I’ve done all my parenting solo so I have no experience doing so with a partner but this strikes me as something Conmama might want to discuss with her H rather than take it as an immutable dictate. Of course if she feels the same way, then there’s nothing to discuss.
I would like to have moderate rules, but DH doesn’t know what friends he will invite or even know them. He doesn’t like the thought of strangers having access to our stuff in the house. He hates the thought and this will not change. Unfortunately he will lie about who came over if he had restrictions on just certain guests. DH thinks he might be smoking weed in the house and drinking all his liqior…haha
We have never let them carry our house keys. It is in the garage in an easily accessible place. We can just take the key and he has no way of getting in.
He has an apartment at school that we pay for. He can just stay there. If he graduates with no job, then we have more of abeing issue.
It’s really time for him to not live with us anymore…crossing fingers after he graduates.
Checking for clarity. Are you saying you lock your kid out of your house?
Does your husband let YOU have guests in the house when he isn’t there?
conmama, do you call him on it when he lies?
If I argue DS’s point with DH, we will fuss and he will be angry. I’m also reluctant because he blatantly disobeyed our wishes. If we give in, he will push the boundaries on that…this is just the type of person he is…at least with us. Thanks for letting me vent.
I guess I see this differently - while I totally agree that the rules may be too strict at least in this case - OP is implying this kid is a serial liar or at least has issues in general with the truth and being trustworthy. That seems like a different issue to me and potentially one more serious. @conmama- does your son have issues with the truth with other people as well, like employers, and/or professors - perhaps people in authority? Or just his parents? That may tell you if he is chafing at rules that are too strict or if he has a bigger problem with authority or being truthful.
Sounds to me like “all in all” he is a good kid. While he hit some bumps in the road he is graduating next semester. While you mention that he tells “white lies,” you also mention that he is basically “respectful,” has an internship this summer and is taking a class. I would try to get to the bottom of the “white lies” rather than concluding there is some huge issue here.
I am going to bet that he hates conflict and lacks the patience to talks things out when it arises. So he does the easiest thing and tells you what you want to hear. Not a great habit but believe me if this is the worst you are dealing with you are getting off easy. Look around and you will find kids battling drug/alcohol addiction, getting arrested for DUI or dropping out of school when they are close to graduating. And I don’t mean to minimize your issue, just suggesting that some perspective might help when you are formulating an approach.
I think the problem will solve itself. He will graduate next semester and hopefully find employment which will have him living independently of you and your H.
There’s certainly some weirdness on both sides. I can’t imagine not letting your kids have house keys. That seems beyond strange to me. And not allowing your kids to have friends over when you’re not home is also weird, but I can see that as an odd quirk I suppose. The weird thing with your S’s behavior isn’t that he broke the rules and had somebody over, but both that his friend stayed the night and your S didn’t think to clean up afterwards. That actually displays a serious lack of sneakiness in a kid described as sneaky.
Anyway, I think OP is right - it’s time for S to find his own place. Hopefully you can all survive until he graduates, and your S gets a job lined up quickly.
I don’t get it. He’s a 22 year old adult and you are treating him like he is a 15 yr. old high schooler.
Plus, you asked him if he had people over and he told you he did. That’s not lying.
My S is 22 and I cannot imagine treating him like a child. It’s no wonder your S feels the need to sneak around.
Time for you to start treating him like an adult - whether he lives in your home or not.
Yes, because I don’t lie about who I am bringing to the house and I am respectful about taking care of OUR house. My husband always asks me when he wants to have people over, and I do the same to make sure we don’t tread on each other’s schedules or wishes.
The issue here is that the kid doesn’t pay the mortgage, and he doesn’t respect the house rules, or his parents. He isn’t responsible in any way towards the house, and doesn’t care that it upsets his dad to have people over when the dad isn’t home.
He needs to live on his own, and he needs to earn back his parents’ trust to get the house keys back if he wants to come visit or check on the house. If people are not trustworthy, you don’t extend trust to them. It seems fairly simple to me. Just because you share genetics or history with them does not mean you should behave differently-hold him to the same standard you would hold your friends, at the very least.
@conmama I’m sorry you, H, & son, are going through this. It’s difficult to offer helpful advice without knowing the history.
Interestingly, one D’s very good friend (18 yo) has a history of hiding things or lying to her parents. As it turns out, her parents are very strict, and the general agreement amongst their crowd of friends is her parents are being unreasonable.
The perception, right or wrong, that the parents are being unreasonable fuels further hiding and lying to avoid punishment or ground rules the kid doesn’t think are fair.
Our D, when she talks about this to us, assures us that there is nothing dangerous or illegal or harmful going on. (Mom, we’re GOOD kids, really!). The kid just wants similar freedom of choices that her peers have. But the parents are strict, as I said, and suspicious. There are a LOT of rules.
My observation from the outside, and listening to D describe it, (but not hearing the parents’ side!) is whatever is going on is hurting the child-parent relationship.
So, maybe moving forward, you can take a moment to ask yourself whether you think your decisions will prove to be useful, and what it might be doing to your relationship.
It’s not easy!
I would be most concerned with the pattern of lying. One of my children was a liar when young (through middle school and the early part of high school) and it was a real problem for me. I need to trust the people with whom I am involved. I feel, and stressed, that a reputation for integrity is precious, and easily lost and challenging to regain.
In an attempt to stem the lying, when this child did tell me something he knew I would not be happy about, rather than scolding him, I would shake his hand and say “Thank you for being honest with me.”
I believe our now adult child can be trusted to be truthful. But handling the lying was one of my major parenting challenges.
I would have a significant “heart to heart” discussion with your son about this topic of needing to trust him, emphasizing that it is critical for your relationship with him. Again, show appreciation and positive reinforcement for any signs he is moving in the right direction in this area.
I see the house rules issue as secondary. We have an adult child living at home for the next couple of weeks (until he marries). 
Our policy was that he was allowed to have guests when we are away, which we often are, but we expect him to let us know in advance and be open about it, and to follow house rules. (Food only in certain rooms, for example.) He is always held responsible for maintaining the house as we would – I am NOT to come home to dishes in the sink, for example.
He never has a big party, more likely a small barbecue with a few buds. We are happy that he enjoys entertaining at our home, and glad he takes advantage of that way of getting together with some of his friends. We have also had friends of his stay here when we are around, of course.
I couldn’t disagree more. Your child (at whatever age) has a much more important relationship with you than your friends do. IMHO.
@oldmom4896 I may not have been clear in what I was trying to express. It’s not ok to allow your family members to treat you in a way that you would never allow strangers or friends to treat you.
In preparation for his imminent graduation and entry into the world, this must be frustrating, OP. I think you are right to make a boundary, you and DH together. Whether or not DS likes it, adults encounter boundaries all the time, and we aren’t in the habit of perpetually explaining to each other the whys and wherefores. It doesn’t matter if DS likes the boundary, it matters if he respects it,and he doesn’t. I wouldn’t let him stay at home for a long time, period. Visits during the day, dinner on the weekend, sure. He’s still your son. But living there when you are paying for an apartment, too? Nope. Not when he disregards your wishes. It’s okay to make him earn your trust, work for it. That doesn’t make you mean or strict.
Whether it’s your “fault” or can be remediated is kinda beside the point. He has not earned your trust, so he hasn’t earned the rights that go with trust. Whether he changes or not is up to HIM, not up to you. Not your monkey, not your circus…Taking him with you when you go away is it’s own kind of awful. Why should you do that, when the simple solution is what you’ve decided on?
Fwiw, we also dealt with this and our DS did eventually feel less like he needed to protect every bad decision by whitewashing or lying about it. I also learned – with great difficulty — to be less judgmental and more hands off. It helped to remind myself how many decisions my own parents didn’t like, but kept their mouths shut.
Does he actually HAVE this apartment over the summer…or did he sublet it to someone else.
If you are paying rent there for him…and it’s available…why didn’t he get a summer job there…and live in the apartment?
^^Great advice by @greenbutton and exactly what I was trying to say but not really doing a good job of it.
It’s not productive to get butt-hurt over lying by our kids. Most of them do it to some degree or another. Very few are serial sociopaths with no regard for our or anyone else’s feelings. Sometimes it’s a (relatively) unhealthy way of dealing with a family dynamic.
Our job is to set healthy boundaries and then let them do what they will and live with the consequences of their own actions.
But again, easier said than done. Wishing you peace and clarity OP.
If the son is “only” lying to his parents, then perhaps they are too strict and unreasonable, although I still think that lying should never be rewarded. But if this is a pattern he has with other people, then it is coming from within the child, not as a result of the parents’ rules and then it is something more serious. Of course I’m not saying he’s a sociopath, but I know people who just can’t help lying about things that don’t even matter and it is a serious detriment to them in relationships and jobs…
Your H feels very strongly about his rules, and you don’t want to confront him about them or have conflicts.
Sounds like you and your S really aren’t that much different. And I mean that in a good way.
@myjanda - totally see what you’re saying, and it’s why I think ‘learning’ to ‘lie’ or whitewash to cope is ultimately an unhealthy behavior pattern that may not work well out in the grown-up world (though smart, driven narcissists sometimes seem to make it work LOL).
If we take lying personally as parents, we might miss the chance to teach a valuable life skill (coping in healthier ways) and lesson (possible downsides to lying your way through life).
Not saying this is OP at all (who I always feel sounds like a great parent) - just speaking generally.