<p>Yes I did show them the thread. They, as did I, understood the original post to be from a mother who wasn’t sure that her daughter would feel comfortable with a gay roommate. NOT BECAUSE SHE WAS GOING TO GET HIT ON, but because she might feel uncomfortable (whether it’s founded or not) dressing/undressing in front of the roommate or comfortably lounging not FULLY clothed in front of her. As they laughingly perused the threads, they (as did I) couldn’t understand how this “feeling” would turn anybody into a bigot and a racist. They also stated that they wouldn’t want to room with someone who for whatever reason didn’t feel comfortable with their sexuality; although, they agreed that it didn’t necessarily make them bigots but rather misinformed. In addition to having to deal with the freshman college experience, they agreed that they wouldn’t want to have to be the ones to “inform” or “educate” anybody about gayness. They would prefer to room with somebody who wasn’t an “issue”. So there it is. If they don’t see racism or bigotry in my opinion, that’s really all I care about.</p>
<p>“It isn’t a question of stereotyping, just of numbers. Population surveys show the incidence of gay women in the population as under 3%. But the same surveys show homosexual experimentation among women at something like 6 times that. It’s not a matter of stereotyping, just odds.”</p>
<p>Okay. We haven’t really talked about bisexuality on this board yet, have we?</p>
<p>Alh, too bad you have a dear straight relative who insults your son at every opportunity. Don’t lump ColumbiaMom and me and others in the same category as your bigoted relatives. I feel sorry that you don’t get it, i.e. get the fact that having opinions different from yours does not make others bigots. And I understand that you are super-sensitive about the issue, and judging everyone here, because of your bigot relative. It’s okay. </p>
<p>I am not pre-judging any gay person.I don’t insult anyone, gay or not. The girl who was uncomfortable about changing in the presence of a gay girl does not think the girl is going to attack her or rape her. She probably would not change in front of a straight guy either. Who cares? Obviously the college in question allowed the change. </p>
<p>I’m glad I don’t take offense at things that are not personal attacks. Why don’t we all just bury this thread. It’s getting quite ridiculous talking about experimenting and bi-sexuality.</p>
<p>I do agree that some are getting a bit into naming or attacking others. I think that is not good either. I think there are polite ways to explain your point of view on the issue and no need to say anything about the PERSON who holds that view. I disagree with some views on here but am not against the messenger. I think the discussion is good and fine if it does not cross the line into personal attacks. For some, it is becoming that. It is best to stick with a viewpoint and state it and not anything about the person giving the view.
Susan</p>
<p>Guilty as charged!! You are right; I am super-sensitive. Like most of the Moms here on CC I tend to be over-involved and over-protective and want my kids college experience to be a happy one. In my case that means I have to be concerned about both verbal and physical harassment. And I think it is important to object to offensive language and openly offensive views because (imo as a super-sensitive mama) when common in conversation and regarded as an acceptable form of debate, it makes physical violence more likely to be seen as acceptable. And although that is something that has not been discussed in this thread, I am guessing it is a constant worry with parents of gay college students. I know it is with me. When gay kids are discussed as being somehow different than other kids and creating a different set of problems than straight kids it puts them in a perilous position… again this is my mama opinion. I absolutely dont object to any opinion anyone has anywhere until it negatively impacts someone else. When it impacts my child I have HUGE objections. Some comments that some of you feel are just opinions to which you are justly entitled will negatively impact my child if these opinions are widespread. Yes, I am super-sensitive and take offense. And I have no illusions about changing someone elses opinion. But the reality of the situation for my son is that he lives in a country where he cannot really expect to have a legally recognized committed monogamous relationship or enter certain professions. And that more likely than not his roommates will be uncomfortable.</p>
<p>Alh…I definitely appreciate your perspective and it is important for someone like you to raise awareness.</p>
<p>By the way, I live in Vermont and we have civil unions for gay partners.
Susan</p>
<p><a href=“http://headlines.agapepress.org/archive/8/192005a.asp[/url]”>http://headlines.agapepress.org/archive/8/192005a.asp</a></p>
<p>Court Sides with Student on Right to Wear Scripture-Bearing Shirt
By Jim Brown
August 19, 2005</p>
<p>(AgapePress) - A federal judge has told an Ohio school district it can no longer bar a middle school student from wearing a t-shirt with a Christian message.</p>
<p>Judge George Smith has ruled that Sheridan Middle School in Thornville violated the constitutional rights of student James Nixon by prohibiting him from wearing a t-shirt bearing a quote from the Bible verse John 14:6. The front of the shirt reads: “Jesus said, ‘I am the Way, the Truth, and the Life.’” The back of the shirt contains the statements: “Homosexuality is sin. Islam is a lie. Abortion is murder.”</p>
<p>Although no complaints were filed over Nixon’s t-shirt, a few school officials – described by the student’s attorney as “overzealous” – deemed its message may be “offensive” to some individuals and “potentially disruptive,” and thus could not be displayed.</p>
<p>Nixon’s attorney, James Nelson of the Orlando-based American Liberties Institute, says the decision handed down by Judge Smith has a “broad, sweeping significance,” especially for students in the southern district of Ohio, many of whom he says were watching for the outcome.</p>
<p>“Other students and parents had been waiting for this decision to know whether or not their own children and students may now wear their shirts,” Nelson shares.</p>
<p>Nelson asserts the judge’s ruling sets a persuasive precedent. “We believe that Judge Smith really worked through the issues well, in a way that some courts don’t,” the attorney says. “He truly picked apart the precedent and the cases from the Supreme Court and other jurisdictions and tried to make a very comprehensive and coherent opinion which could be utilized by other courts across the country.”</p>
<p>The attorney feels that due to the jurisdiction of Smith’s court over other schools and school districts, the ruling will allow students to freely express their viewpoint on the same issues and to wear the same t-shirt to school."</p>
<p>Isn’'t free speach great…haters can wear their hatred on their backs</p>
<p>What I find most interesting about this article is that the shirt’s message is characterized as “Christian”. Gotta wonder how Christ would feel about a t-shirt that shows such intolerance of others.</p>
<p>Yep…and from what I read, it sounds like many kids have them…the front of the shirt…"The front of the shirt reads: </p>
<p>“Jesus said, ‘I am the Way, the Truth, and the Life.’” </p>
<p>I think that kind of shirt puts a public face on a lot of hatred and intolerance in this country that is happening now</p>
<p>I would love to know who makes them so I can be sure and never buy one of their products</p>
<p>cgm, I doubt that you’d be buying a product from the maker of those abominable shirts anyway. </p>
<p><a href=“http://www.operationsaveamerica.org/store/[/url]”>http://www.operationsaveamerica.org/store/</a></p>
<p>So much hatred, and in the name of what. <em>sigh</em></p>
<p>Should have known…egad</p>
<p>for most students at least on these boards- it seems to be a non issue
While some schools will allow you to change rooms if the roommate situation is really unworkable- or even possibly get a single room as my niece at Colgate was finally able to due late sophmore year after her roommates routinely used the room for sex/drinking ( straight roomates BTW) part of college is learning to get along with other people- and learning how to deal with not being able to have control over minutae that dont really matter that much.
WHen I was in middle/high school we had to take showers in PE- you dealt with people looking at you and you got over it.
It sounds like the people who are freaking out over the possiblity of a lesbian roommate being attracted to her straight roommate and the horrors of “looking” at her in that way- are trying to divert themselves from whatever else is going on with sending their daughter off to college.</p>
<p>A number of the adults here should be ashamed of themselves. </p>
<p>I won’t mention names because you know who you are. There is way too much hatred and spite here to be believe that there is a genuinely altruistic motivation behind such insipid name calling and condemning of people who simply share their opinions and beliefs on this or any subject, rightly or wrongly.</p>
<p>I agree with some of the comments made and disagree with others, I particularly agree with the following from soozievt:</p>
<p>I think there are polite ways to explain your point of view on the issue and no need to say anything about the PERSON who holds that view. I disagree with some views on here but am not against the messenger. I think the discussion is good and fine if it does not cross the line into personal attacks. For some, it is becoming that. It is best to stick with a viewpoint and state it and not anything about the person giving the view.
Susan</p>
<p>To be witty or committed is one thing, to be hateful is quite another.</p>
<p>You do not have to agree with opinions you disapprove of, only act like a responsible adult while you disagree.</p>
<p>Adults should have more dignity than this, it says a lot about their views that they dont.</p>
<p>Im 45 and Ive rarely seen such childish and churlish behavior from an educated adult as I have seen here.</p>
<p>I doubt what I have said will have any effect, but I felt compelled to say it.
I will say no more on the subject.</p>
<p>My son has a gay roomate in his suite (per facebook research). He’s ok with it. His comment was “hey, maybe he’ll be neat and clean up for us - and you KNOW how girls love gay guys - so maybe he’ll attract the ladies to our suite!”</p>
<p>I guess the only downside is that my son is african american and has spent his life in attending small, mostly white private schools - and his HS was Quaker and had many gay students - so he’s not phased by gay life. He decided to sign up for the black-themed housing at college to experience something new and connect to other african americans - and his roomies in the black college house are both white - 1 gay and 1 straight. </p>
<p>He thinks they both seem “really cool” - but the irony is kind of funny.:)</p>
<p>That is ironic/funny, Momsdream! When I attended Hamilton College back in the late 70’s, the BLSU (Black and Latin Student Union) parties became so popular, campus-wide, that we soon became a small minority at our own parties. It was surreal—in one way, flattering, in another, dismaying.</p>
<p>Taking a deep breath and going back to the original post, which if I can paraphrase correctly was: young woman learns prospective roommate is a lesbian and that the third roommate has already chosen to leave the room. Discussion is about feeling uncomfortable/potential problems with a gay roommate. Making an effort I am going to accept and respect the feelings and opinions that create such a scenario. Please understand I am absolutely sincere when I pose the following questions to those students and parents who have opinions so different than my own: How do you want a gay student to handle the roommate situation? Do you want the student to let your child know about his/her orientation? If so, in what way? Do you believe a gay student should be required to let straight roommates know his/her orientation? Do you think they should be required to let the housing office know? How should the roommate situation be handled if a student comes out for the first time over the holiday break? a rather common scenario. Should the gay student contact the straight student over the break to give that student the option of changing rooms before next term? Is it taking advantage of straight roommates if you know you are gay but arent out yet? Should the gay student request a single and avoid this issue altogether? IMO this issue deserves further discussion because I do not understand how to avoid potential discomfort and conflict with the gay roommate issue. I want my kid comfortable and I want your kid comfortable and don’t really see how that is possible without some guidelines to follow.</p>
<p>Momsdream, it is nice to see you here as I have not in a while (or maybe I just missed your posts). I hope your son gets off to a terrific start. It is really happening for these kids after all this time sharing the college selection and admissions process! It is ironic that your son has white roomies when he signed up for the Black-themed housing. However, I imagine he will connect with the many African Americans who must be in the dorm. Good luck to him and I hope we hear accounts once things settle in. We leave in two days with my freshman. </p>
<p>Alh, you pose terrific questions that really bring this issue to the core. Also, I think you offer the perspective that the gay student him/herself also is confronted with an uncomfortable situation of how to deal with these situations, and also with potential roomies who feel like the OP and the other person in that example’s room, or some others who have felt similar. We keep hearing about the thoughts or comfort level of the straight kid in this situation who may not want to live in it and not enough from the gay student’s perspective and I think you have thoughtfully brought that up and it is good to hear the other end of the situation! Your questions surely bring out the issues that also should be discussed. I am not going to answer the questions you posed because you know my answer already which in sum is that unless problems arise in terms of behavior/experiences in a roommate situation that can’t be mitigated, I am not into breaking the roommate “contract” based on a person’s identity, orientation or any other facet of their identity. You very much have brought out just HOW will it be dealt with in the various situations that could arise in your examples. And a lot has been ignored here that a straight person could have a gay roomie who simply has not come out yet. Thanks for raising thoughtful questions and also for being someone who can give perspective as a parent of a gay student.</p>
<p>Susan</p>
<p>Alh, I feel your sincerety and understand that you, as well as everyone on this site (especially those who have kids beginning their freshman year and are leaving home for the first time), are hoping that this “transition” to college will be as stress-free and pleasant as possible. I don’t believe there can be any guidelines as there isn’t any “right” answer when it comes to peoples feelings and emotions. They can’t, and if at all possible, shouldn’t be dictated by rules and and regulations.</p>
<p>There are people who are afraid of the unknown – with regard to this thread, the unknown would be the gay community. If someone knew IN ADVANCE of the start of school that they have been assigned to an OPENLY GAY roommate and felt uncomfortable or upset with this, I see nothing wrong with them requesting a room change. I believe that if the gay kids are telling people they are gay and have disclosed it on their facebook page (which is how it appears a lot of kids are finding out), they have nothing to hide and are most likely being open about it now to AVOID having a roommate that is not comfortable with it. Don’t think for a minute that someone who’s gay isn’t aware that there’s discrimination in this world toward them and they aren’t looking for a roommate that might make their life hell because of their sexuality. UNFORTUNATELY, there is no way the gay kids will know at the time of room assignments whether their straight roommate will be a problem unless they are open about it and share that information with the prospective roommate. </p>
<p>I GUARANTEE that during the straight kid’s 4 years at college, he will unwittingly become friends with many gay students. When all comes “out”, they’ll laugh about those fears freshman year. </p>
<p>There are some kids that will be happy to have a gay roommate – may already have gay friends or think it would be fun/interesting to learn more about the gay community; however, I don’t think you can force acceptance by making an already “fearful” student live in the same room as a gay student. I believe that acceptance will come, but on everybody’s own time and terms.</p>
<p>PS I remember when I was a sophomore in college (late '60s) and one of my friends (from a very small town in western PA) found out that I was Jewish (I had been friends with her since late freshman year, but the topic never came up), she almost fell to the floor. She couldn’t believe I wasn’t this horrible person that “looked like a witch”. I felt good that I had changed her perception of Jewish people, but it didn’t happen by forcing myself on her…it just happened.</p>
<p>Columbiamom, how would your reaction be to your above posting if the words black, muslim or jewish replaced the word gay. If you live in a dorm shouldn’t you be willing to accept any roomate providing they don’t create a real (not just percieved) threat. What if you were agnostic and your roomate was deeply religious, wanting to put religious pictures and statutes up in the room…don’t both roomates need to learn to negotiate and tolerate?</p>
<p>You said: don’t both roomates need to learn to negotiate and tolerate?</p>
<p>Yes, Mr.B, in a perfect world that would be true…</p>