Why hasn't anyone noticed Obama is running against President Bush?

Parent Cafe
101

<p>

</p>

<p>Nope. It wouldn’t bother me because, as I said, such reactions are usually predicated upon long ingrained social conditioning. Further, I would say that if the neighborhood was a high crime one, your fears might be quite justified. I’d be afraid in such a neighborhood, too.</p>

<p>Please note that I also said, "Obama’s comment speaks to long ingrained perceptions of the individual, perceptions that don’t necessarily reflect the reality extant in the particular circumstance being feared. </p>

<p>Under the above circumstances, we might be in danger, and we might not be. Not everyone who lives in such a neighborhood is a criminal, just as not everyone who lives in a predominantly white, upscale neighborhood is a racist inclined to call the police because they spotted me in on their street.</p>

<p>BTW, did you catch the part about, long ingrained perceptions of the individual not necessarily reflecting the reality extant in the particular circumstance being feared?—or were you too busy trying to find a gotcha angle to throw my way?</p>

102

<p>What do you think I mean by black nationalism?</p>

<p>Please consider discussing these issues reasonably and understand that some of us still have to sleep, work and live real lives. </p>

<p>Not immediately responding does not mean I’m afraid to respond nor does it mean anything you can interpret correctly on an anonymous bulletin board.</p>

<p>By the way, I stand by my statement that Senator Barack Obama does not work across the aisle. Yes, he has helped with a couple pieces of legislation with at least two Republican Senators. However, he has steadily worked his way to being the most liberal senator in the senate, hardly a model of cooperation (see: [NATIONAL</a> JOURNAL: Obama: Most Liberal Senator in 2007 (01/31/2008)](<a href=“http://nj.nationaljournal.com/voteratings/]NATIONAL”>http://nj.nationaljournal.com/voteratings/) )</p>

103

<p>This kind of material about Reverend Wright (and by proximity Senator and Mrs. Obama) concerns me:</p>

<p>Obama’s Minister Honored Farrakhan
Monday, January 14, 2008 7:49 PM
By: Ronald Kessler</p>

<p>*Barack Obama’s longtime minister, mentor, and sounding board has been a key supporter of Louis Farrakhan and last month honored the Nation of Islam leader for lifetime achievement.</p>

<p>Farrakhan has repeatedly made hate-filled statements targeting Jews, whites, America, and homosexuals. He has called whites “blue-eyed devils” and the “anti-Christ.” He has described Jews as “bloodsuckers” who control the government, the media, and some black organizations.</p>

<p>“Do you know some of these satanic Jews have taken over BET [the Black Entertainment Network]?” Farrakhan said in a speech on Nov. 11, 2007. “Everything that we built, they have. The mind of Satan now is running the record industry, movie industry, and television. And they make us look like we’re the murderers; we look like we’re the gangsters, but we’re punk stuff.”</p>

<p>The month after that speech, Obama’s minister and friend, the Rev. Jeremiah A. Wright Jr. and his Trinity United Church of Christ in Chicago, honored Farrakhan at a gala, bestowing on him its Rev. Dr. Jeremiah A. Wright Jr. Lifetime Achievement Trumpeteer award.</p>

<p>Obama has said he found religion through Wright in the 1980s and consulted him before deciding to run for president. He prayed privately with Wright before announcing his candidacy last year.</p>

<p>In the November/December issue of his church’s magazine, Trumpet, Wright heaped praise on Farrakhan, whom he helped in organizing the Million Man March in Washington in 1995. Wright lauded Farrakhan as one of the giants of the African-American religious experience in the 20th and 21st centuries.</p>

<p>“When Minister Farrakhan speaks, black America listens,” Wright said. “His depth on analysis [sic] when it comes to the racial ills of this nation is astounding and eye-opening. He brings a perspective that is helpful and honest.”</p>

<p>Hailing Farrakhan’s “integrity and honesty,” Wright said, “His love for Africa and African-American people has made him an unforgettable force, a catalyst for change, and a religious leader who is sincere about his faith and his purpose.”*</p>

<p>For the rest of the article, see: [Newsmax.com</a> - Obama&#39s Minister Honored Farrakhan](<a href=“http://www.newsmax.com/kessler/obama_wright_farrakhan/2008/01/14/64332.html]Newsmax.com”>http://www.newsmax.com/kessler/obama_wright_farrakhan/2008/01/14/64332.html)</p>

104

<p>I was truly not trying to play gotcha. I was sincerely interested if you would genuinely not have a problem what I said, because I would. Blanket statements like that have always just viscerally bothered me. I’ll bow out now…</p>

105

<p>

</p>

<p>News Flash, barrons: Black people have been afraid of criminal elements within the black community for longer than white people have—and with good reason. Violent black criminals are far more likely to predate upon black people than upon whites. As an aging black man, Jesse is more vulnerable than ever to violent crime (depending upon where he happens to be). My own father was mugged a couple of years ago by a black drug addict early one morning, while opening up a municipal health clinic in a nearby inner city. </p>

<p>Black peoples’ fear of violent crime is based on the social class conditions under which they may find themselves. For instance, if the medical facility had been an urgent care clinic located in a predominantly black and upscale Atlanta neighborhood, my Dad (and Jesse Jackson) would have had as little to fear with respect to mugging, as they would in an upscale white neighborhood. It is not inherent in black people to commit violent crime, anymore than it is in whites. Crimes are based in specific sociology. Blacks aren’t generally the ones who commit white collar corporate crime either. What’s more, I’d wager that most of the many thousands of Enron employees would rather have been mugged on the street for a few dollars, than robbed of their entire retirement nest eggs by Kenneth Lay and Co.</p>

106

<p>I know that and it is just as rational for whites in some areas to fear young black men especially. </p>

<p>And when anyone starts trying to get after my wallet with some scam I hold on tight–that has nothing to do with the other. Many of the current Internet scammers are based in Nigeria. Fear them.</p>

107

<p>I read in the Washington Post this morning that the RNC will be hitting on facts like this come August.</p>

108

<p>Heck, P2N, if you want to play the “guilt by association by association” game I can connect John McCain to Adolf Hitler in only three steps, too! [url=<a href=“http://www.slate.com/id/2189464/]Two”>Two degrees of Adolf Hitler.]Two</a> degrees of Adolf Hitler. - By Timothy Noah - Slate Magazine<a href=“Hillary%20only%20takes%20two,%20but%20they’re%20iffy.”>/url</a></p>

<p>:)</p>

109

<p>

</p>

<p>*“But a bit of context here: National Journal used 99 Senate votes in 2007 as the basis for its rankings, and because he was on the presidential campaign trail, Obama missed a third of those votes. (According to the magazine, Obama voted the liberal way 65 out of 66 votes. Clinton, meanwhile, voted the liberal way in 77 out of her 82 votes).</p>

<p>National Journal’s vote ratings became an issue in the 2004 general election, when Republicans used the magazine’s ranking of John Kerry as the most liberal senator of 2003 to label the then-Democratic nominee as the “most liberal senator” – even though that was his rating for just that one year, when (like Obama did) he missed quite a few Senate votes due to being on the presidential campaign trail.
As National Journal’s editor wrote back then, ‘[O]ur magazine – or, more precisely, our annual congressional vote ratings edition – has become a Republican talking point in the 2004 presidential campaign. And that’s been a fascinating, and disconcerting, experience. Fascinating because we’re more used to being cited in congressional hearings than on the Today show. Disconcerting because the shorthand used to describe our ratings of Kerry and Edwards is sometimes misleading – or just plain wrong.’*
[Is</a> Obama the most liberal senator? - First Read - msnbc.com](<a href=“http://firstread.msnbc.msn.com/archive/2008/01/31/625886.aspx]Is”>http://firstread.msnbc.msn.com/archive/2008/01/31/625886.aspx)</p>

110

<p>Kluge, it not that this man, Obama, is anything but a fine example of American manhood. He has made a number of remarkable achievements to which the vast majority of us will never come close. He makes me proud that someone of at least part African American extraction has overcome the vestiges of a racist society and can be a legitimate contender for POTUS.</p>

<p>African Americans have arrived. Finally, they are there. Wonderful!</p>

<p>Now, having arrived, they get zero slack from me as they aspire to power. They must win the rest of America over WITHOUT references to past abuse or “white guilt”, if there is such a thing.</p>

<p>Obama is running to be MY president, and I don’t give loyalty easily. He must win the right way - not the “black” way or the “white” way but the right way as everyone’s president. ;)</p>

<p>Yes, MSNBC is a left-leaning network. Not persuasive.</p>

111

<p>

</p>

<p>So, Wright honored Farrakhan. And since Obama once honored Wright, Obama must also honor Farrakhan. I think not.</p>

<p>I think blacks, at least poor blacks, are in a unique position where guys like Farrakhan are concerned. I’ll try to explain it, but admittedly it is difficult. Personally, this is another area where my views differ from Wright’s. I have always rejected Farrakhan, and done it ardently. I rejected his Million Man March, rejected his beliefs, rejected his agenda long before his unsavory comments came about. I still reject him. And yet I still support Wright. So did the Clintons, if you will recall, despite that for nearly forty years Wright has preached exactly as we have heard recently. I therefore understand how Obama could have easily done likewise.</p>

<p>Wright has been clear that he does not agree with Farrakhan’s views. I do not defend his association with Farrakhan. Indeed I reject it. But I also understand it. We have two guys, both responding to the same injustice, both sharing the same anger. One responds as Wright does, the other as Farrakhan does. Even while rejecting the other both are able to understand each other. That is what has gone on in the black community since I was a kid where the Black Muslims are concerned. We always thought they were ridiculous, but we also knew they were hurting just as we were, and for the exact same reasons. So it was hard for us to just denounce them. On the rare occasions when we engaged black muslims, we inevitably preached, to no apparent avail, against their bitterness and encouraged them to stop being filled with hate. But we still knew WHY they were filled with hate and agreed they had reasons for it.</p>

<p>[url=<a href=“Page Not Found”>http://w3.newsmax.com/]Newsmax[/url</a>], is no objective news source. It is the internet equivalent to Rush Limbaugh.</p>

112

<p>

</p>

<p>The problem with this is, were Obama white, no one would be lying about voting for him only to vote against him just because of his skin color.</p>

113

<p>Out of the millions of votes cast, some lie. Most don’t. That dog don’t hunt.</p>

114

<p>When will Britain, Germany or France have a black countryman in a like position? How about Russia or Switzerland?</p>

<p>America’s still the greatest. :D</p>

115

<p>I think we are approaching some real truth and understanding here:</p>

<p>(Excerpted from a Dross post)</p>

<p>"We always thought they were ridiculous, but we also knew they were hurting just as we were, and for the exact same reasons. So it was hard for us to just denounce them. </p>

<p>I understand this, but things have now changed. Rise and possess the land.</p>

<p>On the rare occasions when we engaged black Muslims, we inevitably preached, to no apparent avail, against their bitterness and encouraged them to stop being filled with hate. But we still knew WHY they were filled with hate and agreed they had reasons for it.</p>

<p>Time to stop the toleration for hate. This tolerance alienates many.</p>

<p>:)</p>

116

<p>Ah, but P2N - Obama has never made an appeal to “white guilt” or “the black way”, has he? He has run the most stringently race-neutral campaign you could ask for, without actually denying that he’s black. You are the one who keeps bringing up race, not Obama. Haven’t you figured that out? You keep demanding that he “explain” himself. That’s the gameplan the goombah’s of the right are working so hard on: “associate” Obama with somebody who has expressed some sort of race-conscious thought, so as to scare the white folks. Er, I mean, give the white folks a reason to express “disappointment” or “concern” or insist that Obama “needs to explain” over and over.</p>

<p>I agree, America is the greatest - but America’s greatest moments don’t come from sneaky backstabbing and gossip-based carping at the people who actually do try to rise above the nastiness.</p>

<p>On another note, P2N, your comment about MSNBC - apparently in response to Drosselmeier’s noting that you had cited a blatant propaganda mill as your source for “linking” Obama to Farrakhan - brings up something that’s been interesting me for some time. Do you really think that “balance” is achieved by countering the reports of people who are honestly trying to tell the truth with drivel emitted by people who are openly willing to twist the truth to serve their ends, if the second group is politically diverse from the first one? Because that seems to be an excuse people use for treating trash like Coulter, Limbaugh, Drudge, Hannity et al as if their utterances were credible. I understand that people are cynical about the “mainstream media” but cynicism is one thing, boneheaded credulity is another.</p>

117

<p>

</p>

<p>Well, you see, I honestly don’t know. I have no idea what “black nationalism” is. I was hoping you could tell me, since it’s obvious that you believe you not only know what it is, but that Jeremiah Wright is guilty of promoting it.</p>

<p>

</p>

<p>I never considered being anything other than “reasonable” in our discussion. I am mystified as to why you seem to assume that I would not be. Did I not request nicely enough that you expound upon what you meant by “black nationalism”? And the condescending accusation that I might not “understand that some of us still have to sleep, work, and live real lives” is not supported by my own posting history and habits. </p>

<p>

</p>

<p>You said Obama “never” works across the aisle, and were proven wrong. For a junior Senator, Obama has a respectable record of working across the aisle—at least as respectable as any Ultra Conservative junior Senator has of doing the same. If being branded “The Most Liberal Senator” by an Arch Conservative entity is “proof” of a law maker’s disinclination to cooperate with his colleagues across the aisle, the same can be said to be true of “The Most Conservative Senator” in the Senate. BTW, prior to being elected to the US Senate, Obama had a well established reputation within the Illinois Senate of being a consensus builder and “reaching across the aisle”.</p>

118

<p>Nope, Obama’s never asked for his pound of flesh. This is to his credit.</p>

<p>However, some of my more liberal friends on here propound statements that such blood money be paid regardless. </p>

<p>I reject such notions. ;)</p>

<p>Kluge, this is a bulletin board, not a court room. The Rules of Evidence do not apply.</p>

<p>We have discussions and hopefully become better for it.</p>

<p>Poet - the most conservative Senator is not running for president. He/she gets a pass.</p>

119

<p>[The</a> Progressive - Obama No](<a href=“http://www.progressive.org/mag_reed0508]The”>Obama No - Progressive.org)</p>

<p>by respected AA Professor of Political Science at Penn, Adolph Reed, Jr.</p>

120

<p>Reed reads my mind.</p>