We had a conversation with our daughter and she told us she does not know what she wants to study. A while ago she mentioned finance but now she is totally unclear even general area of study. We asked her what subjects at school she likes most and she said all are OK but none she is especially passionate about.
So what do we do now? Are there any schools that can admit her without any selection and may permit selecting overall specialization, not just major during or after freshman year?
It is clear that any OOS or expensive private school makes no sense now. We live in NJ and my wife works for Rutgers so Rutgers seems to be the best choice and by far the cheapest one (tuition is free for us, we will have to pay for room, board and books). I am pretty confident that my daughter will be accepted to Rutgers, maybe even to Honor’s college. However, it seems even Rutgers requires selecting specific school when applying. One can specify up to 3 schools I believe in priority order.
If she will be required to select specific school, how easy or difficult to switch schools? How far in her her study will she be able to do this without significantly loosing what she studied already?
Where else does make sense for her to apply besides Rutgers?
To change to a different division at Rutgers, you may have to do some digging around Rutgers’ web site. Each division may have different internal transfer criteria.
Also, some majors within a division may be competitive admission. Some (particularly engineering majors) may have sequenced or voluminous prerequisites that need to be started early, so a student who wants to switch to them later may have to “catch up” and may need extra semesters.
There is no point to pay huge amount of money for Harvard if later she decides to be a teacher. It will make very little impact if any on teacher’s career if she graduates from Harvard or Rutgers. And average teacher’s salary will not be large enough to support $250k+ Harvard tuition + graduate degree many schools require.
The better question is, why do you think she has to know what she wants to major in when she enters college?
She should apply to colleges she likes, that you can afford, and offer a wide range of areas of study. Even if she “chooses” an area of study NOW, there’s a good chance she’ll change her mind. Thirty-three percent of bachelor’s degree candidates who begin college pursuing a specific major change their mind within three years. Nine percent change their minds more than once. Interestingly, students who enter college thinking they will study a STEM field are more likely to change their minds than non-STEM majors, and math majors in particular are likely to change – 52% of incoming math majors change their minds. https://nces.ed.gov/pubs2018/2018434.pdf
But I’ve also seen statistics that 75% of students either enter undecided or change their majors. That means only 25% of students enter with a field of study in mind AND stick with it.
She does not know what colleges she wants. She provides absolutely no input.
Changing majors specifically crossing schools (eng <-> business for instance) in the middle of the college is very bad idea. College is very expensive endeavor and this change will mean she will lose a semester or two in study and this costs a lot of money.
I am really upset about this situation but nothing I can do about it and just trying to understand what our options are.
So far only Rutgers makes some sense for us. But we obviously cannot apply just to one college. And even for Rutgers she will have choose at least the school.
Solution #1: She doesn’t have to go to a school that has several undergraduate colleges.
Solution #2: I just read a study showing that students who change their major are MORE likely to graduate than students who do not.
Solution #3: If Rutgers is free to you, why would it matter if she stayed beyond four years?
This student is not ready for college. A gap year may be in order.
She’s applying to college. Not you. Don’t apply for her. Hand her the Fiske Guide and tell her to figure it out. If you do all the work, she’s a lot less likely to be happy with where she ends up, and that certainly will not meet your goal of making college as inexpensive as possible if she drops out.
@brantly
“Solution #1: She doesn’t have to go to a school that has several undergraduate colleges.”
I don’t understand what this means.
Rutgers is not free for us. Tuition is free, room, board and books are not free and this is half of total cost of attendance. Each year she is lingering in college figuring out what she wants means not only we have to pay this room, board and books, but also she is not working with graduating after normal standard 4 years. Assuming she would earn $55k after college you add this to extra cost of this indecision.
I am not forcing any decision on her. I am just trying to collect information to understand what our daughter’s options are.
The most common major at most schools is “undecided”. Usually under a liberal arts track. If you had an engineering student you would know that by now. Many students don’t know what they want to do till end of sophomore year. It’s OK and normal. If she’s been a good student till now that is usually not going to change going forward. Some kids just need time to discover themselves and their interests. Don’t get to involved on CC where everyone’s kid knew at birth what they wanted to do. Let her develop her interests if she needs time.
She is not a party girl. She is rather serious girl and she is a good student. She just just does not what she wants and somewhat difficult to communicate to.
If a LAC would be suitable, then there would not be the issue of potentially changing division at Rutgers, since the range of majors offered at a LAC would be within Rutgers’ School of Arts and Sciences (i.e. not requiring a change of division).
Except for the obvious budding engineers/computer scientists who are tinkering and programming in their free time, I think most kids don’t really know their majors. That’s why most change majors. Or, go to grad school later on. We’ve had these concerns (one in college, 2 rising juniors), none of whom really know what they want to major in. That’s why I’m such a big fan of liberal arts colleges. She wouldn’t pick a major until end of sophomore year. And, a major doesn’t necessarily correlate to a particular job. Some jobs we have today won’t exist in 10 yrs. First, I’d determine if she’s really ready for college: will she do the work to see what colleges she likes? If not, maybe she would benefit from a gap year. If she is ready for college, look at LACs with merit aid (match her stats, see where she’s likely to get aid). Look at St. John’s (great books program). Or, if she likes Rutgers, Arts and Sciences has the most diverse majors. She’ll have general requirements in different areas and will likely find something interesting. Unless kids come from families where they’re fed the “you’re going to be a doctor/lawyer/investment banker” since they were born, this is how most kids figure out their majors.
This is generally the case in the liberal arts or arts and sciences division at a large university. Even then, whether at a LAC or a large university, the student does need to be aware of prerequisite requirements so that s/he does not try to choose a major in his/her fourth semester that would require three semesters of “catch up” because it has a prerequisite sequence that was supposed to have been started in the first semester.
@Al73 You said “Changing majors specifically crossing schools (eng ↔ business for instance) in the middle of the college is very bad idea.”
So, you alluded to universities that have more than one undergraduate school Like Rutgers, which has the School of Arts and Sciences, School of Communication and Information, School of Engineering, School of Environmental and Biological Sciences, School of Management and Labor Relations, Mason Gross School of the Arts, etc. Those are the Undergraduate colleges. I would argue your point that it’s a “very bad idea” to change schools/colleges within the university. But that’s a different subject. If she goes to, say, Middlebury College, she/you will not have to worry about changes schools if she changes her major.
As everyone here has said, MOST college students enter undecided. This is not a problem. You are thinking that this is a huge issue to overcome. This is not the case. Besides, if she is giving no input and has no opinion about WHERE she wants to go, she is not ready for college.
I don’t think because someone doesn’t know what they want to major in, they aren’t ready for college. I didn’t know what i wanted to major in. I switched 3 times. She can start and figure it out. I would think if she was looking at engineering, she would at least have an inkling in that direction.
Do you get a break at any of the other state schools? My son is at Rowan, it’s pretty easy to switch majors, outside of engineering. Depending on her stats, look at schools where she would get merit so the cost isn’t out of control. Susquehanna comes to mind. Lycoming College. Smaller, more affordable LACs where they can take time to decide while exploring different classes.
I agree on all counts. She would know by now if she wanted to be an engineering major or a business major. Those are very specific tracks. She’s not going to wake up in six months and want to study those if she’s not interested now. And, one can go into business without a business degree. Sometimes, it’s even preferred. A majority of liberal arts majors from colleges go into business after undergrad. I know people like the OP in my family. Want their kids to pick a track because they think school is expensive and they want a guarantee that their child has a plan. That has not turned out well for the kids I know. They both chose a business degree at a big school because that’s what their parents wanted. They didn’t enjoy the classes and are now bored at their jobs. Both felt like they needed time to explore and it wasn’t possible to switch out of the business school when they did start to feel like they knew what they wanted. One really wanted to be a teacher. One really wanted to major in environmental studies. Now I guess it will be up to them to figure out how to chase their dreams on their own dime.
The OP’s daughter should choose a school based on fit and affordability. She will figure out a major.
@Al73 Also, I started a thread a few days ago because our D21 is undecided and trying to start a list. I’m not sure how to add a link to that thread but just click on my name and look at my threads. You’ll find it there. Lots of good advice.
Advising undecided students is actually a thing (and there is scholarly work on types of undecided, what kind of advising is most helpful, etc.). Rutgers itself notes on their website that “undecided is the most popular major”. The advisor should work with the student to make sure that the courses they take as the explore their options will contribute to meeting SAS Core requirements- but those requirements are also online. Arts & Sciences is a big cohort and it unlikely in the extreme that she would get an offer but not get A&S.
The only part that I would be worried about in your situation is this:
That is a problem. Do you have any read on what that is about? (obviously you don’t have to answer that here). Could she be anxious about getting into, or going off to college? The external & internal pressures of the college process can be overwhelming to a kid. Could she want things she is anxious about you knowing? A conflict between what she really wants and what she thinks you will accept can be an obstacle. If there is truly no communication I would pull in an outside counselor of some sort. Pushing a young adult a direction that they don’t want to (or are afraid to) go backfires more often than not.