Want to try again

Parents Forum
1

<p>So, I went to a school I never wanted to go to.</p>

<p>I hate it here.</p>

<p>It’s too big, impersonal, poor major/career advising, I’m disengaged with the large classes (yes, even upper level classes are large!) and discussion is virtually nonexistent. </p>

<p>I’m a second semester junior and I haven’t learned/taken away a thing from my education, and I’m not going to delude myself, it was my fault, too.</p>

<p>I’ve been getting bad grades from the get-go and what I really want to do is go to community college, get my confidence and grades back up, then transfer to a different university (preferably a small liberal arts college).</p>

<p>The problem is, of course, I’ve already spent 3 yrs at school.</p>

<p>Is it too late to “start over” like this? </p>

<p>I mean: How will I afford a LAC? I am sure my parent’s patience has run dry and most LACs are quite expensive. Can work and loans cut it? Will I be unable to fit in as an older student and a transfer student, anyway?</p>

<p>Basically I just want to know if my plan is realistic/possible, and if it’s possible, what steps I can take to carry it out as smoothly as possible.</p>

2

<p>I’m sorry that you’re so miserable there but you’ve been there this long why not just stick it out and get finished? It doesn’t seem that it’d make much sense to try to switch elsewhere at this point. I’d guess that there are probably plenty of other students there who like it just fine. Really examine exactly why you’re unhappy there and determine if it’s really the class sizes, etc. or perhaps other factors such as lack of involvement on your part, lack of a bunch of friends, etc. that could be issues at any college you go to. Also make sure you’re not too involved in the ‘college is the best time of your life’ scenario because this simply isn’t true for many. A lot of students attend college to work hard, learn, and get a degree so they can move on with their lives afterwards and sometimes it isn’t so much fun while they’re doing so. </p>

<p>I don’t understand why you say you haven’t learned anything. You agree that you’re part of the issue but did you just not apply yourself? Did you pick a major you’re uninterested in? Did you pick a major that’s just too easy? If so you’ll face these issues anywhere you’d go and can likely correct them there. Make sure you’re in a major that interests you and if not see if there’s a possibility to switch. Take some challenging courses if that’s what you want to get yourself engaged. When you have questions in certain areas have you visited the profs during office hours? Many times students at large campuses don’t take advantage of this. Get yourself involved but don’t wait around for it to happen to you on its own since it probably won’t. Your college experience is what you make of it. Don’t expect the ‘college’ to change your life - it’s the ‘college experience’ that can change lives and this can happen almost anywhere if the student is willing to take advantage of the opportunity.</p>

<p>It seems that quitting at this point, attending a CC, and trying to attend another college would be expensive, take years to accomplish, and might not solve your issues anyway. Remember that if you really want to you can consider going to grad school if that’s what you want at some point at a different college even if it’s a couple of years after you graduate.</p>

3

<p>I would agree…try to just finish your bachelors degree and move on from there.</p>

<p>Re: “starting over”…I see one issue. Who is going to pay for this? Since you already HAVE a bunch of undergrad credits, you will be enrolling in college as a junior at least (at your “new Lac” after CC…if you went that route). It is highly unlikely that you would qualify for any financial aid of substance. In addition, there is a limit on the amount of money you can even borrow via Stafford loans for undergrad school and with three years of undergrad at UMD, and two at a CC, you might exceed that amount. </p>

<p>Certainly, there are folks who have done the community college course of study AFTER getting a bachelors degree, or after completing a number of college courses at some point in their past. BUT most I have heard about were completing two year courses of study that would lead to jobs (e.g. dental technician, 2 year nursing degree, etc). </p>

<p>I think you need to also think about the finances of your plan.</p>

4

<p>I am in a major that was my passion in high school but turned out to be a totally different experience in college due to the large class size and lack of almost any discussion.</p>

<p>Yes, it’s my fault for not applying myself, anyway. I failed a lot of classes and got Ds or Cs in most of them. So, I don’t think I’ve learned anything, and it’s not the fault of the college, it’s the fault of me not applying myself. </p>

<p>I feel like the solution to helping me apply myself would be twofold, the first part going back to a community college so that I can get my confidence back up (at this point I don’t believe in myself anymore) and the second part going to a college where the things I loved about school/my major would resurface.</p>

<p>I’m quite involved in campus activities, too. I’ve had a lot more success there than in academics! A lot of my involvement JUST started because it took me a really long time to adjust and find my niche here.</p>

<p>The only problem I have with just “finishing up” is that I don’t feel I’m prepared in any way for any career. As I said I didn’t take anything away from my classes, and I bounched around so much in the hope of finding something I enjoyed that I don’t have a good topical focus either.</p>

<p>I got a scholarship my first two years here so I never took out any loans. </p>

<p>Finacing the LAC would be a huge concern which is why I posted in the parent’s forum, for any suggestions on how to finance the whole thing.</p>

5

<p>A thought…why not look at it a different way…What if you completed the requirements for a BA/BS (not sure which track you are on).GRADUATE…and then take classes at a CC in another major, not for the purpose of earning another BA/BS degree, but for the pure JOY of learning. Then once you have settled on an identifiable passion, you may wish to pursue a graduate degree.
Now…why this option might work for you…you mentioned you are very involved with campus activities. You strike me as someone who will do very well in business, and as a community volunteer. Your undergraduate degree with be just one of many accomplishment you manage in the course of your life.
My two cents…APOL-a mom</p>

6

<p>My main problem is I don’t feel prepared for a career…do to not being engaged in the classes.</p>

7

<p>I’d say a large number of college grads don’t feel prepared for a career and in fact a lot of college majors don’t actually directly prepare one for a specific career. A lot of the humanities majors are fine background but often don’t have a slam-dunk path in a particular career as opposed to an engineering degree for example. Yet many/most of the grads do enter the business world and manage to find a business niche and succeed. </p>

<p>If you haven’t expanded your knowledge past the HS level then as you said, it’s because you haven’t tried to. You seem to think that running from this college to a different one would somehow solve the issue of you not applying yourself yet it likely won’t and if you do it (and figure out if/how you can) you’ll add years more of college along with the expense of paying for them and the lost income from delaying your career start.</p>

<p>It seems to me that you’d be better off being honest with yourself, as you seem to be, and realize that the issue isn’t the college but rather you not applying yourself, have a different outlook now that you’re more focused on the practical aspect of getting a job when you’re done, and turn this around. If you no longer have any interest in your major then consider switching to another one that’ll interest you. You can discuss this with career counselors but you can also discuss it with some profs who can often provide some real insight into different areas. Go ahead and give it a try. If you switch majors you might have to stay there another semester or two but that’d still be a lot more practical than the other route you’re considering.</p>

<p>And again, don’t get too caught up in the feeling of not having a direct career path in front of you since a great many of your fellow students are in the same boat. If you’re willing to state your major or proposed major there may be other posters here who’ll tell you options on career paths for that major.</p>

8

<p>I think you’re looking for outside what you need to find inside. A small classroom won’t suddenly change your commitment to your major. However, if you need a change of pace, are you eligible for a semester abroad? A few classes at a consortium school? Could you intern or co-op to prepare you for that career? Since you appear to be attending a state university, would they allow you to spend a semester at home, taking cc courses that would transfer? </p>

<p>I don’t know what field you’re examining. College degrees can be a few things. They <em>can</em> give you a specific body of knowledge that is necessary for a career. They can also give you a credential (BA) that is almost incidental to the specific career but may be required for a job. You may be unprepared for a specific career but prepared for the general workforce. You just need to know how to find a job that suits you. I really think a few internships would help.</p>

9

<p>Well, I don’t think I can just “suddenly turn myself around”. Something has to change, right?</p>

<p>I think a big factor in that change would be getting my confidence back up somehow. </p>

<p>The only way I can think of doing that would be going to community college.</p>

<p>As it stands I’ve spent 3 yrs saying to myself “next year will be better, I’ve just got to turn it around” but as they say only the truly insane man does the same thing over and over again and expects the results to change…? </p>

<p>I am open to other suggestions about how to “turn things around” of course…</p>

<p>I do think the problem is partially the college, there’s no way around it. I’m extremely shy, I’m extremely into the humanities (not my college’s strength), I love small discussion-based classes (haven’t had any), I got lost trying to find my niche here. Of course, a truly successful person should be able to adapt to any learning environment. But there’s no doubt some learning environments are better than others for certain people?</p>

<p>I think it’s a “nature vs. nurture” argument. Some of it was undoubtably my fault. But I think it would be insincere to posit that everything would have been exactly the same had I gone to a very different school, correct?</p>

<p>If this wasn’t true people wouldn’t transfer, people wouldn’t spend weeks researching what schools to apply to, etc. I don’t know why the logic suddenly changes and it’s /all/ my fault and there’s NO WAY I’d do better in a different learning environment, etc.?</p>

10

<p>I think if you want to transfer, you should look at a 4-year school. George Mason is in the UMd consortium. I wonder if you took a class there if you could garner a teacher rec and transfer? The problem is if your gpa is low, you may not be accepted at a similar school and, frankly, the cc idea just sounds like you’re postponing adulthood at the risk of your future financial aid. </p>

<p>If part of your problem is shyness, you may also want to work with a counselor.</p>

11

<p>umpc11, college doesn’t necessarily “prepare you for a career” – that was the first point in your post that hit me anyway. Secondly it is quite possible that you are not so far down the path that you “have” to stick with the major you declared. If you were my son, and you are both at the same points in your college career, I’d suggest getting together with your advisor. Look at where you are, what credits you have toward your major, what credits you have outside your major, what classes you did WELL in…which might give you some insight into what it is that really interests you. Switching majors might extend your college a semester or two, but no more than if you try to swtich colleges (and there is no guarantee that the “new” college will accept all your classes as equivalent to their classes.) All college/unis vary regarding how many credit hours are required to major so you might not be in such a bad situation. Another thought I might toss to my son is to take a break. If nothing is interesting to you now, if no major sounds appealing, if there are no classes that you are doing well in, you might just need to take a step back in life and evaluate your situation. Not sure if you were going to take classes this summer or what your plans were, but maybe take some time, find a job and work for 6 months or a year until you figure out what it is that will spark interest in you. I’m not convinced by your post that you know yourself that an LAC is going to change your attitude. Most LACs also have a core curriculum and then work toward a major. The biggest difference is the size of the campus which yes, can change the size of the classes, but if you were my son I would ask are you sitting “down in front” of your lecture classes? Do you go to dicussion groups or TA sections? Have tried to break down your larger lecture classes or get to know your professors?</p>

12

<p>Are you on track to graduate in a year? It doesn’t sound as though you are sure.</p>

13

<p>Re: transferring…yes folks DO transfer. BUT I would venture that MOST do not transfer midway (or after) their Junior year in college. They transfer sometime during or after freshman or sophomore years. To get a degree…most schools DO have a residency requirement and a minimum number of courses you MUST take at their college/university.</p>

<p>I can’t see how going to a community college where you would be taking general education courses that you have already likely taken would improve your self confidence. The reality is that you’ve done that type of coursework already. Time to MOVE ON.</p>

<p>Many college graduates do NOT work in the field of their undergrad degree. Sometimes there just aren’t “jobs” in certain degree areas. How many “philosophers” have you seen advertised in the classifieds lately? Folks with this degree find themselves marketable in many fields of work. Some also go to grad school.</p>

<p>I would NOT advocate grad school full time for you right after undergrad, but you COULD take a course or two in the evenings to get a feel for your area of study.</p>

<p>You are making an assumption that if you go to an LAC with smaller classes, you will succeed. I find it amazing that you haven’t found smaller classes in your junior year…and hopefully in your senior year. </p>

<p>I would say…finish your bachelors. Then reevaluate what to do next. But that is my opinion.</p>

14

<p>I wondered if maybe you could elaborate on this need to build your confidence. Did your current school make you lose your confidence? So you had it before and now you do not? You weren’t shy, but now you are? </p>

<p>I can’t help but wonder if a) you are feeling bad about yourself and b) you have been unmotivated to the point of failing and c) disengaged from your environment and d) generally negative and not finding joy in all aspects of your life at college (advising, the different majors, the classes)…then possibly you are suffering from depression? Of course one could say its secondary (in that you are depressed to find yourself in this situation). But maybe depression is primary- that is, your depression explains what has happened to you and why you are in the situation you are in?</p>

<p>If that could possibly be true, then everything could change by treating your depression, first and foremost.</p>

15

<p>"You are making an assumption that if you go to an LAC with smaller classes, you will succeed. I find it amazing that you haven’t found smaller classes in your junior year…and hopefully in your senior year. "</p>

<p>That’s not the assumption at all…</p>

<p>The assumption is that going to CC could help me build my confidence back up, by taking some more general classes (that I got bad grades in here) and doing well in them. </p>

<p>Then, with some confidence under my belt, I would transfer to a school that is smaller and that I can feel more engaged in.</p>

<p>It’s a two part process in my mind.</p>

<p>And yes, it is amazing isn’t it? I have taken some smaller summer classes at my uni and I did great in them actually (took 4 and got straight As). But the reality is those kind of classes are extremely rare during the actual school year.</p>

<p>Of course, it may be possible that it’s impossible to do this (for financial reasons).</p>

<p>However, it seems plausible…after all…I have seen parents on this very forum tell kids whose parent’s won’t pay for school, etc. that it’s possible to work your way through. I believe Northstarmom worked her way through Harvard, correct?</p>

<p>The depression is definitely secondary as it only affects academics. I am certainly able to find joy/happiness in other things but school really gets me down.</p>

<p>“but if you were my son I would ask are you sitting “down in front” of your lecture classes? Do you go to dicussion groups or TA sections?”</p>

<p>Sitting down in front of a lecture class still doesn’t turn it into a discussion haha…also my classes don’t have discussion groups or TA sections. Classes with 300+ studnts may have sections but upper levels with 60-90 students usually don’t.</p>

<p>I’ve spoken to my profs and they’re nice people (during office hours lol, don’t try to ask them a question in the middle of a 90 person lecture), but it’s not the same as building from the collective energy of the class. Not the same at all…as I have discovered by taking smaller classes at my uni during “off” times.</p>

16

<p>What were the summer classes in? What major are you in? Some classes/majors lend themselves to smaller discussion classes. Other majors are pretty much by the book like engineering and some of the sciences and with all the kids running in that direction the classes are larger even at small schools. Was it class size or was it class topic? Did you “fail” the classes that you want to retake at a CC? If you did, then will the CC classes replace your failed classes so you are moving forward and not spinning your wheels? Do you have the GPA to transfer where you want to or do you “need” the CC classes to raise your GPA?</p>

17

<p>Many schools will not let you transfer in if you have more than 60 credits.</p>

18

<p>I know what it is like to struggle in college, trying to find your way and so forth, I had more then my share of issues with grades and so forth. What I can tell you is that these kind of issues are often problems that go much deeper then large class sizes and do forth, as you already started figuring out. In my case, it was issues like never having good study skills habit (I got through school, including high school,without having to work much) then found I had problems when I hit the ‘heavier stuff’…and yes, there were also issues with finding what I wanted to do, emotional issues, you name it…</p>

<p>Over time I did get through (not with a stellar GPA),and worked out my issues. I agree with others, you may want to try and slug it through and get a degree, at this point I suspect transferring to another school may be difficult, and also might lead to the same problems you face where you are, LAC’s claim small classes and so forth, sort of the “Dead Poets Society” atmosphere (that was a boy’s prep school, but similar idea) but you can get lost as easily there I suspect. In my case I started working before I had finished my degree…now for my suggestions…</p>

<p>1)Finish where you are. You might even think about switching majors, with the kind of grades you indicated it may not take any longer to graduate (not sure where you stand, obviously, so you may have core courses to do as well as major), if not then on your current track. If you are in a humanities program, if you go out into the ‘business world’ most likely, unless you were an english major and go work for a publishing house or a magazine or the like, your education background might have relevance (like in being able to write a decent sentence, read something and figure out what it really means,etc), but isn’t likely to be a direct route (even with traditional degrees, like comp sci, engineering, chemistry, etc, most kids when they come out realize how much they don’t know about the field:), there is always a steep learning curve, no matter the degree and what you go into generally. </p>

<p>2)another thing I can recommend is maybe take some time working if you do get finished. I can’t speak for everyone,but one of the turnarounds for me was when I started working (it turned out to be in a field I am still in in my case), and it made a big difference. Seeing what the ‘real world’ is like (college isn’t the real world, let me tell you, for a number of reasons), it gave me focus to finish my undergrad and go back to grad school and do well. In working, you see real challenges, you see where creativity is needed (or not), and generally start to get a handle on what you want to do (or not do). It was hard for me, in college, where more then a bit of the framework rested on courses where professors spat out information,you memorized it, and recited it back, or in my Comp sci courses where a lot of the stuff seemed esoteric theory (and a lot of it was/is to this day), it was hard for me to see that as the real world…working gives a lot of perspectives, and also tells you that you don’t want to do something (working with both lawyers and accountants in my first job, for example,told me neither was suitable for me:). </p>

<p>3)I also agree with others, you might want to talk to a counselor or therapist (schools often have programs like that, either in house or contracted out),they are there for that reason, to help. Maybe they can help figure out why you are having problems, why what you are doing isn’t working. I am sure you have asked yourself that many times, but speaking from experience it can be hard to get to the root of things. The other reason is that potentially the kind of issues that are hurting you in college may hurt you in ‘the real world’, in whatever profession you choose. Most workplaces are very dynamic places, even in small businesses, and there will be things you need to be able to do in those environments, that whatever issues you have may hurt you there. </p>

<p>I wish you luck.</p>

19

<p>

</p>

<p>Why not? I’ve taught many a large sections and most of the class is discussion based. It doesn’t have to be influenced by size. I realize you may not be comfortable with it, but that is a different issue. Just because it is not happening does not mean it can not or would not be appreciated. Most professors would also much prefer questions asked when everyone can benefit from the answer and pushign for discussion would enhance engagement (which professors much prefer). </p>

<p>How big do you think a Harvard MBA class is (or most top MBA class sizes)? And do you know that its case based-- which means the entire class is based on a discussion around a case?</p>

20

<p>umcp - I understand your frustration. It’s disappointing when things do not turn out like you hoped. And when you are young, what you hope for can change. Please take this in the spirit it is given – get over it! Bloom where you are planted. So you went to the wrong school, chose the wrong major…join the club! :)</p>

<p>Start with a new attitude today. You’ve gotten some good advice to finish where you are - and finish strong! You are fortunate to be in college without a lot of debt (imagine choosing the wrong school, wrong major AND being in 200K in debt!). </p>

<p>If when you graduate you decide to go to grad school, you’ll be better prepared to make better decisions. </p>

<p>Don’t look back, move on! I wish you all the best.</p>