<p>My kids go to a private school with a zero tolerance policy- every year at least a couple of seniors, and usually a junior or two get themselves expelled. (no refund either) Since we have been there a bulk of them seem to happen towards the end of the senior year - they can smoke, get high and drink on 9,999 places just not school and yet they insist- that they do it there. Every year some first timer and some I usually buy my way out person learns the hard lesson…I just don’t understand why when the rules are so clear, the enforcement of the rules is seen year after year why these “bright” kids can’t rebel someplace other than school. I would rather my kids know that he has to pay the consequences of his actions than to figure the rules don’t apply to him and drive drunk, or try something where someones life is taken. If the punishment was inappropriate the time to question it was not when they were caught! It’s not the end of their world by any means and the good parents will sit their kids down and try and learn from it.</p>
<p>I agree with you 2by2. And for me it is not a matter of the kids being bright. Anyone mentally capable of attending a regular high school is also capable of learning the most basic of rules. I would expect the exact same of all students and not only the bright ones.</p>
<p>“Bright” always cracks me up. </p>
<p>I really believe there is “book smart” and “street smart.” To me, knowing of the the rules and the draconian consequences, say of pot, and getting caught is neither book smart nor street smart.</p>
<p>Some posters really think the issue is the harshness of the school’s penalties for pot. I doubt any school is going to expressly have one penalty for the “bright” kids and another penalty for the --what–“not bright” kids.</p>
<p>Some will argue that derailing a “bright” kid is too harsh. I did a paper on Leopold and Loeb in college. “Bright” should never be a justification for what is against the rules.</p>
<p>Hyperjulie said in post #40:</p>
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<p>I agree completely. Parents do their children no favors when they make excuses for them. As the parent of three (now adult children), I have been through some painful and distressing situations where I had to watch my kids suffer consequences imposed by others. Not very often and not really harsh ones, thankfully, because my kids were taught from day one that rules matter and breaking of these rules will result in unpleasant consequences.</p>
<p>Why is there an assumption that the parents are making excuses for their kids? I’m not seeing that. I also would like to see the exact words of the policy before concluding that “they clearly knew the consequences”. Did they know the punishment was a year out of their school? I doubt it. I suspect the consequence that was “advertised” was suspension and somewhere buried in text was the discretion to choose a time period of up to a year. You can go to jail for over a year in some states for reckless driving or having a fake ID. However, no one actually does.<br>
As a parent who has fought this battle (never with respect to drugs- to make this clear for when my posts are revealed when my kids are running for public office), I have no problem with these parents trying to salvage their kids’ education and get an appropriate consequence. I would feel the same way if a year out of school punishment was imposed on someone from a less affluent high school. Smoking pot or drinking on a school trip is stupid but happens ALL THE TIME. It is a very typical thing for a kid to do. In 1970 I had classmates who smoked pot on my high school senior trip!<br>
Breaking rules happens all the time, too. Kudos to those of you wonderful parents who think you have taught your kids that every time they break a rule there will (or can) be a consequence. Where do you see that behavior modeled? In our leaders? In our athletes? In our law enforcement workers? On TV? In relationships?
Bright kids are often more inclined to analyze the rules and figure out what chances they are willing to take. They are more inclined to think they won’t get caught. Bright or not- they are subject to peer pressure.
I hate to tell you how much drinking and smoking pot goes on at Model UN. I bet the suspension rate for Model UN delegates is extremely high. I read about school after school having “issues” at Model UN.<br>
Yes, there should be consequences. But to tank a high school record- and this punishment WILL do that- is excessive.</p>
<p>“Why is there an assumption that the parents are making excuses for their kids?”</p>
<p>Because of this:</p>
<p>“Smoking pot or drinking on a school trip is stupid but happens ALL THE TIME. It is a very typical thing for a kid to do.”</p>
<p>It sounds like you have had problems with your children following rules. Maybe they have gotten the message that you think their rule breaking behavior is “typical” and normal and that you will make sure that they suffer as few consequences as possible?</p>
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<p>Wow. Sounds a lot like “everyone else does it, so why is it a big deal if I do it??”</p>
<p>That does not cut it for me or for my family. And it is NOT a “typical” thing at all for the kids that my kids hung out with. And I was around them and their friends a lot…often was the chaperone on trips and such.</p>
<p>Oh…this is crazy. Recognizing that kids break rules (and many do) and telling your kids that it’s OK are two different things.
I haven’t seen one parent here argue that the kids at Brentwood should get off with zero consequences.
Just because it’s the rule doesn’t mean it’s always RIGHT to enforce the rule. Let’s say I’m a parent who sets a certain punishment for catching my kid drinking. One full year of staying in his or her bedroom after school. No activities. No anything…dinner brought up to him. Isolation treatment. Kid is caught with one beer. Does everyone here think that’s OK to go ahead because “them’s the rules”. Again, shouldn’t there be some kind of line here???</p>
<p>“Recognizing that kids break rules (and many do) and telling your kids that it’s OK are two different things.”</p>
<p>These two things are often related. Very often. And it’s also wrong to think that just because some parents have kids who repeatedly stretch and break rules that all kids do it. Some kids are mostly rule breakers with little respect for authority. Some kids obey the rules nearly 100 percent of the time. And most kids, like most adults, are somewhere in between.</p>
<p>I don’t see the problem with the year at alternative school. No doubt the kids can self study for any topic they choose, including AP exam subjects. Maybe the world will have one or two fewer white collar criminals as a result of this consequence.</p>
<p>They could have been arrested. Talk about consequences!</p>
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<p>So how do you feel about this now?</p>
<p>I’d like to think I could send my non-substance (for health reasons) kid to a school-sponsored trip without having to worry about exposure to illicit activities on school time.</p>
<p>Toneranger, your example does not really apply in this instance, IMO because:</p>
<p>-In your example, the parent who sets unreasonable “consequences” (or punishment) will not be able to (nor should they) enforce those consequences.
-In the article in the OP, the consequences for behavior that was CLEARLY outside the “rules” were known consequences and, IMO, “reasonable” consequences;
-If the parents involved did not think these consequences were reasonable, their issues with the set rules should have been resolved BEFORE their kids broke those rules, not after the fact. As someone here has previously pointed out.</p>
<p>Purpleflurp- What is your other screen name on this forum? You registered this name in October 2008 but have never posted on any topics other than in Cafe or political forum. You have a post count of 2. Most people who join this site do so for information or to share regarding colleges, applications etc. You seem to have joined under this particular identity for some other reason. Just curious.</p>
<p>Yes, I have one kid- a very smart, successful kid- who has failed to observe rules on occasion. I suspect it would have happened even with a less inept parent/role model! </p>
<p>How do I feel about my classmates smoking pot 39 years ago on a school trip? It didn’t bother me when I learned about it at the time and it doesn’t bother me now. I didn’t do it and if they chose to take that risk, so be it. My crowd was too busy drinking! (only kidding- we didn’t drink on the trip)</p>
<p>Momof WildChild: how in the world did you manage to rack up almost 5 thousand posts? You have been a member only a little longer than me, and I cannot imagine how I would have spent that much time on CC.</p>
<p>No intended criticism of any particular parent on my part via my posts. I apologize if you felt I was being critical of you personally. I just feel strongly that appropriate consequences are the best way to shape behavior, and have seen kids whose parents attempt to shield them from those consequences over and over…and they suffer from that in the long run.</p>
<p>“Purpleflurp- What is your other screen name on this forum? You registered this name in October 2008 but have never posted on any topics other than in Cafe or political forum.”</p>
<p>I don’t understand. I only have one screen name. I read this forum for a long time before I joined last October. I am gathering college information, but I will not post about my kid on the college threads because I do not want other parents at our school identiying me or my kid. I am not comfortable with that. My post count does not make my opinion any less valuable than another poster’s.</p>
<p>The private school where my boys went has a zero tolerance for drugs. They would be have been expelled. They would have to get a GED or something from their school district. </p>
<p>Our school district contracts with a drug counseling program where kids continue their education on site at a hospital that specializes in such problems. Depending on the incident, you may not be permitted to return to the school but get your diploma from them by doing work through through the center.</p>
<p>Are we assuming all these kids have a drug problem? </p>
<p>Churchmusicmom- I guess I have a lot to say! :)</p>
<p>“Maybe the world will have one or two fewer white collar criminals as a result of this consequence”</p>
<p>You can’t be serious. That’s quite a jump from smoking a doobie at 16 or 17 to white collar crime. Gimme a break!</p>
<p>I wish Madoff’s parents had been more consistent with enforcing rules.</p>
<p>Yea, Bernie was probably lighting up in the parking lot of Far Rockaway High School back in the 50’s dreaming up ponzi schemes. I’m sure that’s exactly how it all started! :)</p>
<p>You know, I have taught my kids to follow the rules. My parents did that too - and I rarely got in trouble (OK, maybe once or twice :)).
In this particular case, I feel strongly that the consequences are too severe. I may not be able to fight them - so my kid and I would likely have to live with them if I was in that public school district (I’m not dealing with much of choice here!) But that wouldn’t stop me from making my views known if my kid was involved. And fighting for him. On the flip side, if my kid did something wrong and the school imposed too weak a punishment, (like the gun infraction someone mentioned) I would most certainly add to it on my own. And I HAVE in the past. I actually have quite a low tolerance for screw-ups. </p>
<p>Kids like these should suffer consequences. Short term pain (withdrawal from school and activities for a short period of time), and hard-earned lessons (mandatory education on drugs/alcohol and perhaps some community service in a drug rehab). But not long term damage to their futures.I dont’ care if they’re Intel winners or just getting by. My opinion. And yes, I would fight for my kid, not to shield him from consequences, but to try to show him how what he did was wrong without damaging his future. At least for the first mistake. Now, the second time, that’s a different story.</p>