<p>I love Berurah’s advice.</p>
<p>Love and accept your son for who he is. Don’t make him something he isn’t.</p>
<p>He has already excelled by completing college. He won’t be a disappointment to you, unless your expectations make him so. Accept his laid-back personality, and see it as a gift against the stressed out type A people. He will be fine.</p>
<p>amen to the laundry tsdad!</p>
<p>
This quote, coupled with your description of him as fun, friendly, and responsible enought to get his work done on time, screams out to me ----- Votech. A mechanically inclined kid who can relate to customers and shows he can meet deadlines will go far. Learning CAD/CAM. A wide variety of mechanic opportunities. Utility work. Electrician & plumbers. Computer techs. The list is endless & can lead to a very satisfying & llucrative career.</p>
<p>“S is very good mechanically and would” probably be happy to take that route but is it in his best interest long term? "</p>
<p>He’d probably go far in fields related to mechanics, and could be happier and more financially successful than many humanities, social science and arts majors and doctorate holders who are in a lot of debt related to their education, and can’t find jobs in their field.</p>
<p>I am welling up with tears here over your responses. It just seems as if two worlds are colliding at once in our household. After reading your very thoughtful comments, I do realize it is me who has the problem. I am very proud of the fact that he has completed college. I will leave it with that. The rest of course is up to him. I definitely do not want to interfere with his life plans; but, I am expecting him to pay for the things that he wants. How he does it will be of his own making. </p>
<p>This has been very therapeutic. I am grateful to all of you. I am also laughing at the laundry comment. Yes, he is excellent at doing laundry!! I am going to give him a big hug when I see him next and tell him how very proud I am of him. I will also get working on that list-anitaw.</p>
<p>CC is a strange place, and I think the OP is one of the most honest parents.</p>
<p>Often, decriptions of kids are full of superlatives, many this, excellent that…perfection all around</p>
<p>this thread is real, this thread is what the real world of kids is like</p>
<p>the advice is all spot on, your son is following his own path- he doesn’t hurt people, he is a functioning adult, he is who he is</p>
<p>We need people in this world who support others, who are kind, gentle, who live their lives, and not everyone feels the need to be the “best” according to OTHERS standards, but to be content</p>
<p>there is nothing wrong at all with being content, living a nice life, taking care of themselves, helping friends, working, reading, enjoying themselves</p>
<p>not everyone’s life needs to be a battle for being on"top" - a very relative word</p>
<p>my H is a contractor, he is one of the best men and best fathers I have ever met </p>
<p>Our mechanics are men of honor and pride, my neighbor, who works for Bart, is sweet, cute and a success</p>
<p>We don’t show enough respect for the laborers of our nation, who do the real work, and sometimes that is the direction a young man or woman should take- gardeners, landscapers, roofers, firemen, fisherman, clerks, bus drivers, tow truck drivers, there are jobs everywhere…and maybe a year of real work can guide some kids- they may find their niche, they may say, I want college</p>
<p>not everyone wants a high falutin job, nor would they be happy there</p>
<p>My neices all switched aroun majors, worked all through college and are at 30 just finding ther passions- ones a nurse, the other a clinical therapist for kids </p>
<p>It took time, but we were so proud- they wer ehappy, working hard, having good friends and relationships- no drugs, no jail, no harm</p>
<p>What you do is set up rules- pay some rent if they are at home, they need to be working, they need to be respectful, if they move out, then you will help out, but they need to be doing what adults do</p>
<p>some people bloom at 17, some at 30…both are okay so long as the aren’t hurting themselves or others</p>
<p>be grateful that they are healthy, and still in your lives, without major issues or hassles</p>
<p>this, we parents can handle</p>
<p>I thought that you’d like to hear about some of the sons of people whom I know. All of the parents have advanced degrees, professional jobs, are nice people, and, in general, don’t talk about their problems with their sons, so most people have no clue that the parents have these kind of troubles. Some of the parents are college professors or are in the helping professions. Most are church goers, community volunteers, in stable-appearing marriages.</p>
<p>Trust me: You have lots to be proud of. Your S is a shining success.</p>
<ol>
<li><p>S, community college student with grade problems, was arrested for stealing a motorcycle to go joy riding apparently while high.</p></li>
<li><p>S, a community college student was arrested for drunk driving.</p></li>
<li><p>S, who is in his early 30s, just got arrested – again – after prematurely leaving court-ordered drug rehabilitation. He has served jail time.</p></li>
<li><p>S, who is in his early 30s, is in prison for robbing a bank while trying to get $ for his drug habit.</p></li>
<li><p>S, who is in his early thirties, is a college drop out who holds jobs that barely pay the rent. He has 2 children by 2 different women. His mother is a college professor and is a member of a very conservative religious denomination.</p></li>
<li><p>S is in his 20s, living at home, jobless, hangs out with thugs and is verbally abusive to his mother.</p></li>
<li><p>S is in his early 40s, living with his dad, minimally employed and alcoholic. who is minimally employed.</p></li>
</ol>
<p>I want to chime in with all the wonderful responses, especially those celebrating the many aspects of this young man that are wonderful. I am new to the forum but have things in common with many on this thread. I joined to help my hard-driving, ambitious, directed oldest D, who is now deciding between Hopkins, Cornell, Wellesley, and possibly other choices. I, too, am a Harvard grad, and am getting over (sniff, sniff:) the fact that D was rejected there. </p>
<p>I also have a younger S who has higher SATs (taken in 7th grade for an enrichment program) but is kind of a slug. I could easily see myself feeling the same way as janesmom1 in a few years. </p>
<p>However, there is nothing like a little “shock and awe” to make one appreciate the simple stuff, such as the laundry (does this young man give lessons?). We have nearly survived a rather shocking ninth grade year of events among S’s classmates. Luckily, S has not been involved in any of this. S attends an expensive private college prep school, where there have been three arrests of 9th graders for lifting or substance abuse-related crimes. There are some very serious substances being used (and dealt), IMHO. </p>
<p>I’m a doctor and have always worked in the “grittier” side of life. I trained in NYC at the height of the crack epidemic. I’ve seen a lot of self-destructive behavior in my lifetime, but never in people this young, and never so rampant in this socioeconomic strata. I thought maybe I accidentally chose a school for spoiled rich kids for my S. Older D is at another local private prep HS, not without issues, but certainly without this degree of problems. D is shocked as well. </p>
<p>However, I learned recently that a neighboring similar private HS kicked out an underclassman for dealing meth. An acquaintance of S, whom I know peripherally—good kid, nice public suburban HS, lots of ECs, employed— is in rehab for prescription drug abuse. A HS kid died of Ecstasy OD here last year. Two days ago, I heard a credible story of 9th graders in the best-rated suburban public school near us using meth with viagra. In my business, we see this behavior only among much older people, usually lower SES, who are getting care for conditions acquired because of other risky behavior. </p>
<p>Recently, I received a professional notice of an HBO special about addiction, produced jointly with the National Institute of Drug Abuse, downloadable free (you bet, I got it!) Apparently our nice, medium sized West Coast city is not the only community waking up to some very nasty coffee. I am wondering if we are at the dawn of a new scary era, sort of a “Nouveau Sixties”. </p>
<p>I continue to be shocked—but now grateful for my absent-minded but well-meaning S. One of S’s teachers told me he’s like a puppy. I’ll take the puppy, any day! It would be nice if he learns to do his laundry, yes. But as long as he remains healthy, clean and sober, I’ll be happy.</p>
<p>Thank you for contributing to this post, particularly Northstarmom and janesmom1. I also have a S who has underachieved so far, has gotten by on intelligence, has a hard time completing assignments on time, says he is bored in school and is very defensive about his lack of work ethic. Each term, he seems to dig himself into a hole and to spend his time and alot of emotional stress fighting to dig himself out again. I have tried to point this pattern out to him and suggested how much easier his life would be if he stopped digging that hole, but he seems unable or unwilling to stop doing it. I have tried to figure out when or whether this is likely to change after he goes to college. I guess there is no way of knowing. I have suggested a gap year between high school and college, but he says he wants to go right to college after high school. I do know that underachieving seems to have reached epidemic proportions among boys; my S goes to a very competitive high school with a huge (and generally ignored) gap between most of the boys and the girls. Any further thoughts or suggestions would be most appreciated.</p>
<p>Markr,
I don’t know how old your S is, but if he is not yet a senior, I suggest making sure that he sees colleges and knows how to apply. I also suggest that you make sure he takes the ACT or SAT so he’ll have the scores he’ll need to apply. After you do that, I suggest that you NOT structure him so that he makes a list of where to apply and gets his applications in.</p>
<p>If he is ready for college, he’ll get the apps in. If not, better to find that out before he goes to college than after you spend big bucks to pay for him to goof around and get low grades.</p>
<p>Let him know that if he doesn’t go to college and chooses to live at home, he’ll have to pay a reasonable amount of rent. Stick to that. Also let him know about jobs, Americorps and similar programs. If he says he wants to move out of the house after h.s. and not go to college, show him the classifieds and tell him how he can earn the money to attain his dream. Looking at the classifieds was a big wake up call for younger S as was his seeing how far his $200 a week Americorps stipend goes (especially when he has to pay us rent and pay for gas for the car that he uses). He know knows why college is important. He also learned first hand that the work world doesn’t have the kind of relatively high tolerance for procrastinators and people who are late that high school teachers have.</p>
<p>I had tried everything to get S more motivated. This included sending him to a counselor to help him learn time management; having him assessed for ADD and treated with some kind of biofeedback; having him see a social worker who was expert with gifted kids who are slackers. Of course, my husband and I also talked to teachers, etc. None of those seemed to motivate S as much as being in the real world and paying rent (along with being responsible for his personal expenses). </p>
<p>I regret that I structured older S so he went to college right after h.s. because he would have benefited by spending an additional year at home instead of going straight to college, flunking out and then moving 3,000 miles away from us.</p>
<p>Incidentally, both of my kids as seniors said they wanted to go straight to college. The proof of the pudding, however, is if they manage to get applications in without parents’ forcing them to or doing most of the selecting and other app work for them. Both sons also had SATs in the 98th-99th percentile as h.s. juniors, were National Merit commended, and qualified for the Talent Search program when they were middle schoolers.</p>
<p>Thanks for the replies,ideas and encouraging words. citygirlsmom, thanks for the “shout out” to the workingman/woman. I can see my S doing some of those kinds of jobs. So many people look at those jobs as “well, you weren’t smart enough to do anything else”. H and I believe this is far from true. </p>
<p>My brother never went to college, started out doing construction and is now Asst. Director of Buidling Services at a large state university. My S is much like him in personality. H (an engineer) works in a power plant with lots of welders, electricians,machinists, etc. and has great respect for their knowledge and expertise (plus the fact that his company is looking for electricians with 2 year degrees to start off making $25/hr.). He thinks S would be a perfect fit for something like that or similiar. More and more I tend to agree but just worried that I would be doing the wrong thing by not encouraging 4 year college.
Our local CC offers some great programs and S will get to try it out next school year when he can take part in the College Experience program his school offers. He will take one less h.s. class each semester and take a CC class in it’s place. The school system pays for turition and books and he still gets a high school credit for the CC class plus a college credit. Right now he’s planning to take Intro. to Business and an Auto. Tech class. Our newspaper reported last week that the Toyota program at our CC was ranked in the top ten in the country. </p>
<p>I guess when they are born you just always think they’ll grow up and go to college and if/when that doesn’t happen it just requires some attitude/mindset readjustment. I just want him to be happy and successful/self supporting in something he enjoys and is good at no matter where the degree comes from.</p>
<p>Packmom: what a great opportunity for your S! My S who is good at math/science but also has Aspergers went through a difficult struggle trying to decide which direction to take after high school. All through high school he heard everyone telling him to go into engineering but he also recognized that he was not the most creative person in the world and might be happier doing something hands-on but less demanding. We debated the Vo-tech vs engineering options and in the process I discovered that there is now a path in-between, called engineering technology. There are many colleges that offer either 2 year or 4 year Engineering Technology degree programs. </p>
<p>Since my S had his heart set on a “traditional” college experience (and the overall academic smarts to get in) this seemed the perfect path for him to take. He has decided to follow his dream of being an engineer and is at Northeastern where the hope is that the co-op opportunities will make the classes more bearable (they also have an Engineering Technology School, another reason we had considered them besides for the co-ops). But the reality is that even if he gets a degree in Engineering he could very easily end up with a job that would have required a lesser degree just because of who he is. </p>
<p>Anyway, I just wanted to mention that there are some other options out there besides the more traditional Vo-Tech vs Engineering options…</p>
<p>scansmom, I have looked into those programs. Our CC is really large and offers Assoc. degrees in civil, mechanical and electrical engineering tech. which can transfer to a 4 year sch. Even those degrees call for more Calculus than S is capable of. He’s not a math guy.
Our CC builds co-op experience into many of their programs which I think is a really good thing. S has a friend doing the 2 year auto tech. co-op program who has made $30,000 this year while still in school and has been promised a fulltime job at the dealership upon grad. in May.</p>
<p>PackMom: Sounds like your S will do just fine! Btw, I have a friend whose S dropped out of college this past year and after much prodding by parents to return to school, he decided to enroll in a short certificate program for automotive technology at the local Vo-Tech. My friend in an attempt to dissuade S from this course of action dragged him over to their local car dealer friend who they thought could set S straight on the financial disadvantages, and it was the parents who had their eyes opened!!!</p>
<p>Thanks, I sure hope so. School has never been his thing, now football is a different story. He works his @@ off for football because he loves it and is good at it. I’m hoping he will find that in another area when high school is over.</p>
<p>
Absolutely. A mechanic who is a certified technician easily makes six figures with a bit of overtime around here. If you are willing to take on the headaches of owning your own repair place some day, the sky is the limit. </p>
<p>I have an ex-military friend who works as a security guard & opened a painting business. He has more energy than any human I know. When he mows his lawn he jogs…you get the picture. That work ethic in his painting biz has landed some very, very lucrative commercial contracts. I could go on and on. So many people who swing hammers, or use their muscles to make a living in a variety of fields, are deliriously happy, enjoying independence and lots of $$$.</p>
<p>janesmom, don’t apply ‘girl’ rules to a fella. The hard-driving student spot has already been filled in your family. He’s chosen another identity. Don’t underestimate him.</p>
<p>Sociability in a man is worth almost as much as a girl’s 3.7 GPA from Harvard, if you ask me. My H’s buddy graduated from Not HYP with a 3.0 and a million friends. He said he learned how to make friends incollege. When he got out of college, he found work in the telecommunicaitons industry–where he earned a few hundred million dollars before he was 40.</p>
<p>I hired a sweet young man who was so dense, he would leave his car running in the parking lot by mistake. He married a stunning girl, has three children–and was just promoted to a top job in one of the top credit card companies after working his way up from the absolute bottom. Key trait? He’s likeable. I’ll bet some male mentor adopted him at work and showed him how to put a career together. His wildly successful FIL probably had some input too, LOL.</p>
<p>Besides, it’s not too late. You can help your son figure out how to get the best job. You can help him work those connections he’s made over the years. You can encourage him to take risks in his job application process. My best friend says that the transistion from college to work is the biggest one a guy makes–and if you can provide some grease for that move–well you’ll come out smelling like roses, janesmom. He probably has NO idea you are full of angst btw.</p>
<p>Finally, if you raised him right, he is a lovely egalitarian boy who will make some hard driving woman a wonderful husband. She could take him on an amazing adventure–ya never know. Be sure you speak up about how much you like those hugely capable girlfriends. ;)</p>
<p>^^^^Funny you should say that Cheers about a laid back S meeting power driven woman. The girls who hang out with my likable, football player, car crazy S and his friends are all at the top of their class!</p>
<p>Janesmom:</p>
<p>You will find that lots of college graduates take one year or two off before either going to grad school or buckling down to a serious job. It may be due to burnout after 16 years of being in school, it may be due to lack of clear direction, it may be due to immaturity. Just know that your kid is not unusual.</p>
<p>Janesmom: </p>
<p>Glad to see that you are coming out of the mom funk caused by Worrying In Advance Syndrome. You had a bad case there for awhile. Kid isn’t even out of college yet and you’re worried that he will never find a job to support himself. You need a vacation from the mom gig, as we all do at times.
I am familiar with this syndrome as I’ve caught myself worrying years in advance …Sure, he’ll get a graduate degree, I guess, but what if he can’t find a job in his field!!! He got an 800 in math and he has to major in humanities. Aughhh! WIAS in full tilt until I throttle back those mom emotions and realize that his future is no longer in my hands. It’s up to him. (He’s only a freshman BTW.)</p>
<p>So kudos to your son for showing the initiative to go to college, though he could have laid back, and for getting all the way through and EARNING his degree. I suspect that there are some still waters running deep in your young man and he may have more ideas than he is letting on at this point. And keep in mind that it’s not that strange or worrisome for a student to need a breather between college and the next step and to not be focused on having jobs or grad school lined up for right after graduation. One friend’s son graduated from Berkeley last year with a degree in psychology and is taking a year off — a delayed gap year — to travel, play music with friends, visit graduate schools and think about his future plans. My other friend has a very smart son who is only now, at 21, finishing up a 2-year degree and applying to four-year colleges because he now has the motivation to pursue his interests seriously. This is a kid who dropped out of his arts magnet high school, but learned enough film editing there to work full time in the field for small businesses (not the movie industry.) He now sees the benefit in getting a college degree so he can start his own business and then work to take it global. Classic late bloomer. </p>
<p>I think we moms tend to beat ourselves up more over perceived flaws in how our kids have "turned out’’ but there comes a time when responsibility for how they live and the choices they make passes from us to them. You’ve done a good job and you should be proud of him and yourself.</p>