William & Mary OOS: How tough is admissions?

I have really tried to put on the brakes with my D in terms of reach schools, and we have a few that I think will be realistic reaches, matches and safer schools.

However, this summer my D has become smitten with the idea of William & Mary. If we were in-state I think she’d have a chance but OOS, I seriously doubt it. But before I quell her enthusiasm (she’s thinking possible ED) I’d like to know the general SAT range of out-of-state admitted students just in case I’m wrong. She hopes to raise her score, but chances of doing so are evaporating, Even if she does, she may not be able to raise it high enough for a realistic chance especially as her good but normal-kid ECs may not make the cut. How high is that bar? Anecdotal responses welcomed!

Not looking for HER chances (I can try to suss that out) but what would a realistic applicant hope to look like?

Just checked Naviance for our school (NY). In the past 3 years, SAT of 1350 was waitlisted and eventually denied with an aunt who is a faculty member, 1460 and 1430 were both accepted and both of those were also full IB students. One student applied each year. While the IB and faculty connection are not in Naviance, D20 was friends with all 3 so she was privy to that info.

I wouldn’t pay that kind of tuition to go OOS. There’s no benefit, when she could go somewhere in-state for so much cheaper.

@helpingmom40, thanks, that is actually very encouraging. I was afraid the benchmark might be around the 1500-level for out-of-state students. We don’t have Naviance, so other than the CDS for all admitted students we are swinging blind.

My D’s GPA, rigor (to the extent that it’s offered at D’s school) and ERW are fine…she just needs to improve the math score to be in the ballpark. Just since I posted this thread a hopeful announcement from our school board said that two SAT in-school test will be newly offered to our local students in October even though all students are otherwise online for school. My D’s last and only SAT was last December so the months of prepping may allow more choices.

Thanks for your input, @coolguy40, but the question was about admissions, not affordability.

Our Naviance looks like a 1480 minimum to get in, with a GPA above 4.0. That would be the top 6% of our school, and most of those kids are the ones who go to the Ivies and other top schools. We’ve had 81 apply since 2015, with 7 accepted and all those were from 2015. Weird.

Thanks, @NJWrestlingmom, that’s more in line with what I was thinking… and you’re right, it’s strange that all seven were accepted in the same year!

It might be helpful for your daughter to identify which W&M qualities appeal to her most, and seek those characteristics in additional schools on her list.

There are so many fine choices, and college admissions are so ridiculously uncertain. W&M’s published admission percentages are deceptive because there is a lot of self-selection. Students who don’t want a very academic, nerdy university won’t apply.

Best wishes to your daughter in these weird, scary times.

My D18 was accepted OOS and invited to be a Monroe Scholar. She had a 34 and close to perfect GPA and good but not exceptional ECs. No merit $ of course, so that eliminated it for us.

Watching stats for W&M it seems not nearly as difficult an admit as UVA, and perhaps these days slightly less tough than Richmond.

Maybe just my perception, but it feels to me like W&M does not appeal to as broad a range of students because of its intellectual/nerdy reputation and culture, thus not quite as competitive to get into.

We have a friend who was admitted OOS this year, salutatorian (class size 72), 31 ACT. Another was admitted from top 10%, unsure about test score but definitely above 30. Both RD, both are attending. Good luck!

S was admitted RD in '17. I think his SAT was 1420. That might appear low (crazy that a 14XX would be considered low today but it is what it is), but he had outstanding grades AND ECs so I’m sure that helped. I hear (don’t know) it’s a smidge easier for males so that could have been a factor too. The other applicant from his class was a female, SAL, and she was rejected. Don’t know her scores. Her class rank was a few spots higher, but she did not have much going on in the EC world.

Thanks for all the helpful responses! @prodesse, good idea…she does have a list of around ten schools. W&M is the largest school on her list, and maybe among the reachiest, but it does have some similarities in other ways to other schools she’s applying to. She is potentially a history major, so W&M has an obvious appeal (though she realizes quite well that Colonial Williamsburg represents a prettied-up version of reality).

You can look at the Common Data Set to see test score percentiles, also most colleges post a freshman profile for each class (usually about a year behind) so you can get the most up to date info. Also, there is a web site that rhymes with quiche and starts with the letter N that will show you a scattergram of admissions on a test score/GPA graph (our school did not have Naviance either, I used this instead). But all that won’t separate in state, OOS, and you have to realize that as a state school they must take 60% (or 66%?) from VA, so the remaining 33% for OOS have a much higher bar than in state.

Thanks, @TS0104, I have the CDS data and knew OOS was
more selective, just wanted an idea just how selective. Wanted to know If it’s an unrealistic reach …if so I’d try to dissuade my D from giving it much thought. Not sure if she will ED anywhere but W&M is high on her list and we wouldn’t want her to waste ED on a lottery chance.

Maybe take a look at old admissions W&M threads?

CDS says mid 50 SAT is 1320 - 1510, ACT Composite 30 - 34, with 75% in top 10%. Someone mentioned Richmond, and corresponding numbers are SAT 1300 - 1450, ACT 30 - 33, and 59% top 10%, so all numbers lower there except overall admission percentage.

The SCHEV.edu website probably has some data on in-state / out of state.

In my D19’s year, she and two of her close friends applied, all OOS. All three had almost straight A’s in AP/IB classes. Both of D’s friends had SAT scores at the top of the 50% range, while her’s were in the middle. Her friends also took more rigorous math classes than she did.

Yet, D19 got in and her friends were waitlisted. I think there were several reasons. The main thing is that D applied ED. She was absolutely sure that W&M was her first choice. She visited three times, shadowed a student, and had an in-person interview. She felt like the vibe was just right for her—slightly quirky and yet well-rounded and engaged. She loves the American history aspect, the weather and the size.

Her friends were bummed but not devastated when they were waitlisted. Neither stayed on the waitlist. They both had other acceptances they were happy with, and are now thriving at the schools they chose. (D was really sad they wouldn’t be together, but they are still very close.)

@inthegarden , feel free to PM me with any questions!

Thank you, everyone, and sorry for the delayed response. My D is getting more and more interested in W&M as a possible ED. Though no in-person tours are possible I’m going to look into whether it’s possible just to walk around campus.

Looks highly likely that D will get to take an in-school SAT in mid-October, as well as one in late September in a neighboring school district. (Covid rates are low here). Her practice SAT scores at home have improved a lot since her December test (Math scores up 90 points so far) and if she shows close to that much of an increase on the real thing I think she could be in the running if she shows as much interest as possible. I wonder if fewer out-of-state students will apply this year?

@3SailAway, thanks again, I will PM you!

My son sounds very similar to your daughter! He also plans to apply ED and we are keeping our fingers crossed that he will be able to take the SAT in October! We have toured so many schools and W&M is the most special place we have visited. The happiest students, richest traditions, inviting atmosphere, great town! I would love to know where else your daughter is looking. My son cannot find a second choice because he loves W&M so much! But, obviously, he needs a Plan B!