Why are you learning Calculus on your own?
Three words: strict Asian parents.
In all seriousness, math has traditionally been a weaker point for me. Taking classes during the summer to get to know whatever topic is very common in our school district. By familiarizing myself with the concepts in advance, Iâll be more prepared for Calc during school!
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Got it. I was just hoping you werenât self studying to bypass taking math at school. Good luck with it - Iâm sure it will help this fall.
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You will have to check, but I believe William and Mary checks a lot of your boxes, but they have a limit on the merit aid they give to OOS students, I believe. @tsbna44 I think you mentioned this once. Can you elaborate?
W&M has merit but like UVA, very limited.
1693 Scholars
The 1693 Scholars Program is our most selective scholarship, providing approximately eight students in each yearâs entering freshman class with extensive benefits worth the amount of in-state tuition, general fees and room & board. Scholars work closely with distinguished faculty in order to plan their course of study, and receive $5,000 to support independent projects. Finalists are notified in March when they are asked to complete additional steps in the selection process.
William & Mary Scholars Awards are offered each year to a group of academically distinguished students who will add to our vibrant community representative of individuals with diverse backgrounds, talents and experiences. Students selected receive a scholarship equivalent to at least the full cost of in-state tuition and fees, in addition to mentoring and advising opportunities available through the W&M Scholars Undergraduate Research Experience (WMSURE).
Selection for the awards is competitive, and W&M welcomes nominations from school counselors to help identify outstanding candidates for the awards, but this is not required for consideration or selection.
The James Monroe Scholars Program offers a $3000 summer research stipend to approximately 10% of accepted freshmen, empowering selected scholars to explore an academic area of their choice. Benefits to this program include a special housing option during freshman year, priority course registration as an entering freshman and the invitation to take part in additional seminars throughout the academic year.
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Thanks for the info! W&M and UVA are both on my list. I think if I got into UVA, my parents would let me go there instead of Rutgers. Donât know about W&M because they think smaller, more remote liberal arts colleges = bad success with jobs.
Another school I actually like more is the University of Richmond now, if you have any thoughts on that?
Richmond is a fine school, much pricier than W&M, but has your major and some get merit. Very good reputation - others can comment more but I believe a richer, preppier, more Northeast feel. Business is their largest major but they are considered an LAC.
My daughter did not like the school at all. Itâs in RichmondâŠbut really a burb with not much around. W&M has more nearby although itâs a smaller area. She loved the W&M campus - but again, liking a campus is highly subjective.
W&M is considered by most at the same level of the top publics - but itâs a smaller school.
W&M is not a liberal arts school per se - but has that feel. All schools, in your major, are liberal arts schools. An English and a poli sci student will likely struggle job wise at any school - no matter the name and location. For English and Econ, Yale, UVA, etc. - theyâre all LACs as those majors are typically housed in Arts & Sciences or each schoolâs iteration. In that sense, every college in an LAC - and you will be an LAC student.
Your parents are entitled to their opinions - but my opinion is they are far off base. Based on their logic, they shouldnât let you consider UVA either - smaller, not in a big city!!!
You are talking about top level schools - all of these - and all will do great things for you.
Going to Yale doesnât assure you career success just like going to Youngstown State doesnât mean failure or mediocrity. You may, in fact, going to Yale work for a Youngstown State one day. At my company, a Harvard Law grad works for a Fairleigh Dickinson undergrad to put into a local school youâd know.
Your major has as much to do with this as anything in many ways. If you were an accountant or engineer, youâd have a much greater chance toward meaningful job success - no matter where you went.
Richmond has PPE which might interest you. But since you have interest in Oxford, William & Mary has a joint degree with St. Andrews. Top that UVA/Rutgers 
I think your folks need to remember who is going to school - but and again, itâs just my opinion, that their âperceptionsâ are far off base. Then again, maybe mine are.
For job success, I think the major and then the âapplicantâ are the most important things. I see you as a person who will hustle - so your odds will be better than most with your majors.
Philosophy, Politics, Economics, and Law - School of Arts & Sciences â University of Richmond
St Andrews William & Mary Joint Degree Programme | Arts & Sciences | William & Mary (wm.edu)
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I donât know what it would take to convince your parents, but William & Mary is really a great option for people who like colleges such as Yale.
William & Mary is actually older than Yale (second only after Harvard), and it has a really historic-feeling campus, but with modern facilities. I really like Yaleâs campus (including because I like Collegiate Gothic), but William & Mary is one of my other favorites.
Also like Yale, it has long been among the favored colleges of US sociopolitical elites. Again also like Yale, it has maintained very strong departments in core humanities and social sciences, while also being quite good for natural sciences, and increasingly some tech stuff too. William & Mary grads are definitely employable!
In terms of undergraduate size, there are about 6800 at William & Mary, 6750 at Yale. And actually, like Yale, William & Mary is basically a coastal college, with good access to beaches and the ocean.
OK, so given all this, why isnât William & Mary, say, an Ivy League college?
Well, a variety of reasons. For one thing, it was too far away to play football regularly with Yale and Harvard back when they relied on team buses and there were no modern interstate highways. For another, William & Mary ended up affiliated with the state of Virginia (long story behind thatâand at one point Yale was sorta headed in that direction with Connecticut, but then backed out). For a third, it is an R2, not R1, research university, so while it does have grad programs and professional schools, some quite good, it is not an R1 like Yale.
OK, but still, William & Mary remains a very popular undergrad option among the sorts of US families who also look at Ivies and such. And while I actually think a lot of these virtues are shared with some small independent colleges, aka LACs, William & Mary is not that small, and it is in fact a university.
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Some LACs have a pretty good track record of placing their grads in nice careers, including English and Poli Sci majors. Consulting and IB entry level jobs are very prestige driven given how and where they recruit. Of my Sâs 3 suitemates (Yale) who were PPE or just Philosophy majors, 2 ended up at MBB and 1 in strategic planning for a huge corporate. S was Econ and is at a BB IB. Sure there were grads that werenât so fortunate, but the point is you donât need to major in a âtradeâ to have great job prospects at certain colleges/universities, and you donât need to be in the top 5-10% of students.
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And of course there are also law and government careers launched out of those sorts of majors, not least at those sorts of colleges.
This is part of why crude statistics involving salaries by major and such are not necessarily all that useful. At some colleges, an English major may be most likely to be on their way to something like being a K-12 teacherâwhich can be a really great life, but it tends not to help out the salary stats. At other colleges, a few people might do that, and some might be going on to higher education (also not great for salary stats), but most are going on to business, law, and so on.
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I understand and agree - but speaking in generalities.
There are always exception.
One of the schools I like is Kenyon - because they show you the jobs grads are taking from each major.
But these majors are less âjobâ specific. Iâm going to see that in the next year with my daughter. In other words, if youâre an accounting major, I know youâre going to be an accountant next year. While I donât know an engineering major will go into engineering, there is a path for them. These other majors are far less certain in this regard - and thatâs even to find relevant jobs for the student.
And the reality is (sorry OP), Yale is not likely - but I also think parents (because thatâs the issue here) need to realize going to Harvard doesnât ensure success and going to Hofstra doesnât mean a lifetime of poverty. And then donât forget, top flight schools have a high grad school rate (vs. folks going into the workplace).
Hereâs Kenyonâs website - very interesting how they lay it out. Scroll down - they show both initial jobs and career jobs (although you donât know what % are successful).
I clicked on Classics, which is kinda the gold standard for drawing, âAnd what exactly are you going to do with that?,â questions from concerned relations.
And as one would expect if you know these things, it is all over the place.
There was one person who was actually teaching Classics at Nobles, and another âworld languageâ teacher at Bronx Science. Thatâs a quite impressive combination of schools, actually.
OK, but then you have an artistic director at the Theater of War Productions, someone in regulatory affairs at Walter Reed, a legal assistant at Revlon (NY), a state AAG in Ohio, a data analyst at Keyrus, a programmer at Epic Games, someone in financial management, a reporter in Bangkok, a Senior Editor of Vice, a dietician and an occupational therapist, and possibly my favorite, someone who founded a brewery in St Louis.
Which leads me to conclude that I really should have done Classics, because I would totally take my chances with that mix.
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This is the type of disclosure that every college should make, although it does seem that a lot of the career disclosure is cherry picked over many years. What I like is the detail that a lot of BSchools give. Here is an example for UCLA. chrome-extension://efaidnbmnnnibpcajpcglclefindmkaj/https://www.anderson.ucla.edu/sites/default/files/document/2023-04/UCLA-Anderson-Class-of-2022-2023-Employment-Report-Final.pdf
For me itâs a bit too much and not well organized. But I have a small attention span.
Yes, itâd be helpful for schools to have detailed info. And some, like you just showed, do better than others.
I like Kenyonâs because for a simpleton like me, it makes sense. And to OP, Kenyon is very rural - for the folks
Cornell has a good resource - and treats all majors the same - so they present in a smilar way. For example, 20 of 41 English grads found their jobs from Internet postings or Social Media. Two from Cornellâs website, 1 from the career fair, and 1 from an alum.
You make a good point - OP might look for career outcomes from each school or contact the departments of interest to find out where their grads are ending up.
Of course, OP plans law school so at least up front, their path is at least identified - although many today work as you or another posted up thread and many law school websites show as well.
If youâre trying to say many people from MBA come from liberal arts majors - and yes I am one. But note many had to pursue the MBA to make their mark. I didnât. My pay went down but opportunities went up.
But this sort of holds to the argument - the students arenât going back to get a Classics masters but a pre professional one - as this student plans to do (law).
Nonetheless the parents believe the school will overcome any major. In some instances he, many not - and think we are getting off track of OP. Theyâve decided their majors.
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100%!!
In investment banking approximately 1/3 of the analysts that I have seen are non economics humanities majors. Often math, CS applied math but also religion, literature, classics, history, etc. The vast majority came from the 6 Ivies (with no business major) or top tier LACs.
Many BB and international banks specifically seek out these type of students who tend to have very strong communication and analytical skills.
Numerous current senior managers and leaders in finance have come from these âeclecticâ academic backgrounds so this trend isnât going away anytime soon.
I would suggest you focus on an area of study that you are curious and passionate about and if possible attend a target (top tier) school, if your ambition is one of the high prestige career paths. There are others paths but this is one of the ones most well travelled.
The name of the school tends to open the door, the students performance will land the job, and the area of study will differentiate or distinguish the candidate. You often need all three to succeed in getting one of these highly competitive opportunities.
I would also note, that at the bank I work, we had two interns this summer from W&M Mason who did an outstanding job. We will continue to recruit there. As others have mentioned another school to consider.
Good luck.
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I think of W&M similarly to how I regard Tufts: a university, but with a LAC feel. Or a hybrid LAC/U feel. (And in the case of Tufts, it actually was, at one time, a LAC). Both are fine schools somewhat overshadowed by nearby competitors â but excellent in their own right.
Of course, one is public and the other is privateâŠ
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Just thought I would mention that itâs been reported that W&M will be reclassified as an R1 research university in 2025, which coincides with the opening of the new data science school and the recently announced $100 million gift to establish the Batten School of Coastal and Marine Science. There are a lot of exciting things happening at William & Mary. But yeah, while it has a certain Ivy League feel to it, itâs not Yale. But itâs still a pretty big deal for a mid size university without an engineering school or medical school to reach an R1 designation.
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I see a healthy amount of EngineersâŠdo you?
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Absolutely. Sorry for not including 
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Yeah, IMO PPE is the major Iâm most excited to see at a school. I researched Richmond, and I really like it too (helpâŠI like a lot of colleges), so Iâll probably apply either EA or RD depending on whether I go for Yale EA or Dartmouth/UPenn ED. Thank you!
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