What are your thoughts about travel in the time of Covid?

I’m not sure with my potential health issues exactly how much time I might expect. Therefore, we’re eager to keep exploring while we still can.

Someday I might go in and see if they can tell me more, but if it’s bad news, I don’t really want to know and wouldn’t plan to “do” anything about it anyway, so… not sure there’s a point other than depressing myself. If it’s good news that would be great - just not sure that’s the final verdict. Without knowing I can still enjoy myself. :wink:

2 Likes

I see my oncologist (who coordinates the study) tomorrow. Since they just announced the third dose last week, I figured I could wait til I see her to discuss.

4 Likes

What’s non-essential travel? Some examples by the government’s definition include seeing your family, even your fiancé, in another country. But most people affected by these restrictions (particularly the US ban on European travelers) might think that while a brief suspension of travel is one thing, 18 months is far too long.

1 Like

I just flew to visit my mom. I was nervous before going. What I noticed was mask compliance, the airport was full but 3 of the 4 flights were not. I had my own row for those flights. The FA was very nice and made sure people spread out of those flights that weren’t full.

My mom lives in a state where their Covid numbers are not good. We ate outside (it was hot though!) or got takeout. Limited our contact and wore our masks whenever we did need to go inside a store. Found that most of the other customers did also.

I’m really glad I didn’t cancel. And so was my mom.

5 Likes

If we had implemented a suspension of travel globally and consistenetly for two months at the beginning of the pandemic, we wouldn’t be where we’re now and would likely be free to travel anywhere. Inconsistently implemented half measures didn’t work and wouldn’t work in a pandemic.

3 Likes

Unless we miraculously eliminated the virus in those two months it would still be there after the two months and once things opened up again it would still march around the world. The reality is the virus was already spread around the world before we really even realized it.

1 Like

No, if the whole world were locked down strictly and in synchronized fashion for two months at the beginning of the pandemic, the virus would have been eliminated. It’s obviously too late now with the amount of virus in circulation.

1 Like

In theory I agree with you. In reality I don’t think it was possible. People still need to eat and most don’t have 2 months of food with them. Therefore they need to get food. They either get it themselves or it gets delivered. Either way, travel is involved.

Medical issues outside of Covid still happen. People have to travel/work to get treatment, even if just having a baby. This means medical supplies, including prescriptions, need to be delivered too - more travel.

Someone has to produce the food/medical supplies. Workers need to travel. Not all can abandon their families to live on site for 2 months.

Crime isn’t going to stop for 2 months, even if it’s domestic crime or drug addictions.

I could go on and on.

I think if people had been on board with stopping Covid at the beginning we could have by vastly reducing it until it died out, but the same folks who feel it isn’t an issue now felt it wasn’t an issue then, so that was impossible. You’re never going to convince 100% of the people to do the right thing, esp if they think it’s the wrong thing - or not helpful for themselves.

There’s an ideal world where you’re right, then there’s the real world unfortunately.

I’ve fully admitted before that I have no sympathy for the Covid deniers who don’t make it or have a rough go of it and realize they were wrong. The fewer there are in that camp the better off the world is I think - even if it’s for the next world emergency.

3 Likes

If we take a look at the island nations of Taiwan, Australia or New Zealand (or our own state of Hawaii), it shows that it’s possible to stop the spread of the virus, when they locked down. They survived much longer than two months. The virus was reintroduced there only when they opened up (partially) because the virus was everywhere else.

I do agree that the practicality of a synchronous lockdown is highly questionable, given the disparate political environments globally. One thing we do know (or should know) is that fighting a pandemic requires collective actions. Nations (and individuals) acting in their own self-interest is what the virus is counting on for its own survival and to succeed at our expense.

1 Like

They are islands… much easier to patrol islands. Even then, a case or two got through - I’ve always wondered if it was due to illegal substances making it in, complete with Covid.

Not all nations can feed themselves. Not all nations make medical supplies - we found out even the US was lax on that latter one.

Yes, they’re islands and that’s why they’re good examples to demonstrate that lockdown works. It can be applied to a whole continent if the actions are collective and synchronized.

Lockdown doesn’t mean supplies can’t be shipped everywhere. These island nations (or states) are far from self-sufficient. And they survived.

Ah, you mean just suspend travel - vacationers, business, etc. I’m used to folks telling me, “if just everyone had stayed in their house for X amount of time…” so was going off that. Sorry for the misunderstanding.

I think suspending travel itself might have worked at the very beginning, but once it was in a population, then people going to work, etc, meant it was past the point of no return.

1 Like

Australia is a good example of lockdowns not working - the Delta variant was introduced by one single US flight crew, passed on to their driver during the transit to their quarantine hotel, and is now out of control. And the consequences, with a hard lockdown starting in June and expected to last potentially until Christmas, are impossible for many people to live with (hence the daily protests/riots). Not to mention the fact that citizens are effectively banned from leaving or returning to Australia (which I suspect would be legally impossible in the US).

There is always a certain level of travel that is necessary for the world to operate, for example the container ships traveling across the oceans, or the car parts moving from Canada to the US and back again, or the trucks keeping the supermarkets supplied.

Locking down one Chinese city might have worked in Nov 2019, but by the time the rest of the world realized what was going on, the virus had spread extremely widely. In that context suspending air travel to the US in March 2020, especially as it didn’t and would have been all but impossible to apply to returning US citizens, was more for PR purposes than virus control. And it still is basically a PR stunt because you can enter the US from some countries and not others.

4 Likes

I wouldn’t call Australia an example of lockdown not working. It managed to stamp out a number of prior breakouts until the most recent one. The current lockdown in its NSW state started slowly and partially until it was much more widespread and into some highly congested low-income neighborhoods. Aussies, perhaps even more so than Americans, are very individualistic. Enforcement is the key. New Zealand and Taiwan also had Delta variant introduced to their territories by travelers/air crew. They took more prompt, and some would argue, more drastic measures and they seem to have succeeded in controlling the spread.

BTW, the reason these nations are still facing risks of the virus being reintroduced there is because the pandemic is out of control elsewhere. If we had all done what they did, we’d be looking at a different world.

1 Like

@showmom858 @Corinthian @Marilyn and @thumper1 thanks for the recommendations.

I did a little bit of research about the Volcan Mountain Trail which led to some reviews of the nearby Five Oaks Trail. We will give it a try. Being from the mid-Atlantic, I’m quite used to heat/hiking but we will adjust our plans if necessary.

I did find a driving tour through Anza-Borrego so we may do some of that but only the parts not requiring 4WD (we have that but I don’t want to attempt w/o DH!). We may just drive to Julian early, hike, then have lunch and pie , maybe shop if not busy, then head back.

Not sure we will go to Temecula. I don’t really want to go anywhere that’s crowded and we can only go on a weekend so may skip that this trip.

1 Like

My D19 leaves this weekend for a semester abroad in Italy. It has been so touch and go the whole time I almost still won’t believe it is happening until she is there. The restrictions seem to change weekly. Last week she only needed proof of vaccination or a negative Covid test, as of this week she needs both.

Her program usually has about 250-300 students. As of two weeks ago it was down to 50. This morning they sent a final list and there are only 27 kids going! I don’t know if kids dropped out this week due to kids not being vaccinated? I feel a little bad for her because she was looking forward to going with a bigger group, but not that bad because she still gets to live in Rome. :slight_smile:

DH and I wanted to visit while she was there but I feel like I need to wait and see what is happening now. DH is waiting on his passport renewal so we were not going to go until November so we have time but of course the prices will go up as we get closer. I would hate to waste the opportunity but with how things are going we are going to have to play it by ear.

1 Like

“There is always a certain level of travel that is necessary for the world to operate, for example the container ships traveling across the oceans, or the car parts moving from Canada to the US and back again, or the trucks keeping the supermarkets supplied.”

True, but I’m talking about leisure travel. Not essential travel.

1 Like

So is it acceptable to ban going to your father/child/sibling’s funeral/wedding/graduation etc.? Acceptable to ban seeing your fiancé?

There are lots of reasons to travel that are not just about “leisure”. And that it is unreasonable to cut off for 18 months with no sign of anything changing.

1 Like

Amtrak - grr! We may never be using them again even though originally we had been musing about more trips along their scenic lines after the first half of our recent trip. As stated before, that “love Amtrak giving them a 9/10” rating only knocking them because they didn’t enforce Covid masks dropped to a 2/10 when they needlessly banished us to our room during the most scenic part of the CA Zephyr so “everyone would have a change in the Observation car,” though the Observation car was never full. With us being in a car where the announcements didn’t work at all, we didn’t get notified and missed out according to people we’d been sitting and conversing with who were in coach.

So, afterward, H and I were unexpectedly comparing points in their Membership program being alerted to them via e-mail. He has 5x what I have for the same trip. What gives? I called for the reservations and paid for the trip with my credit card. Thinking it was a simple error I emailed them (too long to wait on hold for a call), just to get an email back a few days later saying I needed to call. Fortunately they gave me a number with shorter wait times.

Dude 1 explained that the difference was H being the primary person listed on the ticket. He got all the points for our rooms. I explained to him that H makes absolutely none of our reservations for travel, so if one of us needs to be primary, it should be me because more points = more coupons and “benefits,” none of which H will know about because he doesn’t arrange our travel - or care about getting involved other than my giving him options, etc. We didn’t make our own reservation - we called and an Amtrak lady did it for us. Since the US is a male dominated country and we females (who are doing the calling and paying) are second class apparently, she put his name as primary. I had no idea I needed to change it. I really don’t care whose name is first, assuming we’re all equal - except with Amtrak you’re not equal. First gets points.

But still… no big deal. Swap the points and we’re good. We’ll know for another time and IF I opt for Amtrak again, then I’ll know what deals they are offering.

Dude 1 can’t do that and transfers me to Customer Service who he said could.

Lady 1 in Customer Service says they can’t do that, only Guest Relations (Dude 1) can. But, she says H can go online and share the points with me for free - emphasis on for free. I specifically asked.

Fine. Whatever. Solves the problem. Except “for free” costs us $40 when H gets to the website. No, I’m not paying that.

Call Guest Relations again, get Dude 2 who is adamant that they can’t do it, only Customer Service can and tells me it’s my fault for not knowing I had to be the Primary person listed on the ticket to get credit for it. He ends up transferring me to Customer Service again telling me they can do it.

Lady 2 says they can’t do that, but she will open a case where they can review it. I suggest giving us a $40 voucher so H can just use that for the “free” share Lady 1 told us about. “Can’t do that. It’s not Amtrak’s mistake.” WTH? I called and they made the reservation - never telling me a thing about being primary if I wanted points for the trip. I explained that I do 99.9% of our travel planning and reservations and would be the one wanting to see the deals, etc. And they’re quibbling over $40 to exchange points allowing this to happen. I’m not even asking for more points or anything “extra” on their part - just an exchange.

They say I’ll hear back in 4-7 days by email.

They have no idea how much we spend traveling or how often we travel (a lot!), but they know they have a “new” customer who just spent a fair bit (albeit it was a good deal) on a 2 week trip and is interested in seeing what deals they have to offer in the future. Yet they’re quibbling over $40 to make it happen - not changing a thing in their system actually giving us “more” since we’d be switching points.

I’m pretty sure I know one reason why Amtrak is in major financial trouble.

Add that to not enforcing masks when they say they are going to and denying someone who paid for first class on an Anniversary trip a chance at seeing 1/2 of the best scenery on the most scenic train (without any prior warning) and I can tell you how likely we are to choose Amtrak again. And I get to make the decisions.

I’m glad Canada has the line going through there. Next year we might be on it - if we’re not seeing other great scenery somewhere else.

Anyway, just sharing “the rest of the story” in case anyone was inspired to try Amtrak due to our trip. Be sure the person you want to have the most points for future benefits is the lead person on any joint ticket…

1 Like