My D1 is very socially adept and always has a lot of friends. Her fifth grade teacher told me she was “above the fray” when it came to classroom drama. But even she got swiped a couple of times. She met a girl at camp summer before 6th grade and made friends, and that girl came to her school the next year. D was thrilled, and immediately included this girl in her friend group. They were good friends, until the next year when the newer girl got invited into the “popular” crowd. She dropped D1 like a hot potato. D was crushed – she didn’t mind if the other girl had more/new friends, but this girl wouldn’t give her the time of day. The other girl actually apologized later in high school. D1 never trusted her again, though.
D1 also had a group of three other friends in scouts she had been friends with since Kindergarten. When they were juniors in HS, D decided to have a murder mystery dinner party (the kind where there are 8 roles to play). She ended up inviting all friends from other areas of her life – a couple kids from our old neighborhood, and some from an EC she was involved with. She didn’t talk about it at school or post on FB or anything, but word got back to the group of 3 friends she had done a lot of stuff with that she had a get together and did not invite her, and they were livid. They made a “scrapbook” of photos of all their good times together and left it on our doorstep with a nasty note about how to treat friends. The great irony is that two of them were “besties” and did stuff all the time without the other two for many years, and sometimes prior to this party the threesome did stuff without my D (she would see postings on FB of their outings to movies and other places where they had not invited her). My D wasn’t bothered – but as soon as she had a party with other kids, they turned on her. One of the other girl’s moms even helped with the scrapbook and egged them on! (This mom is a close friend of mine, but it still burns me that she thinks this was okay behavior – we just don’t talk about it after an initial discussion, as we wouldn’t be friends any more if we did). They are all “friendly” now, but not friends.
The potential for damage seems much greater now given social media. Everything spreads like wildfire and it must be pretty easy to feel everyone in town knows something you are ashamed of or thinks some foul rumor is true.
@mcat2 I first heard of the term “queen bee” in Rosalind Wiseman’s book Queen Bees and Wannabees, a book about the social lives of adolescent girls in America. This book became the basis for the movie Mean Girls. Basically the queen bee is the charismatic leader of a clique and decides who is “in” or “out” of the clique. Unlike your experience, the queen bees that I knew in high school were very well liked by teachers and staff and did very well academically.
It happens to boys too, although not as often. One of mine got completely ousted from his friend group at the end of middle school. They went from all being excited about going to HS together to not talking to him or including him. He claims he doesn’t know what triggered this. It did get better and he want on to make very good friends, but it was hard. I know other boys that got “dumped” from the “cool group” that kept going back and trying to be friends with those kids, but got nowhere.
I have seen kids in the "nice group (for example band kids) be incredibly exclusive, sexist and just plain mean to their peers. The teachers and parents were still clinging to the idea that these were the nice kids and that the higher status athletes were not, which was not the case in this situation.
It is not always the parents. By late elementary or even middle school, parents can’t really control how kids treat each other when the parents are not around. One parent I know was horrified that her daughter was one of the mean girls in 5th grade. She constantly talked to her about treating people right, but couldn’t force her to stop being friends with the kids she wanted to be friends with or to befriend girls she didn’t like. Many kids are drawn to the popular group.
Also, your perspective can depend on context. The view that a group of kids are “really nice” is typical when a kid is in the “in group”. The view that the same group is cliquey and mean, is just as valid from the kid that is not in the group. Is not being friends with someone necessarily being mean? It may feel that way (and we all have probably been on both sides - there are people who don’t like us for whatever reason and people that we don’t like).
Another scenario that can happen when a child pulls away from a friend group is when that child starts to do so intentionally. This happened with one of my kids. My child started making excuses for not hanging around with old friends. It perplexed me at first but I later pieced together that the kids were starting to engage in behavior my child did not like and did not want to be a part of. Children can be hesitant to articulate their reasons for no longer hanging out with friends because they don’t want to risk getting others in trouble.
i have an eighth grader. you know it’s bad when the guidance counselor and a teacher, separately, acknowledge that there is a clique of girls in the honors classes that is exclusive and not kind about it. i mean that the school people brought this up to us when our daughter moved into this school class. the teacher hopes they will “become more open minded in high school”. i know the parents. some seem nice, but you never know
It is so important for all of us to be the safe haven for our kids, especially when their social lives are turbulent. I think it drew D closer to all of us, as we commiserated with her about how random and sometimes mean people could be. Helping them be agile to find/make their tribe really helps too.
D and her buddies weren’t the jocks nor the student govt nor the “popular” kids but they were the diverse and very inclusive kids. It really helped her grow by being around so many different kids with diverse backgrounds.
When my kids were younger and there was some mean girl activity that was trying to make them accomplices I told them they could always put the blame on me in a situation like that. “My Mom says I’m not allowed to exclude anybody from this kickball game”, etc. Of course that wouldn’t work at later ages but it gave them some practice in turning aside the pressure of the meanies.
Hi All,
I thought I’d check back in, since I originally asked “does it get better?” For my daughter, fortunately it did get better. She started high school this year and found a nice group of friends. It’s a large group of girls and boys that she mostly met in Coding Club and Drama Club. It’s a very inclusive group…they are constantly bringing in other kids who otherwise would have nobody to hang out with. I’m really proud of my daughter for rising above the “mean girl” stuff and moving on with her life!
She still has a cordial relationship with the girls who originally caused her so much grief. She is still in some classes with them, so she wants to keep the peace. But she keeps them at an arm’s length.
Thank you to all that posted here last year and helped me!
@vineyardview I am so glad things have turned out better in high school. There is a lesson learned with every experience and kids end up developing stronger social and life skills as a result of it.
Another voice agreeing that middle school is the worst. Our D broke up with a group of cool girls in 8th grade. I didn’t know until one day, out of the blue, I saw her sitting with a different group of kids at a different lunch table. I’ll never know the details, but it was a big deal and emotionally difficult for her.
Some of the girls from 8th grade also went on to the same small private high school. Our D remained cautious around these girls after her experience in middle school, but tried to take a neutral stance, aka tried to be friendly/neutral with everyone & not get boxed in to one group.
By senior year, she and one of the cool girls from 8th grade had become actual friends! People change. Things change. It’s a tough, vulnerable age.
If your D is open to it, a good therapist who specializes in that age group can be worth every penny.
@Midwest67 I totally agree that middle school is the worst, at least for relational aggression in girls. That’s great that your daughter later became friends again with one of the 8th grade “cool girls” in her senior year:) I kind of hope that my daughter will also have some reconciliation with at least one of the girls (from her former friend group) at some point.
I had actually considered counseling for my daughter, but realized that she was coping with everything rather well. I, on the other hand, was pretty much a mess over the situation, so the reassurance from all of the CC parents on this thread was invaluable. If I hadn’t had that reassurance, I think I probably would have needed the counseling, lol.
My unsolicted advice is to keep the counseling in mind, maybe even better to establish a relationship with a good therapist before any big problems arise?
IMO, having a therapist to talk to is much more common for teens these days and there isn’t nearly as much stigma attached to it.
Seems like stuff comes up that most kids will not feel comfortable sharing with their parents, even within the context of a close relationship. It can be so hard for them to find their place in their world.
D also had a rocky time from late grade school and thru middle school. Fortunately, she transferred to a private HS and made some great friends in summer school that she has remained friends with to this day, over a decade later. I really couldn’t understand how and why the girls were so dang mean but glad that D was able to learn from it and develop some great lifelong friends instead.
@Midwest67 I totally agree about the counseling. Now that my daughter is older, during check-ups, her pediatrician asks me to leave the room briefly so that she can talk to my daughter about anything she wants to discuss privately, be it mental health or a general health question. I like that my daughter has that confidental one-on-one time with her doctor. I have also always told my kids that they are welcome to come to me with any problems and I will try to get them the help they need, whether it’s counseling or anything else.
And oh my goodness that article you linked was amazing! The social media “rules” that kids have now is mind boggling. I’ve been chided by my daughter before for suggesting she post a pretty photo on Instagram because I didn’t know the “rules” and she wasn’t “supposed” to post it. Keeping up with teenage social norms today is like herding a litter of kittens. Ugh.
@HImom I still don’t understand why some girls can be so dang mean, either. In hindsight, I’m actually glad my daughter had to leave that group of friends. Her new friends are much more her “people” and they really seem to have fun together. Before, she was always worried that she was doing something wrong with her friends. Now the friendships just flow. I could see her new friend group becoming as terrific as the long-term friend group your daughter now has. Thank you so much for sharing!