Dating and who pays for the over 40's

Parent Cafe
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<p>Except it is clear in this case that they have gone on multiple dates, and the guy has taken the initiative to ask for the date (which is often the case). Therefore, according to this logic, he should always pay because he is extending the invitation.</p>

<p>I’ve also noticed that the OP and others have characterized the woman in question as being “very generous” apparently because she pays half, and the man is beyond cheap for paying half. </p>

<p>It seems a little sexist to me, unless you consider traditional gender roles where the man pays for everything as not sexist.</p>

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<p>This is a different issue from what I addressed. If it’s a few dollars one way or the other, it’s kind of petty to worry about who is eating more. If it’s extreme, then it’s a faux pas, but instead of going through this they should just break up.</p>

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<p><<i’ve also="" noticed="" that="" the="" op="" and="" others="" have="" characterized="" woman="" in="" question="" as="" being="" “very=”" generous"="" apparently="" because="" she="" pays="" half,="" man="" is="" beyond="" cheap="" for="" paying="" half.="">></i’ve></p>

<p>Except that half of the bill is not equal to what each of them ordered. She orders less then half of the bill total, he orders more. She is generous because she usually (always?) pays for all of her share plus parts of his.</p>

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<p>She knows him - maybe she’d feel better to say before any next date, “I noticed we each eat to our own appetite, which is healthy. So next time, I want to do separate checks so we can each feel free to get whatever we want.” That has a friedlier tone, and keeps the changeover more private. Nobody wants to be embarrassed in public.</p>

<p>ETA: I see Bookworm called for Separate Checks back in post 24.</p>

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<p>“Never love anyone who treats you like you’re ordinary.” Oscar Wilde</p>

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<p>I really cannot imagine even being remotely attracted to a man who conducts himself this way. When you ask a woman out, take her to a place where you can afford to pay the check. Can be something as simple as a neighborhood cafe, a Chinese restaurant or a movie and burger/pizza. Obviously his behavior bothers your friend, so my advice would be to just move on. He sounds awful.</p>

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<p>[The</a> Joy Luck Club Part 3, Chapter 1 Summary](<a href=“http://www.shmoop.com/joy-luck-club/part-3-chapter-1-summary.html]The”>The Joy Luck Club Part 3, Chapter 1 | Shmoop)
Remember that scene in the “Joy Luck Club” where there was a couple who paid separately. They split the grocery money, the wife didn’t eat ice cream, but the husband still insisted on splitting it.

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<p>I tell H to treat me like I am his best customer all the time.</p>

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<p>The important thing is that SHE is unhappy about the situation and this person is NOT meeting her needs. It is awkward when one feels “used” and “being mooched off of.” Life is too short to deal with this if it’s not working for her. </p>

<p>I agree that she could ask for separate checks and be done with it. Since she has other options and isn’t interested in pursuing this relationship, it sounds like she already has her answer and is ending this.</p>

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<p>I agree with the Oscar Wilde quote. </p>

<p>If you’re on your first or maybe second date and you’re not sure of things, sure, split the check. After that, if you want someone, it should show! Offer to make them dinner, take them out dancing, go for a long hike together, etc. Both sides should show interest and reciprocate. It sounds like this man is not really interested since he is treating her cavalierly.</p>

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<p>If this dude is “frugal”, he’s doing it wrong…and I say this as someone who regards frugality as an admirable virtue. </p>

<p>Frugality IMO should be centered and practiced on oneself. In a dating situation or in social events involving others, one should be reasonably generous. </p>

<p>In this context, frugality should be practiced by the frugal person outside of such situations…such as subsisting on rice & beans during the week by one’s lonesome. </p>

<p>Also, I strongly agree with “If you’re the one doing the inviting, you should expect to pay.” </p>

<p>Granted, there’s some confusion among men in their 40’s and younger about this due to inroads made by greater gender equality, confusing changing dating rules as a consequence, and sometimes attitudes of “If women want greater gender equality, then they shouldn’t have their cake and eat it too by expecting men to initiate first/most dates and picking up the entire tab”. </p>

<p>Have some understanding for the confusion…but find the latter BS to be too cheesily idiotic for words.</p>

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<p>Female serial dater here…I’ve been dating a lot over the past year. I read a lot about this before I started, because I have not dated since I was 19, I wanted to limit the amount of mistakes I made, and I did not want to unnecessarily offend anyone. This is not a comfortable subject, because some men (apparently) get offended if the woman pays. On the coffee date, I would always reach for my wallet, but they would pay in the end. In a year of dating, the 20 or so guys I met all paid for the coffee. Once the dating started, since the guy is doing the inviting, he should pay. He should invite you on dates he can afford, and you should be appreciative and thankful. After things got a little more established (for instance, he is now asking me out weekly, but we are not exclusive or “involved”), I would again offer to pay - by doing the “reach for the wallet”, and saying can I pitch in. The guy would always motion to me that he had it covered. When that happens, again, you let him pay. If they ever asked me for date ideas, I was always very conservative and would suggest something simple, like hiking, or billiards somewhere. Eventually, I would offer to make dinner. But this would be after many dates, and not early on, as some might get the wrong idea if done too early. </p>

<p>Many women have issues with being a little too in the ‘masculine’ and are not receptive enough…I thought I didn’t have these issues but I did. 25 years of working in corporate America definitely gave me a “sharp edge” I really didn’t know I had. And since I am around very few women, but the women I am around are just like me, and we think alike, and they were actually telling me some of the wrong things. I’d also have a tendency to want to overgive…it feels SO unnatural to allow a man to pay. I wanted to immediately and evenly reciprocate, but had to squelch that urge.</p>

<p>Once things really got established, they began to let me split some checks. I think also you begin sharing enough information and they know you are far from destitute, and you want to show them you are a team player and that you contribute. But it’s still not 50/50. Another thing I do is go to places where I have a gift card, and I say, hey I have this gift card burning a hole in my wallet. I am going to lose it - or it’s going to expire, so I need to use it. So this is how I would chip in.</p>

<p>I did end up with what seems to be a wonderful boyfriend, FWIW. He is very generous, and we do split more now.</p>

<p>I have to say the guy the OP is talking about sounds weird. I think by setting the precedent that early, she may have thrown off the balance. I guess I’d have to ask how is the relationship going? Are they really into each other, and this is the only issue?</p>

<p>You can all beat me up now!</p>

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<p>I’m old fashioned because, well, I’m old. If on a first date and I like him, I expect him to cover it. If on a first date and I already know I don’t want to see him again, I insist on paying my half. I do expect him to court me. Once we are further along, then I offer to pay, or invite him somewhere I want to go and I try to pay, or, make him dinner, etc. Or I buy tickets to something and tell him I got these tickets, does he want to join me. I don’t expect him to always pay for everything later on, but I like the Oscar Wilde quote. I’m financially independent and can do it, but I’m old fashioned and think he should be courting me. Someone who doesn’t feel the same way probably isn’t right for me.</p>

<p>The man I broke up with over Labor Day weekend was ridiculous though. He was on a fixed income and I had a lot more money than he did, but he would never let me pay. He wouldn’t even let me cover the gas I used when I borrowed his car. I started leaving random money places in his house sometimes to cover some things. I would start to pay and he’d grab the check and say “You get it next time” but he would never let me get it “next time”. I think it was hard on him that I had a better/more steady income and he needed to feel like he was doing the “right” thing.</p>

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<p>He may have been brought up in the traditional idea that men are supposed to pay on outings, no matter what. I can understand that as that mentality was common in my parents’ generation. He may have also been raised in a machismo-oriented culture like the one I grew up with in my old NYC neighborhood where allowing a woman to pick up the tab is considered a serious loss of face. </p>

<p>Personally, I follow the “if you’re doing the inviting, you pay” rule. And IME, while I end up paying most of the time*, I have also been treated, in turn, by my dates when they invited me to dinner or an event. </p>

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<li>Don’t have an issue with this as most women IME, are very understanding about economic constraints if applicable and if they’re not…that’s a good cue to move on to finding/dating someone else as with any jerky individual.</li>
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<p>Her mistake at the first date is that she offered. It makes me think that she is uncomfortable with the money/dating situation.</p>

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<p>Where I live, so many of the single men are underemployed or still being supported by their parents (yes, even in their 40s…I know a guy whose mother just bought him A HOUSE) that it becomes pretty obvious right up front who is going to have to pay. There is also a huge subset who are so strapped from paying child support that they have nothing left. I too am more traditional, I guess, and like the idea of courtship, but that doesn’t happen a lot around here. Because I don’t want someone to drag me down financially, I don’t bother much with dating right now because the prospects are so limited.</p>

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<p>I’m with milkandsugar on this.</p>

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<p>Pumpkin your experience and mine were very similar.</p>

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<p>There is a new Chinese slang expression, according to a magazine I read on a flight, that means ‘dividing the dinner check, while dating, in an unequal way’, such as 70:30.</p>

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<p>sally- In that case, he can invite you to do things that don’t cost a lot of money. Going wandering through a street fair, walking in the park, going out for a coffee, to an inexpensive but tasty diner, etc. Some of the best dates are free or almost free :)</p>

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<p>Unless this is an unusually new and understanding subgroup of Chinese, many Chinese folks…even the younger ones would regard a man proposing this as a “downright caddish cheapskate” and thus, “not worthy of a second glance”. </p>

<p>Especially urban mainlanders…including Hong Kong folks as one issue many Chinese men face with the gender demographic imbalance and extreme materialistic values is that they must not only pay for every date, but also OWN a nice house/condo in a ritzy area. This has been discussed extensively in the Mainland Chinese mass media and among recent immigrants/visitors from the Mainland.</p>