<p>Thank you, Hunt. It’s almost like some people want others to “come down” to what they personally can / can’t afford. I couldn’t afford to buy 2 brand new cars for my twins when they became of driving age. Other people undoubtedly can. Great – good for them! I hope they all enjoy it. I think it’s small-minded to care about how other people enjoy their good fortune. If it’s all honestly earned, I don’t see the problem. </p>
<p>I think there is envy that manifests itself in disdain. I know, myself, at the times when I have been disdainful of the spending that goes on with some members of H’s extended family (who live a lifestyle I could only hope to achieve), when I really examine myself about it, it’s envy that I can’t live the same way. And once I’m able to let go and say “good for them! have fun!” – the inner peace really comes. </p>
<p>If I came on this board and said, “Guess what? We’re taking a month-long trip to Europe, first class all the way!” what’s a better response –
A) “Great, good for you! You’re so lucky – enjoy your vacation!”
or
B) “Your kids must think they’re entitled. How will you ever top that? They’ll think they’re entitled to travel the world first class, now. Do you know what that money could do in terms of helping a poor family, etc.?”</p>
<p>IMO, the mature person says A and the immature person says B.</p>
<p>I doubt the car matters as much as whether the teen chats on the phone, texts, drinks, or has a moving party in the car. At least for any car under 300 HP.</p>
<p>“I think it’s a little odd to be annoyed at rich people for buying expensive stuff for members of their families. And…
Well, aren’t they entitled to it if they have the money? As long as we have private property, people with more of it are entitled to the benefits of having it.”</p>
<p>Sure they’re entitled to it if they have the money. But it doesn’t automatically entitle them to the respect of others. It’s your money and you can spend it however you like, but that doesn’t make you a person to be respected or admired, as the OP article would perhaps like us to. That’s why I base my opinion of people on how they treat people.</p>
<p>Quite honestly, I laugh at people who think that others are jealous of them because they are rich. I find it amusing. Center of the universe mindset, imo.</p>
<p>^^^^I agree that having money doesn’t automatically entitle people to have the respect of others. I agree that some rich people seem to think it should, or believe that they are superior to others because they are wealthy.</p>
<p>But I also have observed that some people are automatically disdainful of people with money. They immediately make assumptions about those people, their priorities, their character and integrity that have nothing to do with the balance of their bank accounts. That is wrong also.</p>
<p>I’m in both camps. I think the rich are entitled to what they have, and I’m a bit resentful of it, too. I think it’s because Ilike many others here, I’m surehave seared into my memory the behavior of someone who has always had everything he needs and can’t imagine what it’s like to do without anything. Such impressions last a lifetime, and just as someone who is, say, robbed at gunpoint by a member of a minority group is more likely to harbor negative stereotypes about that group, so is someone who has been snubbed by Richie Rich more inclined to view the wealthy with a tainted gaze. Not that it’s right or logical, but I’m certain that it’s true.</p>
<p>Seconded. Honestly some of the wealthiest people I know certainly don’t act like it and live quite modest lifestyles (then again perhaps they have so much money because they weren’t out buying luxury cars for their teens). People being annoyed at the “we just bought our 15 year old a Lexus, aren’t we wonderful” types are on large part not annoyed about their money but are annoyed at the vanity. </p>
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<p>Unless people wear their bank account balance tattooed on their forehead I assume what you meant to say was that people are disdainful of those who flaunt their wealth over others… not those that simply have wealth over others. I know plenty of people who are likely far richer than the Lexus buying parents and yet live a very modest lifestyle in a modest home and would never buy their kid a Lexus for “keeping their grades up” (their kids don’t need carrots to keep their grades up). </p>
<p>In this sense people are not judging this family’s money they’re judging this family’s values… and there’s nothing wrong with that. This family is free to buy their kid a Lexus and tell the world about it, and others are free to think of them poorly for doing so.</p>
<p>Again, I’m not reacting to the article (which I haven’t read) but just to the overall concept of buying a nice car for a teenager (or similar other “extravagant” use of funds).</p>
<p>I don’t think a lot of people go out and spend their money in ways just to impress other people or to be respected or admired. I don’t really think most people GAS. I think that the families who go out and buy new cars for teens [or send the kids to fancy private high schools, expensive colleges, buy them expensive musical instruments, get them private coaches for a sport, send them on exchange programs abroad, take luxury vacations as a family, fill in your own pet extravagance] simply do so because that is how they desire to use their money.</p>
<p>And I think when a family goes and buys a kid an expensive car (or other luxury), and the onlooker says, “Well, they must think they are all that because they must have bought that fancy car just to impress us, well guess what we’re not impressed” – well, I think it’s the onlooker projecting a motive that isn’t typically there.</p>
<p>Here’s a RL example. We waited til D was 16 to let her get her ears pierced. We bought her very nice - and I mean very nice - diamond stud earrings. Nicer than my own diamond studs, which look like pinpricks in comparison, LOL. We spent the money because we wanted her to have something very high quality that would last her forever and for it to be a special gift to her. I’m sure it’s more extravagant than what her peers might have. And? So what? We didn’t do it “to be respected or admired”, or even to be noticed, for that matter. Other people’s opinions of that gift for her are simply of <em>no consequence</em> one way or the other. I fail to see why it would be any different if we were to have bought her or her twin brother a car. We also threw a reasonably lavish 16th birthday party for them. We, as parents, wanted to do it, and if anyone else has an opinion on it, whether it was too lavish or not lavish enough – well, that’s their problem. Not mine.</p>
<p>But how do you distinguish between “flaunt” and simply “have”?
In my diamond earring example, my D wears her earrings everyday. Is she “flaunting” them to her classmates who aren’t so fortunate – or is she just wearing earrings?
How does “flaunting a Lexus” manifest itself, versus “driving a Lexus”? I mean, I suppose if someone starts out every conversation with “I was in my Lexus the other day when …”, but aside from that, if kid-with-Lexus goes to pick up kid-with-clunker or kid-with-no-car to go to the movies, is kid-with-Lexus “flaunting” his Lexus?</p>
<p>I think some people confuse having with flaunting. I know that I think people who have things I want but can’t afford must be flaunting them in my face :-)</p>
<p>Buying your kid some diamond earrings as a nice present = have</p>
<p>Buying your kid a Lexus and then having him sit for a photo shoot with the local paper and telling the paper all about it at a time when many families struggle to put food on the table = flaunt</p>
<p>No, I meant that some people are disdainful of people with money period. If someone has a lot of money, yet doesn’t live in a “modest” home, are they “flaunting” their wealth? Who gets to define what is “modest” and at what point they have passed that point and moved over to “ostentatious?” I know some extremely wealthy people who are as nice as you could ever hope to meet. They are kind, give generously of their time and money to all sorts of causes, treat otherw with respect, etc. Yet their house, while not “flashy” in the sense of having gold faucets and diamond studded floors, is clearly expensive in that it is large, sprawling, on prime acreage, and full of tasteful yet expensive furnishings and art. </p>
<p>I guess what I am asking is must someone with a vast fortune live so very far below there means in order to gain respect? I get that there are wealthy people who love to flaunt their riches, but there are others who enjoy their money. I don’t see the problem with that. But there are SOME people who will find fault with anyone who is wealthy and doesn’t hide their wealth. They may be small in number, but those are the ones to me whose disdain seems to be based in jealousy.</p>
<p>Additionally, wealth is a very relative term. Many people here being critical of those who are guilty of “conspicuous consumption” would be viewed in exactly the same manner by someone who has even far less means. For some people, having more than one car or TV or 3 bedrooms or WHATEVER is evidence of “wealth” and is deserving of animosity.</p>
<p>Personally, the only people for whom I feel contempt are people who are living above their means, no matter WHAT their income is. You can find these people in all income brackets.</p>
<p>According to a recent report from AAA, car accidents involving drivers 15 to 17 cost society more than $34 billion in medical expenses, property damage and related costs in 2006.</p>
<p>I also grew up in the suburbs on the Eastside of Seattle. I knew too many friends who died before they graduated from high school from car accidents and more whose lives were affected when they were seriously injured in a car accident.
And this was before ipods and cell phones.
I haven’t read where teens are now more mature and safer drivers than they were.</p>
<p>I never got a car, but I got to drive my mother’s huge Suburban with weak breaks. If you can drive that, you can drive anything. Most cars I drive now I find so much easier to handle.</p>
<p>True, but you can find a minority that agrees with just about any way of thinking you can dream up. The majority of people do not hold this ‘hang-em-n-flog-em’ view towards those that simply have more money.</p>
<p>Emeraldkity4, is your argument with this kid, or letting teens drive in general?
We know nothing of this kid’s driving record other than he’s 15, so he probably doesn’t have one. I’m guessing right now he needs to drive with an adult in the car. </p>
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<p>Or, for all we know, this family could’ve easily afforded a Bentley for this child, but instead chose to get him a bottom of the line Lexus.</p>
<p>emeraldkity4, I really don’t understand what point you are trying to make in relation to the topic under discussion. I think everyone would agree that teens are not the greatest drivers and that accidents are a serious problem for this age group. I fail to see how this has anything to do with if the family in question gave their kid a new Lexus sedan or a used Civic.</p>
<p>Yes, they do, though. I’ve seen it a lot of times. I come from a wealthy family (I hate even typing that…). If people get to know me before they see my parents’ house or my car, then they treat me like a normal human being. If someone tells them about my family background before I get to talk to them, they almost invariably hold me at arm’s length and treat me like a freak (occasionally inserting snide, disdainful remarks about trust funds into our conversations–do they think I don’t notice that they’re talking about me?) until they get to know me and realize that I’m incredibly thankful for the things I’ve been given and have worked very hard for the things that I <em>haven’t</em> been given… and that I ask for very little. Then they treat me like a normal person.</p>
<p>It’s a delicate line to walk, but there’s definitely more of a negative attitude from people who have labeled me as being “rich”. (Which is weird to me, since I’m not flashy. I’m wearing discount flats I bought a year ago whose soles are flapping in the breeze, and the last time I got my hair cut and styled was… oh. Last June. The car is pretty much the last vestige of luxury that I haven’t jettisoned.)</p>
<p>I’m fortunate, and I really feel like I’m too lucky to complain (woe is me, I’m so rich and misunderstood…? gag…), so this is actually the only time to my recollection that I’ve ever said anything about this weird phenomenon that I’ve experienced over and over… But it’s absolutely a phenomenon that exists. I just keep the faith that people will get to know me eventually. I really think that most people, no matter what their backgrounds, find it a little hurtful to be disparagingly singled out as different, though.</p>
<p>Again the key words are “simply have more money.” I don’t doubt what you say, but that doesn’t mean that their disdain was due to the money alone. It very well could be more of a Pavlovian type response to previous encounters they have had with the offspring of your parent’s financial peers. </p>
<p>If others they encountered were self-adsorbed prima donnas then perhaps they thought you would be too. Unfair, yes, but likely more a reaction towards how they expect you will conduct yourself rather than towards your parent’s bank balance.</p>
<p>You’ve confused displays of wealth with wealth. Old money has never been about displaying wealth in visibly public ways (wine cellars are a whole different matter.) And that’s not just a New England, old money way of life. </p>
<p>Living in Texas and having worked in devleopment for non-profits, I can safely say that I do not know one older money, oil rich family that would buy a new Lexus for a teenager. I know plenty of first generation rich families that would/do.</p>
<p>Money to me is a neutral. It’s paper. It’s what someone does with it that tells me something about them. A new Lexus for a fifteen year old says something different than a family that lets children drive the oldest car. </p>
<p>I want my child to consider every dollar he spends. Is it really important to have the brand name, the newest, the flashiest? Or can a quality alternative be found and the dollar spent more wisely to benefit more people? That’s a way of life that people from all economic brackets practice, or chose not too.</p>
Most cars I drive now I find so much easier to handle.</p>