<p>*
I told her I needed to become her mother again and yell at her if it were neccessary and she needed to yell at me, too. I have become so protective of her that we all walk on eggshells so that we don’t upset her.
*</p>
<p>I don’t understand why yelling is necessary.
I agree that her own substance & depression issues should be foremost. I see nothing wrong with couching behavior to not be upsetting to someone who is fragile.</p>
<p>Many of us want to see our children reproduce. We like them and we don’t like the idea of their genes being lost from the gene pool.</p>
<p>Parenting is so much more than genes, I don’t even know where to start.
I doubt either of my kids will give birth or even be parents & that is fine.
I think that they need to be who they are & there are other ways to be involved in the world than giving birth to a child or even adopting one.</p>
<p>Aside from the abuse/depression issue of the OP daughter,
my daughter who is bisexual, went through a period where she basically tried to be " butch".
As butch as a girl who is 5’1" & 100 lbs , and who danced with PNB ballet can be.
( I don’t know if it really got the impact she was looking for, but when you are looking for companionship, there really isn’t any secret handshake & dressing a certain way can be a safer way to say you might be interested, than flat out asking others if they are gay.)</p>
<p>Well, @eaglemom10, there are many gay and lesbian couples raising biological children right now. I recommend you google “Zach Wahls” and “Iowa house” if you’re concerned about how a gay son or daughter might reproduce with their partner and raise healthy, happy children with their own genes.</p>
<p>There was nothing wrong with what applicannot said. Nothing. Those who attacked hir were completely out of line. Zie was not accusing the OP of homophobia. And it seems to me that it might do some of you some good to think about what zie said instead of reflexively dismissing it because of hir age. Or their age, depending on what their pronoun preference may be!</p>
<p>Just because I happen to be personally identified with one side of the so-called binary doesn’t mean I think that the binary is all there is, by the way. Conversely, my rejection of binary stereotypes, and of the belief that being male or female has very much (if anything) to do with how someone is “supposed” to look or act, doesn’t in any way preclude my having a female gender identity. Or preclude the fact that I don’t, and doubt I ever would, identify as “queer.” (Maybe I’m too old, and remember the pejorative use of it too well. Among other reasons I won’t get into.) </p>
<p>Not to mention that none of this gender identity business necessarily has very much to do with sexual orientation, even though “queer” can be used to apply to both. I’ve met some very butch women who identify as women and happen to be interested in men. And some very feminine men who identify as men and happen to be interested in women. Even if everyone thinks they’re lying or self-deluded.</p>
<p>I agree with others who say that the OP’s daughter has a bunch of difficult issues to deal with but that her sexual orientation is not one of them, unless she herself perceives it that way.</p>
<p>Having read only the original post and last two pages, I’ve noticed people miss a huge point: sexual abuse at a young age can create many disturbances in one’s sexual orientation. However, she is seeing a counselor and will hopefully sort through these issues. She might realize she is actually straight, cool. She may be a true lesbian, whatever. As a parent, you should support her no matter what sexual orientation she identifies as.</p>
<p>If she does not feel like the current counselor can help her very much, ask Health & Counseling Services to recommend a professional who specializes in treating patients who have a history sexual abuse from their childhood.</p>
<p>I completely agree! I think this addresses the smaller issue (sexuality) as well as the bigger issues of abuse and self-destructive behavior. Just be there for your D and see her through this. It doesn’t matter if you’re seeing your “gay” daughter or “straight” daughter through some issues, just stand by her. </p>
<p>Also, I found applicannot’s post to be very well thought out as well(but she’s a Smithie, so of course it was :D)</p>
<p>And I have no doubt that your first sentence is sometimes true, too. My only hesitation is that (without getting too controversial, if I can!) there are certain groups of people who take the position that the sexual orientation and/or gender identity of LGBT people is always<a href=“or,%20at%20least,%20very%20frequently”>/U</a> the result of childhood sexual abuse, and, therefore, represents some kind of mental disorder.</p>
<p>Which, as I"m confident most of you realize, is absolute nonsense.</p>
<p>I firmly believe that if there’s any correlation whatsoever between childhood sexual abuse and being LGBT, it usually goes in precisely the opposite direction. In other words, that there’s often a vulnerability and “differentness” about children who are LGBT (whether or not they’re completely aware of being LGBT yet on a conscious level) – and a secretiveness that might make them less likely to “tell” – that predators can sometimes sense. And take advantage of.</p>
<p>And I do speak from at least some personal experience, since I was sexually abused repeatedly by a doctor for a number of years starting when I was 11, and know perfectly well that it had nothing to do with causing me to be who I am. Which I was already well aware of, as I had been since earliest childhood. I didn’t say a word to anyone. I was way too embarrassed to tell my mother, couldn’t even imagine saying anything to my father, and was quite good at keeping secrets. Besides, the doctor managed to half-convince me that all of it (including the photographs, yikes) was medically necessary to determine whether I’d reached puberty yet, etc. Remember, this was long before children were taught to recognize that sort of thing, and not to be afraid to speak up. So when my mother would ask me afterward what took me so long in there, all I’d say was, “he was examining me.” Did the doctor somehow sense that I wasn’t going to say anything, either during (when I just sort of froze and did what I was told by the tall patrician authority figure in the white coat, stupid as that seems in retrospect) or after? Who knows, but it’s hard to imagine that he took that sort of risk with every child patient, even in the 1960’s. Not everyone could possibly have been as naive as I was.</p>
<p>Applicannot is not a Smithie but a Stanfordian :-)</p>
<p>I am also female-identified (i.e., female) and generally feminine-presenting, so if anyone’s curious, my preferred gender pronoun is female (but neutral is welcome and male is not a problem).</p>
<p>I didn’t write that post because I thought the OP was delving too much into her daughter’s sexuality. I recognize that there are many, many issues at stake - that the OP’s daughter has many, bigger problems. But the original post and the title of this thread focused on one subject, and few others were addressing that particular issue - so I did.</p>
<p>Also, DonnaL, I have never personally been a fan of the term “queer” but it’s the accepted term over here and I’ve become accustomed to using it.</p>
Cut that nonsense out. It is no one’s fault other than the abuser’s and you blaming yourself will do no more good than if she were to feel responsible. I’m sure she knows this as well.</p>
<p>Drinking to blackout is not necessarily a sign of alcoholism. She is a young person in college. I know lots of people, myself included, who have blacked out a few times and are not alcoholics, nor are they on the path to becoming alcoholics. I have simply cut down on drinking since then and am perfectly fine. However, If it has happened repeatedly with no end in sight, then this obviously does not apply to her.</p>
<p>applicannot, my son, who happens to be gay himself (and identifies as gay, not queer), tells me that where he goes to school (the U of Chicago), queer is the most common word too. So he’s more used to it than he was in high school, when he told me he really disliked the word.</p>
<p>Would your daughter’s college (the wellness center/counselor or a private counselor) AND your daughter agree to family counseling? </p>
<p>Not to change her, but to help you all as a family - even if it’s just the two of you - mom and daughter - work to understand each other better? It would be worth the four hour drive (and money) if it helped your daughter with the risky behavior and anger/depression(?) and if it helped you feel more like she was safe. </p>
<p>“She might realize she is actually straight, cool. She may be a true lesbian, whatever. As a parent, you should support her no matter what sexual orientation she identifies as.”</p>
<p>But OP is not “cool” w/ D being a lesbian. Interesting that with a history of abuse, alcohol and depression, the focus - - as evinced by the thread’s title - - is on D’s sexual orientation.</p>
<p>NYC, you have absolutely no idea of what I am and am not “cool” with. Again, my husband and I have told our daughter that we only want her to be happy.
I’m a confused parent looking for someone who may have had similar experiences and could offer some advice and encouragement.
I said I was wrong for labeling this thread as “daughter coming out” when there is much, much more at issue here.
She has “come out” and is now putting herself in dangerous situations with the group of women that she identifies with. So you see, in my befuddled mind, there is a very real connection that threads ALL of the issues together.</p>
<p>Give the OP a break. She said up thread that her emphasis on her D’s sexuality may have been misplaced. She is dealing with a lot right now. I appreciate all the education on gender identity/sexuality because it is very confusing and when you do not have a lot of natural exposure to it then you tend to have a lot of questions. </p>
<p>Applicannot - you made a lot of great points and I’m glad to hear them, but your original post did initially come across as a little preachy. </p>
<p>The OP is looking for advice and for a place to vent. For those of us who are open to LGBT but have a lot we do not understand, I feel defensive when we honestly ask questions but are labeled “homophobic”. (I think that was implied, not outwardly stated)</p>
<p>It’s clear that the OP’s D has many issues and is grasping at straws for answers. Her D’s sexuality is one piece. Be supportive of her questioning and educate all of us; don’t slam her for not being all-knowing.</p>
<p>cross posted with above because it took too long to gather my thoughts!</p>
<p>Thank you. I’m licking my wounds here, it’s been a rough day.
What I would like to make abundantly clear is that we have been loving, accepting and supportive of our daughter.
Privately? I am confused. I have questions. She came home angry, announced “I’m f<em>^</em>ing gay, ok?!” was involved with a woman who uses meth, drinking to blackout stage- on many occasions, so many that some “friends” call her “blackout _____”
and now goes to what she calls “rages” -I think they are like raves where they play the techno music, and does “X” and who only knows what else.
Look, as soon as she told me of the abuse, I got her into counseling. She wasn’t ready to talk and hated the therapist. We tried going together, I was the one doing all the talking. We tried EMDR therapy which involves the use of light and desensitizing the eyes. That was too difficult for her to bear at the time too. We have honestly tried to do our best by her. Now her mind and body are in a state of anxiety and the results have us fearing for her life. This is my child, my firstborn. Every night i beg god to please release her from her pain and let her live a happy, healthy life. If being a lesbian will bring her joy and peace, I say bring it. I am questioning everything, because ever since she has said she is gay, her behavior has become totally self-destructive. I am having trouble separating the issues because the issues are all presenting together, and I know they all stem from the abuse.</p>
<p>Thank you. I apologize for my defensive posts last evening.
Pearl, I think family counseling is a great idea, the distance is not a problem, but her reluctance is. Over winter break, D2 said to us, “Here I thought we were one of the coolest families around until I discovered how dysfunctional we ALL are!” Glad she still has her sense of humor!</p>
