Guidance for incoming HS Freshman

Applying to College
1

I am seeking advice in this forum from veterans here who have seen it all for my DD. I want to give as much info as possible so you get a full perspective of her goals and aspirations.

Background

My DD is currently in a public school and will join a very large highly rated Public HS (nearly 3000 students) this fall and course selection happens in 3 weeks. I want to be well prepared when we discuss our plans with DD’s counselor.

DD has a wide gamut of interest, but ultimately she would prefer to either go down a STEM or Business focused path. Law is also something she wants to explore…

DD has a tremendous work ethic, willingness to learn and explore and is very efficient in managing time. She researches colleges for fun and knows a great deal on her favorite colleges, she sent me the Common Data Set for MIT as a 6th grader asked me if I knew about it (I did not) and then gave her analysis on yield, SAT / GPA distribution, gender composition etc etc. I never would have done this at age of 11.

DD currently attends a local Public University for Math, Admission is through a highly competitive entrance exam. Currently DD is doing Calculus 1 She is on track to finish Calculus II, MVC, Linear Algebra, Set Theory the next two years and finishing off with either a 4th year undergrad or Graduate level class by her Senior year. It is an intensive program and she will get 16 college credits and a college transcript in addition to a HS transcript equivalent. Because she attends classes at the Univ she can’t take Calculus BC in school (can’t double dip). She can only write the AP exam as self study, but I read in this forum that self study AP is not as valuable as taking classes in HS. The advantage of continuing in the univ program other than the course rigor is admission to the Univ Math and other STEM programs is almost assured, even sometimes with a partial to full academic scholarship. The program is well known to AO’s of MIT, Princeton, Berkley, Caltech, Michigan, Chicago, Cornell, Yale, Stanford etc. My DD’s preference is to not drop this and pursue Calc BC in HS even if it affects her weighted GPA.

Foreign Language

She has been in a semi immersion Spanish program since Kindergarten (1 hour class 4days a week), she is a Gold Medalist in the National Spanish Exam in 6th grade and would like to repeat it this year. She is fluent in Spanish and her Spanish School Principal feels she is ready to take Spanish 4 as a freshman but prefers Spanish 3 as it is an easy A while she makes the transition to HS. The likely path if she takes this route will be AP Spanish in Junior Year. I read in the forum the AO’s prefer 4 years of foreign language. But in her case there are no more Spanish classes offered after her AP Spanish, does she have to take another language in her Senior year like French 1 (2 credits)? The downside of taking another language is she has to give up a 3 credit STEM AP class (Biology, APUSH, AP Euro) as the HS required course structure is such you can’t take more than 3 to 4 AP classes each year in the Junior and Senior years.

Computer Language

DD is proficient in Java and aspires to pursue a career in CS. She will most likely move to USACO Silver division this season. From a scheduling perspective does it make sense to wait till Sophmore or Junior year to take AP CS A. I keep reading some top colleges really don’t weigh Freshman AP grades as much as later years? She will likely switch to c++ next year as she makes progress in USACO.

Physics

DD has been taking after school Physics class this school year, focus on Mechanics to prepare for F=ma exam. Since she has done calculus does it make sense to wait and take AP Physics C when it is offered in her Junior/ Senior year instead of doing the AP Algebra based Physics now. The school will not allow AP Physics C for Freshman and Sophmores as demand exceeds supply.

Arts

DD developed an interest in art after couple of her drawings were featured in an Art show in 6th Grade. Further she has deepened her interest in Renaissance and Baroque art after seeing the works of Italian masters in person last year. My question is if she pursues and takes classes in Art and Music (Plays Piano from age of 3, took a Music Theory elective this year and loved it, is part of our City Youth symphony orchestra). Will it look out of place for a kid wanting to pursue a path in STEM? Every class she takes in Fine Arts makes it difficult for her to do an elective course in STEM

EC

Figure Skater - She is a US Figure skating Gold Medalist in skating skills. Will likely end up with 3 or 4 more gold medals mostly in Ice Dances by the time she graduates. Typically getting a Gold medal takes between 5 to 7 years of preparation and practice and the skater has to pass 8 levels and for dance about 23 dances. She will start to volunteer at her skating club this fall (Min age is 14) as she loves to teach.

Quiz Bowl, DECA(Ca$hology), Math Club, Geography Bee, Media club, Orchestra are the other EC’s she is currently involved.

Is doing 4 to 5 clubs a sign of lack of seriousness or focus. Conversely will it hurt if she does not try new activities. She really enjoys these clubs and would like to continue them in HS. Debate, Photography and maybe Spanish club (her Spanish teacher really wants her to get involved) are the others she might explore when she gets to HS.

DD has done well in both AMC 8 and AMC 10, will likely qualify for AIME this fall. Outside of school she spends weekly about 4 hours on coding, 3 hours of Piano, 3 hours of Physics, 5 hours of skating and 6 hours of competitive Math prep (Currently doing Aops Vol 2, after finishing all the AoPS courses preceeding Vol 2)

Phew that was longer that I first thought

In summary I am looking for advice on

1 Foreign Language after AP Spanish.

  1. Value of doing AP Calc BC as a Freshman vs a far more rigorous math program and taking the AP Exam in Calc BC as a Freshman.

3 AP CS A as Freshman is it advisable

  1. How many clubs is one too many

5 Doing courses in Fine Arts hurt her chances if she wants to major in CS. Comes down to value of breadth vs depth when it comes to college admissions.

  1. Any other pointers. The first year at HS will be a time for her to explore and figure out her academic future
1 Like
2

That’s not really self study. In this case, she’s covering her bases for any college that won’t accept the credits for the college course, but will give AP credit as would be the case for MIT and Princeton, amongst others. She should continue on her current path. No college will have an issue.

The HS may have its own testing for placement.

Completing AP as a junior will satisfy every single college recommendation in foreign language. If there are college Spanish offerings she can take as a senior, that’s great. If there aren’t, that’s okay.

No.

Yes. She can do honors bio and chem in 9th and 10th. Not every class needs to be AP, particularly in 9th grade.

No. In fact, colleges are not looking for specialists in HS at the expense of other core subjects.

She can try out a bunch and then focus in in the ones she most likes. Quality over quantity. But she can still try new things.

7 Likes
3

Great, Thank you for your inputs, highly appreciated. Could you elaborate on the Computer science thoughts. Is it because I heard it is an easy course especially if someone has coding experience in Java?

4

Whether she needs or wants to take CSA at all is a different question. She may be beyond the CSA curriculum (though I doubt it). But I don’t know her experience nor do I know the HS offerings. My point is if she wants to take it, and can fit it in without impacting school requirements or core coursed, it makes zero sense to me to wait for a later year

1 Like
5

To clarify her Spanish program recommendation for placement is taken up by the HS as it is a before school collaborative venture between the school district and the language school…so in her case there are no test in / test out requirements…

1 Like
6

Oh ok got it. Thank you

7

Math and physics peak young, so moving ahead with college level math makes total sense. She should go into the Spanish level she tests into. If she wants ap comp sci, absolutely in 9th.

Do not worry about gaming the ECs for colleges. Your daughter sounds incredible, light years ahead of the game. Let her do whatever ECs she wants, as she is able. She will prob not have time to continue them all, plus hopefully she will want to try new things, and also spend time with new friends from high school.

3 Likes
8

About the skating - don’t have her test out any more senior/gold medal tests until she is in high school. Ones that are tested out before high school (like her MITF-now-Skating Skills) don’t count on applications technically (before high school). They also don’t count for USFS’s Graduating Seniors Program.

In order to be eligible, your skater has to complete the tests in high school, since the award is about balancing skating with high school coursework. And I believe the pattern dance and free dance only count as one type of gold medalist for this award. So you would need pattern dance/free dance, pairs, and singles/freestyle to get Platinum level, or pattern dance/free dance and singles/freestyle to earn Gold level. Gold level is an excellent achievement, however.

Not enough skaters are told to hold off on their final senior/gold medal test until high school (can be first semester of freshman year - when it starts to count).

9

Also, the time to try a wide variety of clubs is in freshman year/Grade 9. You can specialize more in soph/junior year, do leaderships positions in junior/senior year.

Where she is now may not be where she is in a few years. Having the opportunity to grow into new interests should be happening - that’s a good thing. Eventually, she will have the chance to deep dive into ECs/interests that suit the person she is becoming.

3 Likes
10

Your D is obviously a strong student with significant depth in multiple areas. I agree with the advice you’ve been given above and will also page @hebegebe who might have more to say.

The only other thing I’ll say is to just remember that she is or will be approximately 14 years old. She knows so much already, but there are still tons of things that she likely knows nothing about and has had no exposure to yet. She should definitely be given time and space to explore, both in high school and in college. Additionally, she should be given ample opportunities to continue to grow socially and emotionally. She is obviously well ahead of the game academically and with ECs, but she should also be able to develop and deepen relationships with peers and also making sure she has the tools to deal with difficulties/obstacles

Wishing your daughter a wonderful time in high school as she learns more, discovers new interests, deepens her involvement in areas she cares about, and continues to evolve into the person she is meant to be!

2 Likes
11

@mavericky, you have an amazing daughter.

In terms of advice, I agree with everything that @skieurope wrote. But if you have any questions specific to math competitions, I can help with that.

I also agree with @AustenNut in giving her time to grow socially and emotionally. It’s great that the motivation seems to come from her rather than you pushing her. But your child, in wanting to excel at everything, may overcommit to the point that burnout can occur unless you pull her back a bit. She doesn’t need to be the best at everything, and learning that is a very useful lesson.

4 Likes
12

This is so awesome to know, I knew about the Graduating senior program and the requirements for each of the level at a general level but did not know the details you have laid out. Thank you for or your suggestions. Her coach wants her to test Gold Freestyle down the road, she is working on Double Lutz and 2F, has a stable 2S-2T combo. Should pass Novice Freeskate sometime this summer. Her ISI coach thinks she can get to ISI 10 (Currently working on passing ISI 8, pesky flying sit is holdng her) but not pass it (Her coach had one student among the 40 odd skaters who have passed 10).

13

Thank you. I keep telling her my job is to research and give her options it is her own choice on what she pursues. The only thing I want is total commitment if we are spending the money. If it dosent work out so be it but it should not be because of lack of effort. Figure skating has been such a good sport for her, the struggles to master each jump and spin, competing, facing adversities has taught her a lot of life lessons. The resilience, peserverance and grit it taught her at a very young age (6-9) has carried over. She is a social butterfly and I am sure as she matures she will find new interets. She has been blessed with very good set of teacher who are her mentors at School, great group of friends and fabulous coaches.

1 Like
14

Great, we will check with her HS counselor if she can squeeze in AP CSA as a Freshman.

15

She dosent have much competing experience, never did Mathcounts till this year as skating was her focus. Her strengths are not in problem solving, but once you get past the first step( in AMC 10) she can finish it off. Last year I found an online group class where the coach puts himself in the students shoes and asks them to go along with him on a path of discovery in solving AMC 10 questions. Doing Aops Vol 1 and Awesome Math Mathleads for Mathletes has been worthile. Do you have any suggestions on improving problem solving skills? Especially developing the intution. We feel it only comes from solving many problems, pattern recognition, doing Alcumus, Mathcount trainer etc. Aops Vol 1 was really useful in opening up her thinking.

16

Also she really wants to do well in AMC10 to get an invite for MPFG, she thinks going there consistently will help her in getting into MIT…a girl can dream right

17

Great advice, Appreciate it

18

Take a look at this thread:

19

I know dozens of students, including my child, who were admitted to MIT. In terms meeting the academic and extracurricular qualifications for MIT admission, your D is well on her way, with or without MPFG.

But note that, short of becoming part of the USA’s IMO team, there is no guaranteed path to admission to MIT. Increased qualifications help, but there is a certain amount of randomness to every holistic college decision.

As a volunteer college counselor who advises some very talented students aiming for HYPSM, what I tell the parents is that their end goal should not be their child’s admission to HYPSM. Instead it should be raising capable and confident children that can handle both successes and disappointments, including possibly with college admissions.

7 Likes
20

Whatever you do, do not make a T10/T20 college acceptance the goal of her HS experience. Apart from certain hooks and certain academic accomplishments, there is an element of randomness to the process which means that sometimes incredibly worthy and accomplished students are passed over. For kids whose major focus in high school is a HYPSM acceptance, rejection can be a very bitter pill.

5 Likes