so it wasn’t repetitive to take intro for her? I guess maybe not all of it would be, but if a kid takes AP, then a 200 level genetics class, then a 400 level population genetics class, then goes back to intro, they still keep them engaged? (I had a similar situation when I want to college a zillion years ago – no APs but I’d worked in a lab, and my LAC told me I shouldn’t have been in the intro and should skip the next class after I asked too many geeky questions after class.)
If the genetics classes were taken at a college, your kid should get transfer credit for them, but genetics doesn’t cover all of intro bio. It’s up to the kid to remain engaged, even in classes where they have previously covered some of the material. Given the sort of schools on your kid’s list, your kid’s classmates in college will likely have specialized knowledge in all kinds of areas, too… many kids will have studied outside of class or have research experience.
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I believe that many colleges post their AP policy online. Here is Brown’s.
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Also, the Brown CS department has a very thorough discussion on what advanced math or CS courses can allow a student to place out of the required courses or pre-requisites.
Some colleges offer choices of introductory biology courses that focus on a theme, such as the study of plants, microbes, or marine ecosystems. By choosing an appropriate course, overlap with previous classes can be reduced.
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Data Science is really just an umbrella term for a broad multidisciplinary theme. As a general rule, I think most PhD programs don’t much care the name of your undergrad degree, they are interested in the actual classes you have taken, and as relevant research you have done and are interested in doing. And as you are getting into the second half of undergrad, hopefully you will be developing relationships with professors and such who can mentor you on grad school paths that might make sense for you, and what that means for elective course selection, and again research as relevant.
I agree it is hard to place out of many if any major-track Bio classes at a lot of very good Bio undergrads. My S24 faced this as a Bio major at WashU who had taken a couple advanced Bio classes.
And I do think this is less of a problem than it may sound. Bio curriculum sequences are less well-defined than in Math or Physics, say. Different departments may have different ways of doing even earlier Bio-for-majors courses, and it quickly gets even less standardized. Superficially similar course names may have overlap, but there in fact likely will be plenty of opportunities to learn new things, do new labs, and so on.
So actually, I think having done advanced Bio before is a nice combination of good preparation, without making it difficult to still enjoy a new version of a class with a new professor, new focus, and so on.
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I think this is a non-issue.
Colleges want kids to have a solid foundation, move at the appropriate pace, take on tough challenges as soon as they are ready.
She will be fine. I would be shocked if she found her college classes repetitive. That’s what advisors are for. And specifically with bio- when you think about marine, zoology, genetics, neuro, human physiology, ecological and climate adaptation– it would be hard for a kid to claim that they’ve covered the entire landscape of basic “biology” even with several advanced classes. The world won’t run out of bio before she gets to campus!
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No, but it could be an issue with math courses, unless there is a way to demonstrate mastery and place out.
What college wants a kid repeating material? The typical problem is the opposite- a kid who wants the easy A.
Whether or not a college will give course credit towards graduation (particularly in a required class for the major) is a separate issue from the college encouraging, wanting, insisting that a kid repeat the material. And I know of zero colleges that would require a kid to repeat. People conflate the “I didn’t get credit for my AP’s” with “I had to repeat an entire semester”.
Most colleges will at least let you place out of Calc 2 (Calc BC). Beyond that, they may want you taking their own LA, MVC, Diffy Q, and so on, but that again might not actually be bad.
That’s what happened to my student.
This is really her concern. As others have pointed out, science repeat is less of a problem since it’s so broad and there is so much bio to learn (and she is less concerned about that for that reason). But wouldn’t math just be learning to solve the same kind of problems she already learned to solve, using a similar textbook, etc…? The ‘and so on’ ends up being a lot of classes, if she has to redo MVC, Diff EQ, Probability, Stats, Discrete Math, and whatever she finds to take next spring (trying to avoid Lin Al on purpose to cut down the repeat issue, but running out of stuff that doesn’t require it as a prereq).
So by way of example, my S24 “repeated” MVC after taking it in HS, but there was reportedly plenty more done in the college version. Probability and Statistics is a whole major branch of Mathematics, not just a single class or two. Diffy Q is very broad as well, and in fact the same Math department might have different Diffy Q sequences for different purposes.
So again, I wouldn’t promise all this will be 100% new. But not 100% repeat either.
My daughter just went through the PhD application process for computational biology, so I can address that part of her concern regarding major. By far the biggest difference in PhD programs in this field is the level of math required - some programs are more bio focused and don’t require a high level of math - others are much more computational focus and want to see a lot of math in undergrad. Take a look at CMU’s PhD for an example of that type of program. There are others that are very statistics focused (this wasn’t of interest to my daughter, so I don’t have the details).
As long as she has the required courses, PhD acceptance will ultimately come down to research experience vs a specific major. She should start to understand what aspects of comp bio are interesting and make sure her resume aligns with those types of programs. My daughter went the double major route of CS and bio and was well prepared for all programs of interest. One of her friends that was straight bio, needed to go beyond the major to take additional math classes when she decided to focus on computational biology as a biology major often only needs Calc 1.
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Has she actually looked at the course catalogue for colleges she’s interested in to see what the sequence would actually be?
I know kids who are greatly accelerated in math- we’re talking kids taking dual enrollment courses at top 10 universities while in the 9th grade at their “regular” school and NONE of them have reported problems “repeating”. One went straight to Topology as a freshman with the encouragement of his advisor even without taking a placement test. There are LOTS of flavors of math kids in HS who go on to have very challenging and satisfying college experiences as math majors (or math adjacent) with zero issues.
“Back in the day” Johns Hopkins CTY had published studies on kids who were identified as exceptional in math as early as 12 years old. I attended a lecture given by one of these kids. He reflected on having ADD in addition to being a math prodigy- basically could not stand to repeat ANYTHING because he got bored so easily. He majored in math at Princeton and never repeated, never came close to running out of cool and rigorous courses to take.
As I said before- I have NEVER heard of this as an issue. And I think your worries are misplaced. College Advisors do NOT want kids repeating material they have mastered and will know if a specific course starts with a one or two week review (which WILL repeat) before forging ahead with very challenging material.
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Does she have actual DE credit for these math courses? If so, then I think she would be able to place out of them into higher level courses if she wants. If it is instead “advanced” high school courses, she may need to repeat the course or petition for the placement that she wants as a special override process.
I would encourage your student to apply to Pitt. It is very strong in the sciences, and based on what you wrote I think the city of Pittsburgh sounds like an excellent fit.
I don’t think this will be an issue, at least with biology. It is a huge field with a lot going on, not to mention lab reports which will likely be different than HS.
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However, if the OP’s student has taken college multivariable calculus, then that may be different from high school multivariable calculus.
Besides Pitt, you may want to look at SUNY Buffalo. Very strong in the sciences and I feel that your student would make honors.
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Indeed. I understand this may be homeschooling, and I don’t know exactly what that intends to cover in such classes.