Parent of a current HS junior trombonist here. Can anyone advise on the wisdom (or folly) of going Early Decision next fall? My musician loves it, has the grades and the scores, and seems to be on track at a high level of playing. But the fact that they don’t defer has me concerned. My musician connected with a current trombonist who recommended regular decision, but I’m not entirely sure why. (I couldn’t make my teen get that nuanced by text!) In general NU takes a lot of their incoming class from ED, but Bienen may operate totally differently. Any insight here?
For many BM applicants (classical string players) I know of, the main reason to NOT apply ED is about cost. After RD acceptances, the student and parents can compare scholarship offers alongside other important factors before committing. ED applicants don’t have this option. The difference could be anywhere from several thousand to fifty thousands a year. I know of some students receiving merit scholarship (not financial aid) from Bienen in the range of $5000 to $35000 a year. NU cost is >90K. 1/3 of this amount does make a difference. If your young musician is at national playing level such as NYO or Youngarts, I’m sure they’ll get merit scholarship from many schools, so ED may be a big sacrifice.
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I’m not an expert so my comment is opinion. Still, academic admissions and music admissions are very different “animals”.
Music is a small world. That may not be apparent yet…but it will become so in college. There are only so many students that can play at a high level…and want to pursue music in college. It is still competitive…but you won’t have the large volume of high stats kids applying (or lesser stats, thanks to the common app). Also there are pre-screens. If you pass pre-screens that typically means you are “good enough” for the program. Then it’s a matter of competition, dept needs, teacher/program fit and sometimes your grades.
For top musicians, many will apply RD bc they probably have a pretty good sense that they will get acceptances…multiple ones and they can negotiate. They may have a few relationships or contacts with teachers giving them a positive outlook. I would work with his private teacher to see how they feel he will do. Also many kids have done summer programs and/or competitions and/or Sat music schools…so they will feel fairly confident. Also some kids want to get a better feel for programs and teachers before making a commitment. What studios/teacher will accept them at which schools, for example.
Doing ED may work. I doubt that the bar is lower. My guess and opinion is that they will take the “for sure” students. The hard thing in music is guessing each year…who is for sure? How may trombones will they need for 2026? Never an easy number to figure out. For a vocalist (something I understand) if they are heavy on sopranos (due to higher yield the year before)…they may pass on a few good sopranos as they are not needed…just wanting to see a few others. A male vocal candidate is always a hot commodity. A female soprano…well not so much unless they are very good with a unique sound. So, you can see, in one case it could be a good strategy…and the other not so much. It would be interesting to hear WHY the student suggested NOT to do ED for the trombone. Maybe they need only a few a year…and unless you knock their socks off…they may wait to hear all RD candidates to see what else is available. I would imagine Northwestern can attract RD top talent. It would be good to get more insight from the student.
Right now, you don’t need to decide. I just wanted to share some “thoughts” on music admissions…and encourage you to talk with his private teacher and music teachers. A general counselor may not be able to give you the full story.
And, good luck! I hope that this helps.
Thank you both! Since I’ve posted this, my trombonist connected with another student in the studio who suggested going ED, so now he’s heard one vote each way! (Kinda helpful, but not really? LOL)
My trombonist is an NYO-level musician and has a teacher with some ties to the NU program (though less insight into ED vs RD). My gut tells me he could probably apply either way, based on his excellent musicianship.
While I might personally like to shop him around as a parent and compare deals and scholarships, he feels pretty certain NU is the place for him based on that program right now. What I need to find out is if you sacrifice all chances of (the very few) music merit scholarships by going ED.
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Maybe the current trombonist student is not happy with his professor.
That was the question we faced two years ago. My son did his “research” (asking around) among his all-state and NYO friends, took multiple trial lessons from multiple professors, and decided against ED. Some of his friends preferred to avoid the hassle of multiple auditions plus the torturous waiting so they opted ED. It all worked out well for everyone. It also helped to dig several years back for merit scholarship numbers at different schools and studios. Apparently there’s no “norm” or “usual amount”. So there’s some gambling.
I don’t know for sure but my impressions is all NYO members who apply to music schools receive merit based scholarship. Your trombonist can ask the current Bienen student if they know anyone receiving scholarship, also ask his NYO friends about other schools.
Music aside, the lake view at Bienen really is second to none.
Thank you for this. My kid will definitely ask around. Do I understand your student is at Bienen? Dare I ask if they saw any merit aid going RD?
I did a search and found that there were indeed merit awarded last year.
You can search for posts from earlier years. I remember seeing on reddit some scholarship reports as well.
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My S never did ED, so I can’t talk about it from experience, but I suspect Bridgenail is right, that with a BM (I am leaving out dual degree because going ED there could be very different). I suspect that with someone applying ED that they are going to only take kids who are so talented that they would easily make it in RD (and as Bridgenail pointed out, that depends on other factors too, if the studio has one slot for undergrad and grad, it could be they won’t consider anyone for ED. Assume here where there are a number of slots open for what I am talking about). In other words, I suspect with ED they will be using pretty high criteria, well above the ‘usual’ pass level’, so how much advantage you gain from going ED. The idea of ED seems to be that the competition level for slots won’t be established, it is a small pool and they have nothing to compare against. Keep in mind, though, that the people auditioning have a pretty good idea in their head what constitutes good from great from stellar from past years and general experience and they will be looking for the stellar kids, who would pass RD anyway no matter the talent pool. I obviously am not an insider nor did my son do this, but I know how music teachers evaluate students and how experienced most of the people viewing the audition are.
One question, I realize ED binds the student to going there if they get in. However, in my reading of the ED rules, there is a clause that comes up that says if the financial package is acceptable to the student they are bound to go there. For any of those knowledgeable about it, who determines if the aid is acceptable? Schools think taking out 40k a year in student loans is acceptable, but is that determination up to the student and their family (it should be IMO)? In any event, if you go ED and the merit aid seems too low, you can always appeal that, and if it isn’t enough, if I am right you can turn it down…(and it is why I asked the question I did about what constitutes affordable,who decides that?).
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My understanding is that NU does not stack scholarships so if your child gets one of the very competitive Bienen merit awards, it will reduce the institutional financial aid. Run the NPC and make sure that number is affordable.
Bienen will talk to families before applying about financial aid so you can make an informed decisions about applying ED.
"If you are concerned about the costs of a college degree, or have questions about how to pay for college and the various types of financial aid, we encourage you to contact the Assistant Dean for Admission, Financial Aid and Graduate Services. You can set up a phone appointment by calling 847-491-3141 or emailing musiclife@northwestern.edu."Undergraduate Financial Aid | Northwestern Bienen School of Music.
Basically with ED, you are committing regardless of the presumed merit or financial aid package and if you can’t do it once the admission has been granted, the burden is on you to prove you can’t pay the tuition that was offered. When you apply ED, you are signing a commitment that is difficult to wriggle out of.
This is actually a big part of the reason I am not in favor of ED unless you know you can pay full price if your student gets accepted.
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In my mind this very much puts NU in the driver’s seat with respect to merit offer, rather than the musician applicant. If they know that you would commit regardless of cost, what is their incentive to give merit?
I would think that a student high enough level to be accepted into a Bienen studio would likely have very generous merit offers from other top programs.
I do think that professors at top programs know the talent level very well. They know generally which other programs high level applicants are likely to receive audition invitations. At times they even ask where else the student is auditioning. In other words there is some competition on the part of the schools to get the top applicants into their studios.
Wouldn’t an ED application negate the ability for the student to compare and negotiate merit?
I would see this as a major downside. Even if one is able and willing to pay full price. There is so much cost involved outside of undergrad: festivals, audition travel, grad school.
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In the recent years I’ve known several families getting out of ED commitment using financial as their way out. I don’t think it’s right but they appeared to have gotten away with it. That being said, if this “strategy” were to be used by a BM applicant, it reflects badly on their reputation. The professors know each other and they talk to each other.
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In my mind this very much puts NU in the driver’s seat with respect to merit offer, rather than the musician applicant. If they know that you would commit regardless of cost, what is their incentive to give merit?
Yup, exactly. There is zero motivation to offer merit and they pretty much don’t.
And yes, the ED app means they are committing to that school and cannot compare offers- in fact, they are required to rescind all other apps if they are accepted ED. I’m sure many don’t do this, but they are supposed to.
While I do believe applying ED increases admissions chances, the downsides to me are too great. The student must be very certain that’s the school they want to attend and the family must be very certain they can pay no matter what the offer may be.
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I would never do ED for music. Even after RD acceptances, so many high level kids I’ve known have gotten their initial merit offer from colleges down to free tuition. You want to be in the driver’s seat when they are trying to fill up their studios in April - they have no need to fill the studio in the ED round, so no need to try to lure you to their school. Negotiation is the way for most of these schools.
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But, isn’t it possible that the studio fills up in the ED round ?
I think that depends on the school and the size of the faculty and how many slots they have. Looking at it from the way it all works, I suspect if they have only a tiny number of slots, they likely won’t choose the ED candidate for the very reason that with a tiny number of slots, they don’t know if someone better is in the RD or grad school auditions (if the school has grad school ).
I think the idea ED gives an edge is one that is based on academic admits rather than music. As I just wrote, knowing how studio size affects admissions, going ED in case there are few openings likely won’t be much of an edge. The other thing is if you are good enough to get admitted as ED (and as I pointed out in another post, the people doing the ED audition know what typical audition levels are like and they will likely admit only someone else near the top of the curve for normal auditions) then you have a strong shot at getting in at RD anyway and likely an equal shot at the teacher you want, and if not, your number 2.
Put it this way, I have enough of a sample size of music students and where they went (and I am talking high level students), before this discussion I never saw a student go ED for a BM program and thus, there won’t be this big pool of ED kids competing against a student. I am almost certain that none of the stand alone schools like Juilliard offer it, and from the students I have known about that have gone to places that allow it (pretty much all music schools in universities I suspect) if ED offered a big advantage they would have done it.
Again this of course is just my experience,but I doubt a music school admission panel will pass someone or a teacher take them, flattered that they showed such a strong commitment to the school, if they take them it means the student is very, very high level and would have gotten in RD. I think the idea of ED comes from the academic side where kids use this to show commitment to an elite college like an Ivy or whatever as an edge in a crazy process. It doesn’t work like that in an auditioned based program; if you go ED you will be compared to the best of the best they have seen before bc so few students go ED in a given year I bet, if you go RD you will be competing against kids in the audition process and that may give you a better chance because that years audition class may not be as top heavy as prior years (in a sense with ED you are competing against the best of many auditions, not just this year I suspect) .
If a school started filling all spots in ED…the word would get out. Music is a very small world. All the kids auditioning at Juilliard, Curtis, Colburn as well as Michigan, Rice, IU, Eastman etc could take Northwestern off their list. These high talent students expect merit and know they can negotiate. Northwestern is a good music school but it has stiff competition. So it needs to attract the best…and many of those students do RD. They already have relationships with multiple teacher, have won top competitions etc. They will get multiple admits. Jeez, my kid was good but not amazing (vocalist are young) and she got admitted to every music school with teachers calling her.
I still think each family needs to make their own decision on this. IMHO, you cannot think of music school admits like academic admits. It’s a different game.
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Well put @bridgenail, thank you. You make a valid point, ED is only there at music schools inside universities. Lot of those kids are planning to audition at Juilliard, Curtis, NEC, etc, and to be blunt very few of the top students are going to go ED at Vanderbilt, Northwestern, etc for the very reason it likely is one of many. Kids aren’t going to go ED at a school unless they see that as their top choice, but the pool of kids doing that in music at Bienen is probably really tiny (now if Juilliard, Curtis et al offered it, the ‘premiere destinations’, I could see them doing that). If a kid is really talented and let’s say Bienen is their dream school, then it might help a bit, but even then I don’t think there is much advantage to it, they likely would get in RD too.
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I would also be aware that some of those ED spots will go to their own students coming from their own pre-college programs. Those kids are very qualified and have a strong connection.