Ungrateful for Christmas

Parent Cafe
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<p>I think you should consider marriage counseling. Having a wedge driven between you and your husband is very dangerous to your marriage and the foundation of your family. You need to tell him that decisions like this can’t be unilateral, they must be discussed and decided privately, and then stuck to. I think you are a saint for being so reasonable about this because I would have reached down my husband’s throat and ripped his heart out. As much as he loves your daughter, he is doing her no favors. But you clearly know that.</p>

<p>Fact is that if she doesn’t learn gratitude, moderation and patience at home, she will likely never learn them and being without those attributes is going to cause her all sorts of problems. It will affect her relationships on the personal as well as professional level. Frankly, people just don’t like or want to be around someone like that. And within herself, not being able to appreciate things will lead to a lifetime of being unsatisfied. Not good at all. You and your husband have a serious problem and need to get on the same page before she leaves for college or your friends here on CC will be reading about your daughter as THAT roommate in freshman year.</p>

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<p>She’s still lucky to be 18 and receiving Christmas gifts. In my extended family, the rule is gifts are for kids who are under 18 or haven’t graduated from high school yet…whichever comes first. That didn’t really help yours truly who started college as a 17 year old. :)</p>

<p>In any event, behaving like your D did would not only mean no more gifts until a genuine apology and a long period to “cool off”, but would also mean the offender WILL be harshly scolded and won’t live it down with some older members…even decades later. My family has no tolerance for bratty behavior…even if one is going through stressful circumstances. </p>

<p>More importantly, this behavior/reaction needs to be tackled ASAP. I have an older college friend who has a hard time making friends because of this…and IMHO…he does get a slight out due to being non-neurotypical and having a LD which was only diagnosed a couple of years ago. </p>

<p>Even so, he has had to learn that in the “real world” few people on the outside are willing to extend themselves enough to understand that because when he loses his temper, it turns people off.</p>

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<p>I completely agree with zoosermom in #21.</p>

<p>Your H is, IMHO, exhibiting troubling and potentially creepy behavior by wooing his D with expensive gifts and failing to respect his wife. Now, I know that there are at least 2 sides to every story, but I really think that for your D’s sake AND yours the two of you should work on this with a marriage counselor.</p>

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<p>I’m glad I wasn’t drinking anything when I read that. :D</p>

<p>I agree with you! DH and I had a verbal contract when I got pregnant the first time that we would always discuss contentious issues in private, we would not undermine each other in front of the children, and we would find a compromise in every disagreement so that we could present a united front. Can’t say we got it right 100% of the time, but just having this promise between us helped a great deal. And in this situation, Mom is right and the DH is out of line. What he is doing might make him feel better, but it is actually harmful to his daughter in the long term.</p>

<p>In my house: Hell would freeze over before the D got that jacket. At least as Cobrat mentions above, there must be a good deal of SINCERE remorse shown before any generosity is extended again on my part.</p>

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I agree completely with this. My D1, who is normally sane and reasonable, was a psycho when she was waiting for her college decisions, but since that was the only time in her life she was unpleasant, I was more patient. My D2 has a tendency to being a brat, as well, and my husband passed along the message to her in her life that he would do anything to shut her up, which she learned very well. It took a lot of insight and discipline on his part to really understand that he was harming her. Now he tunes her out when she cranks it up and I am so proud of him!</p>

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<p>Definitely, H & I are always united about things either of us consider important. An ungrateful kid would be troubling and we would both be sure to purposely NOT gift said kid until said kid wises up and shows SINCERE change and gratitude. We do NOT like the doormat role and avoid it whenever possible. Also, we do not want our kids to end up friendless because they do not appreciate what it means to be grateful and that the world is more than just them.</p>

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<p>Or OTOH, maybe mom’s attitude that her D didn’t need the jacket and didn’t want to buy it to begin with even though it’s the only thing her D said she wanted already tainted the whole situation with the “mother knows best” vibe and dad is trying to make a bad situation a bit better. (just mark me guilty of this on a regular basis)</p>

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<p>Gouf, maybe…but there still should have been a discussion and an agreement. OP and her H were aligned, and then he changed his mind. The rule in our house is that once we’re aligned, any change of plans on serious matters requires an agreement/ realignment. And sometimes…mom DOES know better than a teenager, especially when the gift is very expensive and impractical. I’d like to give my kids everything they want, but frankly we can’t afford it and it teaches them nothing about how real life works or about true gratitude.</p>

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<p>Just because it’s the only thing she said she wanted doesn’t mean she is entitled to it. If that were the case, I would “only” have wanted a new car this Christmas.</p>

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<p>Yeah, I still don’t have that pony! :)</p>

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<p>Did you make it clear before xmas that she wasn’t getting the jacket? If she expected she was getting it, it is understandable that she is upset feeling her opinion is not respected. She shouldn’t have acted out. But if her wishes are regularly ignored, it can be frustrating for a 17-18 old.</p>

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<p>I have some entitlement issues with one of my kids, and I find that it does seem, as other posters have pointed out, that people with this issue are never satisfied. If you do spring for the expensive presents or whatever, then it is on to the next thing that they think they HAVE to have. So, she periodically gets a lecture. And she gets some of what she wants, if we agree that we think it is a good thing. She apparently didn’t think we got her enough for Christmas, and wants an expensive camera. I told her that she could return the presents we gave her and use the money, or save the money. She is a good kid, and I can see she is fighting with herself over the wanting something and not getting it, and being appreciative of what she DOES have. We are raising kids in a very entitled society. Many of her peers do get whatever they want, or at least it seems that way to her. And she has always been influenced more than my other kids by popular culture, and the way marketing makes it seem that if you just possess something cool, it makes you cool. She worries about fitting in with wealthier peers. I lecture and say <em>screw 'em</em> – be proud of who you are. So, you don’t have the most expensive boots, coat, camera, whatever. You are just as good as anyone, nothing to feel bad about. She is a theatre major, so lately (after taking an acting class myself), I told her to make her choice (to be who she is) and own it, and other people will go along (unless they are people that no one wants or needs in their lives anyway).</p>

<p>Long story short – I sympathize. I wouldn’t get the coat, if it hadn’t already been ordered. I probably would return the gifts, give her the money, and say she could use it toward the coat. I find something happens when they are given their own money to spend. Often, what looked so attractive when they thought someone else was buying it begins to seem a lot less desirable when they have the money and can use it for other things.</p>

<p>Since your hubby already ordered it, though, I don’t know. If it would cause more strife, I might let it go. The timing may not be right for putting your foot down. Or maybe it is. Only you know. At any rate, have a talk about next Christmas early on (maybe next summer) about how to handle things. Include the daughter in the conversation. Maybe it is time to do things a little differently. Maybe just give the kid some money next time to spend as she chooses. </p>

<p>The whole thing, esp. if it is extreme behavior, not the usual from your daughter, could just be the <em>fouling the nest</em> thing that often happens when kids are preparing to become independent. If so, then she will get better after a couple of years away, as my adult children have. The year before each of my oldest three left was horrible, terrible. 17 is not my favorite age!</p>

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<p>It sounds as if the D was told ahead of time that she was getting the jacket, but that it wouldn’t arrive for Christmas. So she was going to be getting her Christmas gifts PLUS, shortly thereafter, the jacket. </p>

<p>It’s possible that there was some miscommunication and she thought she was not getting the jacket at all. Especially if she knew that the OP was not in favor of the gift. Of course that would be no justification for the bad behavior. At that point, I probably would have reminded her that the jacket in fact had been ordered and was on its way, but in light of her unacceptable behavior, it will now be returned. </p>

<p>On the other hand, as a few others have said, a lot depends on the context. If this is unusual behavior, perhaps brought on by stress, or a momentary lapse followed by a sincere apology, I would probably hold onto the jacket until she shows that she deserves it.</p>

<p>The undermining Dad is a separate issue, however. He’s creating huge problems there. What does he say when you bring this up to him? Does he acknowledge it at all?</p>

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<p>I am assuming that things have quieted down a bit by now…</p>

<p>At this point, I would take my daughter out for a quiet cup of coffee for a talk. I would point blank ask her what SHE thought about her behavior. Ask her, also, about what she feels she and each of the other members of the family, is entitled to. Being stressed over applications and application results do not entitle her to be a brat.</p>

<p>Sometimes calmly putting a child on the spot is not a bad thing. It makes them think.</p>

<p>Next time a gift giving situation comes up, tell her that you do not enjoy choosing gifts for someone who cannot be pleased or grateful, and that you did not want a repeat of the scene from Christmas…and then give her a nice card and a limited amount of cold, hard cash to do with as she chooses. If she complains about the amount–tell her that was what was in the family budget, and if you want to, take back the $$$ and tell her that you will instead donate it where it will be appreciated.</p>

<p>I would also have a talk with her (and your husband) – now – about your expectations for spending money etc at college. Wherever she goes, there are going to be a lot of people with things she will "want’…whether it’s spending money for restaurants or clubbing, bags, boots, , weekends out of town, spring break, etc.</p>

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<p>OP said the jacket was ordered by Dad after Xmas, after the tantrum. I may be juvnile in saying this but I don’t think I would be happy in D’s shoe, either. Mom asked what D wanted for xmas and D said the only thing she wanted was the jacket. Parents decided on their own that it was a wrong choice for D and got something else. Why did they ask if they were going to override singlehandedly? Did they communicate that they won’t be getting it for her and why? I stopped pretending to know what fashion is suitable for my kid at the end of middle school. They got theit own culture. I certainly had no opinion of what my college bound kid should wear. If I had, I kept it to myself as far as it was not extremely inappropriate.</p>

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<p>Sigh. It can be tough. Hormones, changes, stress, mental issues, emotional ones all translate into behavioral ones. We went/go through this with our kids, by the way, in terms of useless expensiv jackets with the danged high school letter jacket which costs in excess of $200 and then they won’t be caught in it once they are off to college. But they won’t hand it down either, so for each one, since mine were all jocks, I’ve bitten that bullet, and will again.</p>

<p>But your daughter’s tantrum is something that I would not reward. As others have said, just return or donate the gifts, including the one that is coming. Keep an eye on other such outbursts and behavior, in case there are some serious problems brewing that may need intervention. </p>

<p>Hugs to you. Yeah, they can get so nasty, only their mothers love them, and sometimes we even wonder. Most of the time, it does get better.</p>

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<p>*a horrid show of ingratitude at Christmas. For the last couple of years, I would get Christmas ideas from her by plunking a bunch of clothing catalogues in front of her and having her put tags on things she would like. After she did that this year, and after I ordered some items, she discovered this expensive baseball jacket on E-Bay with logos all over it of her favorite K-pop group. *</p>

<p>Along with the dad being an idiot for ordering the jacket…I don’t like the above. The D didn’t just ask for the jacket. She FIRST asked for some other things, and the mom ordered some items. THEN, she found the jacket and insisted that THAT was the only thing she wanted. At that point, it’s too late. Besides, we don’t just buy something just because our kid wants it. The mom is likely correct…next year the “college student” will be too old to wear it.</p>

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<p>Oh, OK, I misread it. I thought mom implicitly promised the jacket by not confronting her at that moment.</p>

<p>I think whether Mom is correct or not is immaterial imo. If it is too expensive to be used only for a while, she could have put down conditions.</p>

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<p>sounds like a spoiled little brat to me…</p>

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<p>“sounds like a spoiled little brat to me…”</p>

<p>Yes, likely. But, it sounds like the dad is a “spoiled little brat creator.” I agree with the suggesting of some kind of couples counseling because this will just keep happening. The dad may have felt that he didnt’ get what he wanted as a child, and somehow thinks this is the answer. </p>

<p>But, as we all know, as kids get older, their “wants” get more and more expensive! :confused: Next, it’s pricey cars, weekly mani/pedis, designer hand bags, pricey weddings…the entitlement attitude just keeps growing.</p>