How does it work, anyways, being the thought police? How do you reason telling someone what they can approve or disapprove of?
You can only control yourself. You can try to guide your children, though after awhile, good luck on that. You can’t control and demand what other people are allowed to think.
And in the end, that is what this thread is all about. You can control your own thoughts and choices, but you really can’t control others. And why would one think they have the right to?
I haven’t read all the comments, and thankfully seems there are enough answers to the original question.
I want to comment on how gray bra straps scream skank, and how dirty and unkempt are the worst (or something like that). (Back on like page 2 or 3) I hope we can all think about that, and change our way of thinking on that. I think everyone is doing the best they can, and if they have a dirty bra it’s probably because they just don’t get it, or only have one bra, or didn’t have anyone to teach them how to do laundry. I don’t know how any of those things equate one bit with skank. It actually hurts my heart that any adult would judge a young person that way. Same with dirty or unkempt. Man, please don’t judge such superficial things. That issue is totally about you. To me dirty and unkempt can say “I’m depressed,” or “I’m rejecting superficial mores,” or “I’m so busy with school and work, and family commitments…I’m doing the best I can.” It could also just say I’m from a different culture, which could even be a hippy culture, or maybe just from a poor family where to have any clothes to wear was good enough. Please stop. Be kind in your actions, but also in your heart and mind.
Me? Raised poor, hand-me-down clothes, awesome mom doing the best she could, had gray bras, now a proud hippy who can go camping for a week, and not be stressed about not having showers. Happen to also be pretty well educated, can work a professional job and dress the part, fairly well-off, impeccably honest, authentic to a fault, and a very kind-hearted person with amazing, repsectable friends and family who think I’m pretty ok…
It is interesting to read people writing what other people SHOULD or SHOULD NOT think. Seems like a very useless power trip to me. I can and do judge the taste of others. I’m sure others judge my taste as well. If there are folk who never judge anyone or anything, more power to them, but I believe they are the extreme minority. I don’t voice my judgments unless my opinions are sought.
So if someone disapproves of your disapproval of some aspect of their clothing, you consider that to be “thought police”, but you do not consider your own disapproval of their clothing to be “thought police” against what they think their own clothing should be?
Some people confine their judgement to things that actually matter in the overall scheme of things. Like whether the job candidate demonstrates the skills needed to do the job, rather than whether the clothes s/he is wearing are perfectly tailored.
ehhh honestly there are bigger deals out there than how girls dress. why is it such a big deal
No one has previously mentioned whether there is perfectly tailored clothing is a consideration @ucbalumnus–that is something entirely new thrown into a thread about scantily clad folks.
One often has initial impressions based on appearances because that is what first presents itself. It is not the best way to know anyone and can be over-ridden by “things that matter,” but still makes an impression if one feels attire is inappropriate/provocative/tight etc.
I have no problem with people disagreeing with me. I think they can disagree without personal attacks, though. I do not think, however, that telling others what they should approve of or not is acceptable. That is, “thought police”. Disagreeing with others is fine. Telling people what they should or should not think is different. Understand?
I have some loved ones whom I dearly care about. They are over 21 but wear clothing I believe is very unflattering–too short and too tight. I think they show poor taste but don’t voice it because I’m not asked and they are happy with their choices. One of these people is in her 20s and the other in her 50s.
I also feel men who wear slacks which are too long and baggy look messy/sloppy. I don’t offer an opinion about those unless I’m asked.
I have read this entire thread. I’m on the side of the short-shorts girls, and the grey bra girls, even though I’ve never seen a scandalously exposed dingy bra strap ( I’ll be on the lookout). Bra police!
I’m one of those 70’s girls who wore hot pants and tube tops and halter tops. My own mother (born in 1918) crocheted one for me, and she was an extremely conservative Catholic mom, so go figure. The Big Clothing Conflict that I remember was when my older sister patched the backside of her jeans with fabric scraps. It was my dad who found that offensive, but he never explained why. It wasn’t the American Flag, so I’m still not sure.Maybe just the idea of drawing attention to her butt. It was the only time he ever expressed an opinion on what we wore.
I had an awesome white halter style bodysuit. I was fifteen. One problem:nipples. No one at the time (except maybe Carly Simon) wanted to let the world know that they had nipples. The solution? Bandaids! We all used them to blur the nipples. My mom thought I looked cute in this top, but she was never encouraging me to be a THOT, haha. She said I had a “cute shape.”
My son recently was visited by some adorable young women, fellow graduates. One is Muslim, and wore demure clothes. The other friend is a beautiful Dominican girl. Her giant pouf of hair, and her gorgeous body in tiny shorts and tank top was startling to me at first. Not a normal day in my living room…She was smart and sweet and so courteous, and I realized that she was dressed the same as me at 15, only she was better at it. And she’s over 21, And she definitely had a “cute shape.”
I’m a big fan of girls of all shapes and sizes, and although I might feel sorry for someone who made a poor fashion choice, I police my own thoughts, and when an ugly one comes to mind I examine it.
Is it an ugly thought that someone made a poor or unattractive fashion choice? Why? Isn’t that what the thread expensive but awful is about?
The ugliness comes in, IMO, when someone makes the leap from “poor fashion choice, not flattering, I wouldn’t wear that” to value judgements on a woman’s character, intelligence, morals, and what not - evidence of which we’ve seen in some posts here. I think that territory has been covered here several times.
I have never participated in the expensive but awful thread. I don’t enjoy it. I have opinions and preferences, and some of my thoughts are unkind. I don’t try to justify my unkind thoughts.
I don’t judge morals of the male or female wearer, just fashion sense (or lack thereof) as to what looks amazing vs ok/good vs awful on the individual wearing it and is appropriate to the setting. If it’s amazing and something I may be interested in emulating, I take a mental note and consider it when I shop for clothing, particularly if my build is similar. Similarly if it looks awful, I try to figure out why I think that and whether I have similar outfits I ought to consider tossing.
I admit that I consider most outfits (worn by me or others) ok/good and unremarkable and not memorable.
Free the nipple?! That’s hilarious. I cannot keep up - first girls shaved everything, now they shave nothing?
FTR - I have a 21 yo d who is a senior in a southern college. I’m not always in love with her clothing choices, but I have more of an issue with the ripped nearly to shreds jeans. I feel like my job is to still support and guide her. If she was all knowing she wouldn’t still be in college and living on mom and dad’s dime. She can laugh now when I put my hands over my eyes. She knows dad will feign a heart attack when she comes out in something very revealing. I’m not trying to suppress her or shame her, she’s a beautiful young lady and I want her to feel good about herself and how she chooses to present herself. I took her shopping for clothes for her birthday. She trusts my style and judgment of how she looks in things. She definitely has her day wear to class, her going out on the weekends clothes, going on a date clothes, doing presentations in business class clothes. But it would inappropriate as well to wear a business suit out on Saturday night. Is it shaming if her friends would find that a little strange? Maybe inappropriate is the wrong word. Learning the right environment to wear the right clothes is by no means shaming or wrong.
I try not and get into battles on things that don’t matter. My son didn’t cut his hair for years in college and I hated it. Right after graduation, without saying a word he went out and got a more flattering cut.
My d loves makeup. She loves watching youtube videos, spends a lot of her money on makeup. Yes, she does a beautiful job, however, I believe young is in itself beautiful. Her skin is beautiful and clear and smooth, she doesn’t need to cover up so much. By no means do I shame her but I do tell her she’s beautiful without makeup as well.
I think support and guidance is still our jobs.
“NO WAY he’d let his MS sis out of the house wearing those short shorts.”
What country? Where are hs age boys governing their sisters? Think about it.
Ripped to shreds jeans! I wonder what worlds some of us moved in, lol. In the early 70’s (mind you, 40+ years ago,) we called ripped jeans and an expensive sweater “the Princeton look.” Kid you not.
I still like the look. But I suspect you had to be (or feel) part of the broad movement to reexamine…well, a lot of things.
Ha.
The OP was asking about her daughter, age 20. I find the age important-if she were much older it would be safe to assume she understands the messages being sent or received by her dress, whether intentionally or not. But depending on the kid, 20 can be still naive in some ways, and if your own mother can’t tell you the truth about how you look and how that may be perceived by others, then I guess no one can. I’ve been in far too many meetings or groups where people made an important decision based on someone’s appearance. Unfair, perhaps, but I want my daughter to be aware and act accordingly.
I’ve read most but not all of the replies and here are a few random thoughts.
On the topic of grey bra straps- don’t like them, the same way I don’t like white shirts that have turned grey, but don’t think it is a ‘skank’ thing, it is a washing machine thing. On a what to pack for college thread, someone introduced me to color catchers, which seem like a wonderful invention to keep grey straps at bay! Nude bras are also great. Don’t turn grey and don’t show through clothes.
On the topic of bralettes- they are great under strappy clothes for smaller busted women/girls, as an alternative to letting your regular bra strap show.
Not shaming anyone, but I don’t like to see butt cheeks hanging out when I’m walking behind someone. Sometimes the thought that pops into my head is that they must not have a full length mirror. I tell my D’s to check all angles before leaving the house.
I do agree with the many posters that say in one way or another, that clothes do say something about you. They telegraph an image. Maybe it’s unfair but it’s the reality. I do talk to my D’s about classy vs trashy. I tell them if they can envision Kate Middleton wearing it, it’s a good choice, one of the Kardashian’s, maybe not so good.
For the poster who said she’s happy she doesn’t have girls, I always have said it’s a big responsibility having boys- to teach them how to really respect women, whether they are in the presence of women or not.
Some here are now getting sweetsy. “Oh, just know you may be judged, dearie.” Well sure.
But some may have missed the arc of this thread: some here have distinctly pointed to others who make these clothing choices and proclaimed skank or ho.
And others approved, Liked. Some have repeated their verdict, even tried to explain. Lol, (“Of course they’re skanks, look at them.”)
And then, while pronouncing judgment, they plead against thought police. “Don’t judge me for judging you.” Lol.
Kwazy.
How about, judge not, lest ye be judged? Where’s mind your own business come in?
Wisteria, Kate is royalty and you see her on official business. Remember what she wss wearing when William first noticed her, the fashion show?
And I doubt roycroftmom ("…meetings or groups where people made an important decision based on someone’s appearance") is taking those meetings at the mall. With a bunch of young gals out with friends.