I have to say that at 18, I made a few decisions that my parents wouldn’t like (and never found out about LOL). At 19, I made a decision that they never ever would have approved of had I asked them. It all worked out for me, but I can see how a parent would want some say in a college choice, just not how the child could get through applying to too small a number of schools in order to have mutually agreed upon choices as an option.
I guess that’s why some kids apply to 10 or 15 or 20 schools, they want to be able to convince their parents of some school they really like, if they only get a few acceptances.
Since you don’t like emails or private messages, I will tell you out in the open that discussing and disparaging moderation on the public boards is a violation of the Terms of Service. Since you already violated the ToS once today, you are now banned for three weeks. I suggest you take the time to read those terms and think about your behavior at the same time.
@WallyBrown, no, I am not kidding and there in lies your problem. You see this only from one narrow point of view. This precisely is what any ranking system does, sees things from one narrow point of view. I have no idea what the student wants to major in, but let’s say, sciences. They’ll have far more opportunity to do meaningful lab research at a big state than at at tiny liberal arts school. Let’s say they want to work in the south. Many more recruiters will come to SC than to Colgate. The point being that it isn’t all about the bumper sticker, of which Colgate isn’t all that anyway. It’s about the right fit for the student.
The OP is now suspended, but I wanted to make a point which he seemed impervious to: not everything is about a “brand’s” status or prestige. This is not a question of a student choosing an unaccredited college. It is merely about relative prestige. I don’t like certain status brands simply because they don’t appeal to me. If someone prefers a juicy cheeseburger to Beef Wellington, should another person disparage that decision. I have never liked the iconic “LV” Louis Vuitton line - the colors and design don’t appeal. If offered a choice between a Vuitton bag and one that appealed to me more, but with a less prestigious brand, should I choose the Vuitton simply because it might confer more status? Perhaps a mind of one’s own has intrinsic value. Imagine an interview wherein the applicant, when asked what compelled him to attend Colgate, said “my parents,” as opposed to one where the same applicant could articulate the reasons HE chose one college over another.
Notre Dame grads have a very high opinion of Notre Dame.
Many of us have a very high opinion of our own alma maters. I believe with my whole heart and brain that my alma mater is the best university in the universe and always will be. But, it turns out that it is not right for everyone. Hmmm……
@robbietoy, that assumes your LAC is doing any meaningful research. I was just offering that as a for instance. It might not have been the best choice.
In reality, doing “research” as an UG is really limited anyway no matter where you go. Undergrads don’t have anything yet to offer other than muscle as lab techs. No matter where you are though, opportunity will come to those who persistently and actively seek it. That means going to office hours in classes even if you’re doing well to build relationships.
I don’t think that is always true. My D2 researched with a comp sci prof last summer after freshman year, and found something in the research data that gave her an idea she mentioned to him. The prof is now pursuing it as a new line of research and seeking funding for it. As her school does not have grad students, the profs have a vested interest in bringing them up to speed as soon as possible so they really can help with research as more than just “muscle”. I have actually met very few students in the sciences who were unhappy with their research experiences on campus, or their ability to get REU options at other colleges in the summers. Not to disparage the research university at all, but I think there is an assumption out here sometimes that LAC students just don’t get good research experiences that I think isn’t true a lot of the time.
Yes, weather is a criteria. I’ve known kids who had to transfer because they simply couldn’t take it–too depressing.
If you grow up in sunshine you want to stay there.
I have no idea about this. Is it in general that there are more well-to-do kids in a LAC than in a flagship public.
One coworker told me that the high school that DS went to was full of drugs because the student’s family were on the rich side – until later more and more workers from the hi tech area moved into that district because the family in that district are more well off. Kind of ironic. (These new hi-tech worker families are not that rich. Kids from rich families generally do not go into the engineering field.)
These days, if parents have too many opinions about their child’s education choices, they run the risk of being accused of “Parents trying to live vicariously through their children”, especially on CC.
I get what OP is saying. My kids could decide which school to go to among top 20s, but if they want to dip further down to 50, 100 because of weather, location, BF situation, I would tell them to think twice (like it is not going to happen). Why would I pay the same for lesser quality? I know on CC we like to think ranking is just for silly or uneducated people, but there is some merit to it. I haven’t seen U. of SC in the top 10, 20 or 100 yet. No, I wouldn’t pay for it over Colgate. I could understand if one is in-state and there is a financial reason to pick USC.
Count me in the camp of a student can be very successful in college without having to be the sole decision maker when it comes to college selection.
University of South Carolina has some amazing programs, and to dismiss them out of hand because the school is not a ranked LAC shows a startling lack of insight from someone who supposedly was educated at Notre Dame. For instance, the graduate and undergraduate International Business programs are consistently among, if not the best in the country, according to the same ranking source the OP values so highly.
1 in the undergraduate international business specialty in the survey of 'America's Best Colleges' – U.S.News & World Report
1 MBA program for international business – U.S.News & World Report
1 undergraduate international business program – Bloomberg Businessweek 2013 Best Undergraduate B-school rankings
USC’s Exercise Physiology program is also always at or near the top of their respective national rankings.
I don’t think we’ll be able to convince the OP otherwise, but hopefully as other parents and/or high school kids read this thread, they’ll understand that “name” is only one small factor to consider when looking at schools.
Yeah, I don’t see an obvious choice between Colgate and SC OOS because they differ in so many ways besides ranking. I think it’s weird that they both ended up the same student’s list.
You could not be more wrong. I have known dozens of undergrads that have contributed to research at far more than a lab tech level. Granted, I have known hundreds that were at exactly that level as they gained knowledge and confidence, but I would still call it a sizable minority that were capable of and did in fact contribute ideas and innovative research techniques.
Not to brag (but I will), when I was an undergrad my prof gave me, at the beginning of the school year, a series of experiments to carry out to see if an idea of his was correct. Definitely techie work on my part. Within 3 weeks it was clear the idea was wrong. But in researching the literature behind his idea, I came up with a slightly related but very different idea for a series of new compounds to study. He agreed to let me pursue it, and about 4 months later we had exciting results that were completely new to the field. We published a series of papers in the top two chemistry journals, and those same results have been cited in various textbooks as “spectacular examples” of nucleus-electron spin-spin interactions. And I am hardly the exception.
Off topic, I know, but I couldn’t let that statement stand.
I think Colgate and South Carolina may have ended up on the same list because the student never wanted to go to Colgate anyway, or maybe someone suggested it (uncle, GC, neighbor) as a good fit for the student and the student applied but really didn’t agree that it was a good fit. Or maybe the student just really liked USC. Since it is an OOS flagship, the student probably had some reason to apply.
When my daughter tells people where she goes to school (especially those from her h.s. in Florida) there are only two looks to expect - shock or pity. She loves Wyoming. It was her first and only choice. It couldn’t be a better fit. The few reservations she had (size and diversity) have proven not to be issues at all. I was suggesting other schools during the process but she was very sure of her decision. If I had made her apply to other schools, her list would have looked as lopsided at OP’s friend with a few LAC’s or women’s colleges, some southern schools, some huge flagships. She would have still ended up where she is. Her sister had all kinds of different schools on her list, including military academies, New England women’s colleges, huge flagships, but ended up eliminating all of those and only applying to one school with rolling admission.
@intparent and @fallenchemist, I picked a poor example and stated it as a dogmatic fact rather than fleshing it out as a proper example. It’s funny because usually I’d be the first to say just because a big name school has a few Nobelaureates doesn’t mean UGs will have access to them. I too published as an undergrad. It can be done, anywhere, by a motivated and bright student.
Back on track, I used it as a (poor) illustration that rankings depend on what you are ranking. We’ve been suckered into believing that there are micro quantifiable differences between schools, that 20 is somehow better than 40. It’s a farce. It depends on the methodology and WAY too much of the USNWR is simply subjective, in fact, for engineering it is 100% subjective. It is designed to be a self perpetuating hierarchy.
There’s no way I’d encourage anyone to go to Harvard for undergrad. Year after year after year, the teaching, as rated by the Harvard student body, is abismal. For that poor teaching, you get to pay $250,000. Yet, they are perennial darlings at the USNWR ball.
Getting back to the OP’s quandary, there are many scenarios where the University of South Carolina might be a better choice than Colgate.
