. Came to a head last year, so the daughter doesn’t come by, and doesn’t get some financial assistance she could well use too. Heard they lost their apartment and are now in pretty dire straits Tattoos that important? I don’t think so, Had it been because of a religious, ethnic, racial prejudice, I think we’d look at it differently. For some reason, I don’t think this would be a discrimination movement that is going to rustle up much support. </p>
<p>Hunt I am in about 99% agreement with you, and the other 1% I probably agree with as well. You definitely need to understand the cost/benefit of what you are doing, and the cost of face/neck/hand tattoos or visible “non-traditional” piercings are going to be too high for the majority of people seeking employment that requires a college degree.</p>
<p>Saying someone is rash and immature for getting a tattoo is calling them a fool, IMO. It’s entirely different from saying someone who tattoos their face is foolish and limiting their lives in many ways. See the difference? </p>
<p>cptpfthehouse-you should have your friend tell her D and boyfriend to move to Seattle. Tattoos, gauges, multiple piercing, all are widely accepted here. Even mainstream, big box stores have heavily tattooed and gauge-wearing employees, and the city hosts a huge tattoo convention. There would be a lot of empty apartments if landlords discriminated against tattooed renters. Your friend is also cheating herself of her D’s company and probably long-term goodwill over aesthetics. I side with the D. </p>
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You might be surprised on this one. For the younger generations, this becomes more and more of an issue - “bigger” problems have largely been beaten down to the point where there is little movement, such modifications are steadily gaining in general acceptance, and they (and I) do not see why someone should make hiring or buying decisions based on appearance and not on substance.</p>
<p>Consider NASA’s Mohawk guy - a few decades ago, the staff at NASA were so homogenous that you couldn’t tell them apart without nametags. Now they have a controller with a Mohawk. The curator at my local museum has visible tattoos. The big new “hot” companies like Google don’t care about tattoos and piercings, and the young professionals who want to work there are asking other employers “why does this matter?”</p>
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Correct me if I am wrong, but body art is not a protected minority.</p>
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No it isn’t. That doesn’t mean the idea does not have support.</p>
<p>This is getting ridiculous. Judging on external presentation is done by EVERYONE. Even if we all tried very, very hard to stop judging people negatively by tattoos, there’s an infinite number of things that we still judge people on. And c’mon, many of them are things people practically BEG to be judged about. I would say getting a tattoo without realizing that this judging is going to happen is incredibly naive, which is why I say immature - to me only someone young and inexperienced would get a tattoo without realizing the later consequences and how it will be received by many as they go through life. If this weren’t true, why would tattoo removal be becoming such big business? This fact just shouts regret. </p>
<p>Look, if I wear a great new dress, I am very much hoping I will be judged well, but someone could just as easily judge me negatively for not liking the style, or hey, even for being blond. It’s happened. Whatever - I even make myself blond on purpose (not permanent of course) and I fully realize I’m going to have to prove with my conversations that I’m at least a tad intelligent because their first impression based on my blondness is that I’m not. </p>
<p>Conversely, if I wear sweats to something I shouldn’t (and it’s happened) I am, appropriately, judged negatively as having bad judgment or not caring about the event enough to dress for it. If I go to the store looking pretty haggard (also happens waaay too much) people who don’t know me make judgments about me based on that. Ever gotten better service in retail when you’re dressed to the nines? Me too. Wonder why. </p>
<p>No one is saying anyone is a bad human being if they have tattoos. We’re saying they’re incredibly permanent and you can never get your original skin back if you change your mind and that we get that you’re sending a message with them (whether it’s the message you intend or not, it’s there, just like being blonde). If that’s “judging” so be it, just don’t be hypocritical and think you don’t judge people by external appearances. No one is that perfect. Talk about self-righteous.</p>