<p>He still has to decide that he has a problem before he will deal with it. If he can figure that out before he crashes, great … I just haven’t seen that happen in my experience (limited as it is to just the people I know personally).</p>
<p>Read my thread as someone suggested…I wish I could offer you advice but at this time I do not feel I am qualified. I am still too fresh to be effective and the situation in my home is still up for grabs. The only thing I could say is that we never gave up and we probably never will when it comes to our kids. However, I realize now that what we wanted for my daughter is what we wanted and now it is her turn to discover what she wants and more importantly how she wants to live her life. I can no longer save her and if she chooses to make poor decisions they are hers to own. We have given her every opportunity and our complete support but she has thrown that away many times. I do believe that our daughter will someday live on her own and have a job and support herself but it may not be the way we had hoped. My expectations have dropped and now she is free to be who she is…and that includes everything that comes with it. There are no more financial handouts because that makes drug use too easy. There is no more waking her in the morning because she will never learn what it means to fail or lose a job. There is no more advising her about her choice of friends because she will never learn what it is to be a friend. Basically I am fine not butting in anymore or bailing her out. Much of my attitude as of late comes from pure exhaustion and the realization that my daughter was not going to change because I wanted her to. At the age of 19 they are formed and short of her depression there is little I can do other than to support her by paying for therapy and paying for the medication. She believes she can handle her life and now she has the opportunity to do so. It is her life and her happiness must be on her terms but I don’t have to take the abuse, anger, or drama. My daughter has asked to be treated as an adult which means she can do what she pleases when she pleases how she pleases and with whom she pleases. That also means that all of those things carry a responsibility that she must be willing to take. I will not bail her out if she is arrested if she chooses to continue to indulge in drug use, and I will not support her if she decides that school is not for her and she does not want to study or attend classes. As long as my daughter knows up front where we stand than things will go the way my daughter decides. I am no longer in a position to create her into someone she is not. It took me a very long time to come to this and believe me it did not happen over night. I hope your son will be responsive to some of the things that you may want to consider so your road does not last as long as mine has.</p>
<p>"I feel like my hands are tied, I don’t think I have it in me to do what I kind of feel needs to be done. I know we have done everything in our power to get him going in the right direction but for some reason (definitely internal on his part) he just regresses, this pattern has been going on for longer than I care to remember. "</p>
<p>I could have written this post about my stepson, and recently there was a thread about my situation called : When do you cut the financial cord? The bottom line is that we don’t know what is going to send us over the edge and stop supporting our stepson, and it sounds like you don’t either.</p>
<p>So many people will tell you to kick him out, or stop financially enabling him, but it is very very hard to do, and easy to suggest when it is not your kid.</p>
<p>No solutions from me, except that you will know when you have had it, and when you have to consider the needs of the rest of your family (and yourself!) over the needs of this child.</p>
<p>I suggest he get totally off the pot for a length of time BEFORE therapy–waste of time/money otherwise.</p>
<p>Some very close friends of mine went through several harrowing years with their son. It began with pot while he was in high school. His high school expelled him when he was caught with pot and that was how his parents became aware of the problem. Then came years of a spiraling cycle of events. One of the dynamics was that he could not function in school or a job because of the sleep issue you describe. He could not wake himself up, could not follow through. He is a bright young man with a lot of ADD issues, but what finally came out was that he was addicted to very serious drugs. His mother was certain she could tell when he was stoned or not, but she had no idea the level of drugs he was taking. I was on the receiving end of many crisis phone calls from his parents who were at their wits ends. There were rehab programs, relapses, etc. I mention all this to point out that sometimes where there is smoke there is fire. You know about the pot, but it’s possible he has a more serious drug problem. </p>
<p>In addition, his mother had some insight into her co-dependency issues. She would announce that she would be codependent no more but, in reality, the nature of their relationship was hurting him. She is a good and loving mom who just could not disengage from enabling him, even when she often thought she was doing so. He was also very skilled at manipulating her. Finally, in a low moment, he agreed to go to rehab in another state. That was the turning point. He needed to be a few states away from his family in order to start becoming accountable for his actions. Two things changed for him besides the rehab program (which he’d had had plenty of.) He was away from the affluent area he lived in where drugs are very accessible and where there were too many triggers, and he was away from his parents. He left the rehab program after a few months and made the decision to continue living in that state with a good support system. Best decision he ever made. He is working, slowly taking on more responsibilities and, for now, clean and sober. He seems to be getting up every day and living more like an adult. He needed to be away to really become responsible for himself. His parents are guardedly optimistic. </p>
<p>I am not saying that Will is using other drugs or that you are enabling him. I tell this story in case any of it resonates for you and helps in any way.</p>
<p>Here is a homeless suicide rate report:
</p>
<p>I am sure there are more if you search for it.</p>
<p>In this report, it is most alarming that
</p>
<p>among Young males are most vonarable to commit suicide at around 14% of all their peers, if I read it correctly.</p>
<p>I’d say to throw Will on the street is more dangerous than put him into the millitary if millitary will take him.</p>
<p>Only the family can know what is truly necessary for them in the long run. They will take our advice, consider it within the framework of their personal reality, and do whatever is necessary. And what they do will be what is best for them … whether it’s let him stay, pay for an apartment, call the police, throw him out, whatever.</p>
<p>Where is he getting the money for pot? Sorry to be glib, but you need to nip it in the bud. No more allowance/cash.</p>
<p>It might be beneficial to find his own therapist, not yours – preferably a psychiatrist or psychologist, not simply a LSW. He could improve with the services of a highly trained professional, a confidante, who is experienced with his particular age group/problems with whom he can be completely open.</p>
<p>Millitary Suicide Rate, on the other hand is nothing compare to those on the street.</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>That is 115 among 100’s Thousands of troops in the WAR. That is not 14% suicide rate among those on the street!</p>
<p>That is seriously outdated and underreported.
Got data on the number of homeless (not counting older vets) and the percent that suicide? And compare it to vets, not the “national average”</p>
<p>
This has stats form several of the military branches and now present as percent per # of soldiers. Hard to get the exact #s</p>
<p>What are you talking about JYM? 20 per 100,000 vs. 14% ? 14% is going to be 14,000 per 100,000. can you do the math?</p>
<p>Yes I can do the math, oh snarky one. What I don’t know is how many there are currently in the different branches of the armed forces. Do you??</p>
<p>For a young man who wants to join the military for good, solid reasons, I don’t think the suicide statistics should be a deterrent.</p>
<p>However, I agree with jym, that it’s not necessarily the best advice for a young man who has no desire to join the military.</p>
<p>It seems adversarial – that it will “make a man of him” as the saying used to go.</p>
<p>But there are so many ways to be a man, and the military should be an option only for those who find that way congenial.</p>
<p>I shudder to think of my S in the military.</p>
<p>For a while the army was calling him about once a week. He’s a musician, and one recruiter shamelessly told him he could play for President Bush in the marching band, never mind that he’s a violinist.</p>
<p>He said, “yeah, that doesn’t ring my bell.”</p>
<p>And the recruiter said, “If you mean because of Pres Bush I don’t really like him either,” which might have been the truth or an out and out lie.</p>
<p>I would worry about my s in the military. He is finding himself through paid employment plus school.</p>
<p>Mythology is full of the difficulty young boys have in becoming men. In fact it is the core subject of mythology.</p>
<p>I don’t think there is one easy trajectory, a one size fits all.</p>
<p>I think many posters have pointed in the same direction: a combination of continual, though gentle reminders of exactly what the parents’ expectations are and love and patience.</p>
<p>That might mean tough love and moving out, it might not, depending on the family dynamic, the parents’ values and the openness of the child.</p>
<p>I like something the Navajo say, that children should be directed back on the path with a feather.</p>
<p>I had to really let go before my son was ready to stop fighting me. A lot of agita accompanied the parenting lesson he taught me – that it really is his life.</p>
<p>Here is what I found: 1,454,515 active members of the military
[WikiAnswers</a> - How many people are active duty in the US military](<a href=“Answers - The Most Trusted Place for Answering Life's Questions”>How many people are active duty in the US military? - Answers)
If you want to extrapolate form the number of individuals that responded to the survey mentioned above, and estimate that 2-3% of members of the military have attempted suicide, thats over 36,000 people. Lets go out on a limb and assume we won’t hear from those who successfully suicided…</p>
<p><em>*edit</em>
If someone does not want to enter the military, it is a moot point. They don’t typically hit them over the head and enlist them, and judges do not remand someone to the military in lieu of jail time.</p>
<p>My advice is get him an apartment and pay for one months rent and some thrift shop essentials. If he gets a job on his own, help with second months rent.( Positive reinforcement). If not, he gets evicted.( Reality check). Do not alow him to move home. If he is depressed, the way he is going is not helping and is affecting your inocent other child. Nothing is going to change or get better until you do something. As a parent you let him know you love him and that you are doing this to help him and because his behavior is not acceptable in your home. Period. He may very well be depressed. Lots of people are depressed. He needs to step up and take responsibility. Hard as it is, you need to stop enabling him. Hard to hear, harder to do.</p>
<p>The other thing that skews the data, artloversplus, is the high frequency of mental illness/substance abuse in the homeless population, that might contribute to a higher frequency of attempted suicide. Don’t have the data on this, but in makes intuitive sense.</p>
<p>If he were my kid, based on the current situation, Like some one else suggested, I will send him far away, out of the state, to a rehab camp for three months, no matter what the cost is. Before I throw him on the street. I don’t want my kid to fall into that 14% suicide statistics.</p>
<p>By the way, these data are a few years old, but in 2007, veterans made up nearly 26% of homeless people [National</a> Alliance to End Homelessness: Library: Vital Mission: Ending Homelessness Among Veterans](<a href=“http://www.endhomelessness.org/content/article/detail/1839]National”>http://www.endhomelessness.org/content/article/detail/1839)
</p>
<p>Finally we agree on something, artloversplus. In the ideal world this young man would do best in a recovery program/residential treatment facility. But he is 20 years old and has to be willing to go, and make the commitment to stay for as long as they feel he needs it. There need to be some very stringent consequences imposed by the family if he does not comply. This is when the “tough love” comes in, if he quits the program prematurely. No one <em>wants</em> him to be homeless, but if he is unwilling to follow the wishes of his parents, they may be unwilling to enable his behavior and provide continued financial support. This is not unreasonable. It is sad.</p>
<p>Did you understand my additional information on suicide/attempted rates in the military and suicide rates in the homeless population (which cannot easily covary out the frequency of veterans and mentally ill/substance abusers in the homeless population)</p>