<p>Yes, ZMom, I think we can die of a broken heart.</p>
<p>I admire you for waiting until ZGirl comes home because I know that this must be killing you. You’ve had lots of good advice and it sounds like you and H are trying to find a firm but loving path. Sending her to stay with your mom is NOT like being kicked out. You are sending her to the woman you trust most.</p>
<p>I was kicked out of my house when I was 19. Nothing illegal but constant defiance. I stayed with family friends for a couple of months. I think it worked out okay for all of us and eventually parents and I were able to come to an agreement about what I could and couldn’t do while living there. </p>
<p>Please take care of yourself these next few days. Try to eat well and get some sleep. I will be praying for you.</p>
<p>On the sibling topic… My sister got in a lot of trouble in her senior year of high school for drinking. My parents took it very seriously. I was in the tenth grade, and they never told me what was going on. My sister is very level-headed and told me everything pretty factually, but she could easily have spun the story. This is especially important if your daughter is at all manipulative, resentful, lying, etc. Another instance along the same lines: I became very sick when I was young and was undergoing treatment, etc. My parents didn’t tell my sister that anything was wrong until I wound up in the ER of a major, non-local hospital. The household was very strained by the silence, and I think it hurt everybody. I felt guilty, my parents felt stressed, and my sister probably felt all the stress without knowing the reasons. I get that some things are better kept private, but I do think it’s best to give some sort of explanation to other children, particularly if your daughter may try to manipulate their thoughts or emotions.</p>
<p>Wishing you a restful, peaceful, enlightening sleep.</p>
<p>From experience: If you decide to write a response, tear up the first 3 or 4 or 8 attempts. Get the anger out, rip it up and try again - as many times as it takes. Don’t put angry words on paper, they are so much more powerful than spoken angry words. This might be a letter your daughter reads over and over. Make sure that your love and concern for her well being are above your hurt for her having broken your hearts.</p>
<p>I have been thinking about this all day at work because my girls have done things that have surprised and disappointed me. I have also questioned effectiveness of my parenting, wondering what I could have done to prevent…I don’t want to sound like I know better, but maybe just offer another point of view.</p>
<p>We all make mistakes, some more serious than others. When we do, we don’t do it necessary to hurt our loved ones, but often that’s what happens. Whatever your daughter has done, she needs to be punished for her transgression (it may even mean going to jail), but after she has paid her dues she is still part of your family. To be ostracized by your family is the ultimum punishment, and I wonder what deed could possibly warrant that. You may think whatever your daughter has done warrants the punsihment of being banished from the house, but it may be very confusing to your younger children. “My older sister got kicked out of the house because she did…, so if I were to do…then my parents could also throw me out.” In our lifes, almost everyone could/would walk away from us when time gets tough (including our spouse), but parental love is eternal. To think it could be taken away because of some transgression is very unsettling</p>
<p>I am in no way suggesting you do not love your daughter unconditionally. I am just wondering if you could help your daughter to do what is right, without making her feel like maybe she has lost your love for her. ZM, I am saying all this because I could very easily be in your shoes.</p>
<p>Zoosermom, my good friend had to kick her son out of her house last year. He had been told what had to change in order for him to stay at home, as well as what would happen if he did not comply. He did not comply, and my friend got him an apartment a mile or so away. She paid his rent and utilities for one year. It was THE HARDEST thing she has ever had to do, yet she knew that it had to be done. The circumstances of his situation, if I shared them, would cause many to say, “There was no need to make him leave. He’s just 19.” However, I knew everything that led to the decision, and I understood the choice she made. I knew how unbelievably difficult it was for her to do it. While you are certainly dealing with a different set of circumstances, I am sure you are thinking all of this through as carefully as my friend did. Know that as parents, we have to do things at times that others won’t understand. No one else lives in your home or knows what really has gone on. Take the advice that works for you, then do what you need to do.</p>
<p>I think you are very fortunate to have the option of sending her to live with your mom. It sounds like your mom can handle whatever is going on. </p>
<p>While I agree that you don’t want to be too tough, toughness is sometimes necessary. Someone pointed out earlier that you have been given the gift of time, and I agree. By the time your D comes home, you will have had a chance to decide the best possible course of action & come to terms with whatever that will bring. That is so much better than having to react immediately to the situation.</p>
<p>When D was 14, she did something that absolutely floored H and me. It was something she had said she would never do. She lied about it, we only found out when another parent told us because they knew we would want to know. She swore it would never happen again, but I began monitoring her IM conversations and found out it was still going on. It was not dangerous to anyone besides herself, but it was devastating to H and me to find out that D would lie to our faces, and continue to lie to us. I felt like a total fool.</p>
<p>Things have improved, but I still don’t trust her the way I used to. Being 16, she doesn’t understand WHY - recently she even said to me, “I’ve never given you any reason not to trust me!” Sometimes I wonder if she honestly convinces herself that the truth is what she wants it to be, rather than what really happened.</p>
<p>I have no advice for you beyond what has already been written - wait till ZG gets home, write down what you want to say (several times), and “We have decided you should live with grandma for a while because you can no longer live here.” But please know that you have support here, and you’re not the only person whose kid has broken their heart no matter how hard you’ve tried to be the best parent you can.</p>
<p>“Things have improved, but I still don’t trust her the way I used to. Being 16, she doesn’t understand WHY - recently she even said to me, “I’ve never given you any reason not to trust me!” Sometimes I wonder if she honestly convinces herself that the truth is what she wants it to be, rather than what really happened.”</p>
<p>I find that to be the great question when dealing with an angry daughter.</p>
<p>Zmom, you’ve gotten some great counsel here, and I won’t add to it. I just want you to know that I have had a broken heart too, as I’m sure many of the other posters have. People tell you it will get better with time, and of course it will, but when you are in the midst of it, you simply cannot believe it. I know the feeling of thinking, “How many days until it will feel better?” In your case, the time waiting for your D to get home from the vacation is likely to pass with excruciating slowness.</p>
<p>Do you have any obligations coming up in the next week? If so, you might want to see if you can get out of them. I know that in one instance, H and I were having to make all kinds of excuses (which we did not have the mental energy to do) to hide that we were just sitting at home with broken hearts. On the other hand, sometimes keeping busy with your ordinary activities can make the time go more quickly. Just think through which things you can do and which things will require you to “be there” emotionally. You probably can’t do those things right now.</p>
<p>Do you know what’s a relief? It’s when your kids are old enough that you can truly say, “I cannot do anything about that. He/she will have to live with the consequences.” 19 is borderline. She is still dependent on you, so you do still have some power over her, which means you have to figure out how to use it. You can’t just ignore what she’s doing and say, “It’s her decision” when she is living in your home.</p>
<p>Zmom, I’m so sorry you are going through this. I agree about waiting to deal with this until she gets home, if that’s possible. I’d use the week to make contact with an excellent adolescent/adult therapist (someone who sees a lot of young people) , family counselor or psychiatrist but perhaps even more importantly someone with whom YOU can talk to about this - including practical advice such as how to handle going forward. Good luck. My heart goes out to you.</p>
<p>I’m sorry you are having to deal with this. I think it is a blessing that your daughter is out of the country right now as it gives you and your husband a little time to think through how you want to handle this situation. You and your family (including your daughter) will be in my prayers.</p>
<p>If the behavior is dangerous and illegal, wouldn’t it be appropriate to seek counseling and or professional guidance for her? It also seems that family counseling may be appropriate for you to deal with this, whatever it is.</p>
<p>Good morning everyone. Thank you again for all the wise counsel and kind wishes. I have read and appreciated every word. I didn’t sleep a bit last night, but the sunrise brought some clarity and some calmness. I particularly appreciate so many of you taking the time to stop me from contacting her on vacation. That would have been a very bad thing and I know that now but didn’t yesterday morning. Hubby and I have spoken at great length and haven’t come to a complete meeting of the minds yet, but we are prepared to set out very specific rules that can not be broken. From now on, we will drive her everywhere that she can’t take the bus and will take her keys. That’s a form of torture for me because I hate to drive, but so be it. She will also from now on have to pay for her cell phone and half of her tuition, which at a CUNY isn’t that much and she has a very well-paying job. We’ll re-assess at the end of the semester and see what we think at that point. She, of course, will have the option to decline our conditions and our support. I hope she doesn’t. I’m still considering contacting the parents of the other person involved in the latest escapade because a great portion of the most recent illegal activity occurred in their house. I want to tell them that our daughter is not allowed to be in their house again (although it is our responsibility to enforce that, not theirs), and that if any other person is injured because of what they knowingly allow to happen in their house, I will contact the police and the District Attorney. I am most angry at my daughter, of course, but I can’t knowingly allow this behavior to continue, especially with much younger kids involved, without saying something. Thank you all again so much. The kindness and compassion – not to mention wealth of experience – shown to me has been remarkable.</p>
<p>No sleep, but sounds like you have organized your thoughts some - one day over, one day somewhat better!</p>
<p>I missed that another friend was involved. I think that needs to be one of the first courses of action/responsibility when your daughter returns - to inform the other parents of the activity. Your D can tell them, you can tell them or together - whatever, definitely they should not be left in the dark.</p>
<p>Sorry you are going through this. I know- all too well- how painful these situations are. Just remember that you WILL get through this and that you are doing the right thing by calmly considering your course of action. Our kids do really, really stupid things on occasion with little appreciation of the risk. We can try to provide a soft landing, but at some point, they might have to suffer some really tough consequences. Be strong.</p>
<p>Ugh, Zmom. So sorry you are going through this. Kids can be the source of much joy, and much pain too. It sounds like you are calmer this morning, and hopefully be able to make rational decisions.</p>
<p>As far as the other family goes, it seems like they knew what was going on? So basically you are contacting them to let them know that you too are aware, and are banning your daughter from their home? If they did NOT know what was going on, they should definitely be told, but after your D returns.</p>
<p>Hi, perhaps I missed it, but along with all of the restrictions and conditions that you are putting on your daughter did you consider offering to pay for her to go to some sort of counseling? Maybe she needs to explore why she is continuing to engage in this activity when she knows that it is contrary to your values. Your support may have to be contingent on her going to ‘x’ number of counseling sessions - she may get more out of it than she expects to. The counselor may be able to have a sensible and rational discussion with her about her risky behavior in a way that can’t be done within an emotionally charged parent/child relationship.</p>