<p>Hunt, It is a trivial fact indeed but it shows that many of us do not read enough on the history of major science discoveries. I would have hoped that becuase Marie Curie’s unique place in the history of science -being a woman and the discoverer of radioactivity- that more of us would have encountered the trivial fact that she is Polish.</p>
<p>Note: this is not about science but reading on history.</p>
<p>“I think that American parents show their equally pushy side in the world of youth sports.”</p>
<p>Ain’t that the truth? I have seen plenty of egrigious behavior of this kind, and I don’t think that any of it was from Asian parents.</p>
<p>I wonder what non Americans are thinking when they read these types of forums - American parents jockeying and pushing their way in a “cyber line” to get their kids into top colleges.</p>
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<p>Funny, back in the dark ages, we were taught about “Madame Curie” (why didn’t they use her first name, like they did with the men??). Because of this, I assumed she was French. A quick google reveals that although she was born in Poland of Polish heritage, she was a French citizen. Thanks for the trivia, padad.</p>
<p>I always thought Marie Curie was French. Learn something new every day it seems.</p>
<p>"Most every kid I know takes a year of calculus and a year of physics as part of a broad based curriculum. "</p>
<p>Very, very few kids where I live take calculus. Only maybe the top 10% of a high school class, and then it depends on the high school. Of course, if you only hang out with the high achievers or live in a wealthy public school district, then maybe “every kid” you know takes calculus and physics, but that is hardly the case across the board. CC is not a cross section of humanity. It is a self selecting group of posters in a country where 75% of the population doesn’t go to college and doesn’t try to go to college.</p>
<p>The first time I was exposed to the masses of humanity was ironically when my kids left a public school gifted program and went to a Catholic school. At the Catholic school people were holding their sons back a grade and pushing sports like crazy. Instead of after school music lessons and/or math tutoring, they went to private baseball coaches, played on travel leagues for soccer, or in special year round volleyball leaques or swim teams. The push was to get a college scholarship for sports. It was the first time I’d ever heard of getting a sports scholarship and starting to plan for that in 4th grade, or earlier!</p>
<p>When I started lobbying for better math, people looked at me like I was crazy. They thought the math was too hard already. One lady who’s H was an engineer said it didn’t matter if her Ds had good math, only her S. For the Ds, she said, “It’s not like they’re actually going to BE an engineer.”</p>
<p>Stereotypes exist for a reason.</p>
<p>ps - one boy in my S’s class was 2years older and 2 feet taller than the other boys, and primed for sports constantly. Pushed into advance football leaques, etc. He was accepted to Vanderbilt on a football scholarship before 12th grade even started, in August.</p>
<p>Athletic sandbagging is what I’ve heard it called. There were a few guys I played against from other high schools who probably could have bought me beer after the game. The sports factor is one of the reasons why I didn’t skip a grade… I was already pretty thin entering high school, and I did want to play varsity sports eventually, so no skipping.</p>
<p>I wonder if many have heard of Maria Sklodowska or Irene Curie? :rolleyes:</p>
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<p>Really, always? That’s a pretty broad statement.</p>
<p>What he means is that they had some basis in truth at some point. They are dramatizations of reality, not creative fiction made up by someone with an axe to grind.</p>
<p>“I wonder if many have heard of Maria Sklodowska or Irene Curie?”</p>
<p>That is like thinking Abdul Jabber is the greatest basketball player and have never heard of Lew Alcindor. Or be interested in college football and not making the connection between Chris Long and his Dad. Wow, I didn’t know that being a math obssessed Asian parent had that in me.</p>
<p>Well, it’s taken me two days of unfocused reading to finally get here, (the bottom of the thread for now). Initially, upon reading the topic I actually thought it was another one of those threads written by someone of Asian descent. Then I cracked little jokes to myself while reading, as I just knew that eventually someone would say something about affirmative action, (lol), and then it would turn into a black/white issue, and take a whole other turn, (side note, I hate to see affirmative action mentioned on these boards as folks do get quite ugly at times).</p>
<p>Anywho, I was a bit taken aback at first, as I usually enjoy the OP’s input. I really had to think about who wrote it, and put myself in her moment to find the humor. I can, however, understand how some others may take it away from where OP was going with it. Just my two cents, (not worth very much these days, if it ever was).</p>
<p>I still maintain (and this is not a comment on the original post or poster) that to say that there is a grain of truth to every stereotype is a pretty slippery slope. Not one I want to go down.</p>
<p>" I can, however, understand how some others may take it away from where OP was going with it."</p>
<p>That’s a great way of putting it. Thank you for reminding me that when I put something out there, readers are free to take it where they want.</p>
<p>“I still maintain (and this is not a comment on the original post or poster) that to say that there is a grain of truth to every stereotype is a pretty slippery slope. Not one I want to go down.”</p>
<p>This is an interesting point. I think most stereotypes do have a grain of truth, but there may be others that are deliberately created to denigrate some group. Sometimes there’s probably a mix. For example, with various waves of ehtnic immigrants have come jokes about how stupid those immigrants were. The grain of truth may have been that those immigrants were relatively uneducated and spoke English poorly. The reason for the jokes and the stereotypes, though, was probably a reaction to the economic competition that those immigrants presented.</p>
<p>I suppose that even positive or neutral stereotypes can be hurtful. My kids know some Asian students who are suffering a bit under this stereotype because they are not academically talented, but are expected to be or wrongly presumed to be. </p>
<p>However, it does puzzle me how much some people get outraged over even favorable stereotypes. I mean, if someone said “Swedes are very tall,” and I was a Swede–even a short Swede–I can’t imagine being offended. A teammate of my D’s once told her track coach that she didn’t want to train to be a sprinter because she wasn’t black and she’d noticed that the best sprinters on a state level are generally black. She figured there was a genetic difference in build between many African-American athletes and many Caucasian ones and she’d likely be better off doing distance events. There was no malice intended and the kid saw nothing wrong with expressing that observation. But people went ballistic on her and the coach blew a gasket. Is there something wrong with being a good sprinter??? She didn’t say ALL African-Americans are good spinters, or that NO whites are.</p>
<p>I guess I see this issue in the same light. Is there something wrong with pushing your kids to excel in school? Sure, there is the perception that some parents can go overboard, but I would think that as far as stereotypes go, this is not a bad one.</p>
<p>I think it can be a harmful stereotype if it makes people think that an Asian kid who has succeeded academically did so only because he was pushed and studied day and night. In a way, that’s a bit like thinking that the URM kid only got into a top school because of affirmative action. In both cases, it might be true, and probably is true for lots of people, but it’s annoying to the person for whom it isn’t true.</p>
<p>"I think it can be a harmful stereotype if it makes people think that an Asian kid who has succeeded academically did so only because he was pushed and studied day and night. "</p>
<p>Heck, people like to say the above about every really smart kid. It makes them feel better about themselves because they are portraying the accomplishment as stemming from something abnormal or excessive, or from something innate that they have no control over (ie. being a member of a certain group. This could be an ethnic group or a perceived social category like “the nerds”, “the goody-two-shoes”, “the brown-nosers”, etc.). This is certainly not restricted to any particular race or ethnicity. I’m white and people said that to me many times when I was in school. My S is Hispanic, and people said that to him too. In middle school a kid said to me, annoyed “I could get straight A’s too if I was as smart as you!”</p>
<p>Responding to MercyMom (Post #265) regarding how many HS kids take calculus and physics –</p>
<p>Among people 25 years old and older:</p>
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<p>This is from a USA Today article from 2002.</p>
<p>My point is that we here on CC do in fact live in a very rarified environment. Not everyone is like us.</p>
<p>Edit: I just realized these numbers are cumulative. So the total of these percentages – 45% – have taken at least some college courses. 24% have a bachelors. 8.9% have a graduate degree.</p>
<p>"“I could get straight A’s too if I was as smart as you!”</p>
<p>Words to live by!</p>
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<p>Who decides what is positive, neutral or negative?</p>
<p>Lumping people together on the basis of extraneous factors, rather than celebrating individual differences, is what is stereotyping!</p>