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I agree with you 100% mstee. That’s where I draw the line as well.</p>
<p>“Little League is the model of EVERYTHING” </p>
<p>must be the “O chromosome”;D</p>
<p>It is every parents job to question when things don’t sit well. For the 75% who may not be involved they are lucky they have someone like berurah to ask the questions.</p>
<p>All through high school, I got on best with the teachers who spoke to me like an equal and a friend rather than an authority figure. I think, in the interests of full disclosure, I have a problem with authority figures (and funnily enough, my top two career choices involve no boss in day to day activities), but all the teachers that really engaged me and made me learn the most were certainly the friendly sort. </p>
<p>That said, some of the teachers I read about here sound like the young sort who want to be liked by their pupils. This is different to what I experienced - actually almost every one of my favourite friendly teachers have retired now! I’ve seen some younger teachers, usually not long out of school themselves, try to be all matey with their pupils, thinking that being cool is the best way to engage their pupils. This can end up being a bit off, as many of you have described, or with the teachers just not getting the necessary respect. Teaching wisdom that my mum (a teacher for about 30 years) and many of the teachers I know and have been taught by is to start out strict, build up a reputation, and then once everyone will behave due to your reputation, you can ease off and be a bit more friendly.</p>
<p>Also, even the best friendly teachers can be strict when they need to - I got on fantastically with a geography teacher in my second last year at school to the extent we keep in contact still, yet he was probably the most feared disciplinarian in the school.</p>
<p>Berurah, I’m sorry I’m not Politically Correct enough for you. I’m bemused that you’ve somehow managed to twist that into a “liberal” viewpoint, since the common theme to all my posts that you object to has been “stop whining and get on with your life” - even when I criticized the offending conduct in question. I never saw that as a “liberal” viewpoint, but I’m pleased to hear that Fundingfather has now officially joined me as an “uber-liberal”. :)</p>
<p>It’s true: I’m slow to outrage. And I probably wouldn’t brag about having driven a teacher (who was apparently very much admired by some of her students) to quitting. But that’s just the old leftist in me, I guess…</p>
<p>And one last clarification (I guess this was just too subtle): Everyone I ever heard claiming they were doing “it” for the children was an out-and-out hypocrite - regardless of what “it” was. The people who actually were carrying the load for the kids were too busy actually doing stuff to spend their time gossiping about how bad the “others” were.</p>
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<p>It’s been my experience that if I had a problem according to the administration, it’s because it’s something I disagree with, not because something is wrong. (See above.) They get to decide what is right or wrong, of course.</p>
<p>At our school board meetings parent comment/question time is deliberately held during the last 15 minutes of the meeting. Meeting ends at 10:00. First 45 minutes or so is spent handing out meaningless awards. In addition, they are curt and rude to any parent who attempts to bring up issues they do not want to deal with. Most parents get the message early on and shut up. Really relevant and important issues are tabled to be discussed at a later date in a closed door meeting. Then they complain that parents don’t show up for meetings. :p</p>
<p>Our local fourth estate does not do their job: their role is limited to reporting on the kids’ community service projects and meaningless awards. (See above.)</p>
<p>In this way, parents are entirely cut out of any decision-making of importance which directly effects their children. Most parents are successfully co-opted–put to work raising money at flower sales and school fairs. If not, hardball tactics are used.</p>
<p>Scam and a fraud all around.</p>
<p>And now you’re telling me it’s my responsibility to oversee teachers’ behavior with students. ROFLMHO</p>
<p>I’ll try to move us back to friendlier territory…
Hey, were you in “New School” too? Contracts, learning to play bridge and square dance and culture our own yogurt and juggle…we called our teachers by their first names, and, I do recall a time or two (wait, it was JUNIOR HIGH, no less) when one of the teachers hung back with some kids on a field trip and smoked a joint. Ah, sigh, :), those were the days…<br>
And yet, our teachers were mentors and friends, not our pals/chums/friends. And I do think that the case that B was talking about sounds like the teacher did not have appropriate bounderies or maturity to be a teacher!</p>
<p>I didn’t mean to get unfriendly; just trying to “tell it like it is.” Sure you can relate, anxiousmom. :)</p>
<p>Btw, I know for a fact that not all school districts are like mine. (Thank goodness.)</p>
<p>Here’s an elementary school story. Ten year old son’s chorus/music teacher is on maternisty leave. S loves the replacement & was telling us about Mr.B’s great experiences working in Manhattan piano bars. Son was amazed that Mr. B. started so young, age 16, that he needed a fake ID. </p>
<p>Gee, thanks Mr. B., for casually suggesting the idea of a fake ID. Any suggestions for the kiddies on which place produces the most realistic looking ones?</p>
<p>I didn’t go nuts. Just placed a calm, heads-up call to the principal, saying that as Mr. B. is the sub, he probably needs a bit of guidance in what is and is not appropriiate to introduce to a class of impressionable youngsters. Sometimes it’s just an uncharacteristic lapse of judgment, yadda , yadda. Principal assured me she’d speak with him. Imagine my surprise when at the spring musical Mr. B turned out to be a man in his 60s who had been pulled out of retirement. </p>
<p>I like Berurah’s analogy of the IRS not being the place where I’d expect to find tax cheat suggestions. I’m sure son will one day hear of fake IDs, but I’m not thrilled that it had to be from an authority figure he adores.</p>
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I don’t know the circumstances of her departure. It may well have been that her provisional contract was not renewed because the community felt that she was remiss in her job. I’m not “bragging” on “driving her out,” but rather celebrating the democratic process that emphasizes that if you hack off the majority of a community, you will be be looked upon unfavorably, and consequently, your job may be in danger.</p>
<p>~berurah</p>
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Sadly mine is.</p>
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Unfortunately, we have no way of knowing whether or not this is true. All we are getting is your own perception which may or may not reflect the reality of the situation. Since you have already said that you are slow to outrage and you feel that playing a post VT prank about an attacking gunman on a bunch of sixth graders who are away from the security of home is perfectly acceptable, your perceptions are suspect in my book.</p>
<p>I never said it was “perfectly acceptable” - I said people were overreacting to it. I was criticized for overstating the criticisms of those who were competing with each other for ways to describe how horrible and contemptible the prank was. Now you’re overstating my attempt to put the issue in perspective.</p>
<p>I recognize that trying to see the “other side” of an issue is generally controversial. but it’s what I have to do in my job effectively. After 33 years in law, I have a hard time viewing the world in black and white.</p>
<p>^^No need to view the world in black and white to recognize egregious impropriety.</p>
<p>you go, Kluge! The world is shades of gray. … (or a rainbow,depending…)</p>
<p>Great story about the MIL, garland. Was H at your high school?</p>
<p>From the initial read of that article, I’d say a teacher working closely with students might end up with a nick name and a few student crushes. That’s pretty normal, b. The kid obviously loves the teacher and, I dunno, that particular expression of affection doesn’t disturb me. The write is seventeen for one thing. Seventeen year olds gush when they write.</p>
<p>Nicknames for teachers are more common overseas. My sons had a teacher named Jelly. He was a terrible teacher but the boys loved him as an institution and didn’t want him fired.</p>
<p>^^It’s too bad that the same editor chose not to write and “gush” about the retiring husband and wife math teachers who <em>are</em> a true institution at our school. After being there “forever,” they are both retiring this year! They are simply amazing. In all of our fifteen years in this district I have heard nothing but extremely positive things about both of them. They are excellent teachers, devoted mentors, avid supporters of MANY students through the offering of recommendations, etc. In addition, they are fabulous role models who, while mentoring and encouraging many more kids than the journalism teacher ever thought of reaching out to, they have never crossed the bounds of propriety nor compromised school or community standards. I would have LOVED to see a tribute to these folks who have offered so much of their lives in the service of their community, rather than the gushing tribute to a woman who’s been here a year or two, just long enough to make sure my kids’ yearbook of last year didn’t reflect one tiny iota of their h.s. experience. ;)</p>
<p>~berurah</p>
<p>I have to say that seeing teachers become so buddy-buddy with students definitely makes me, as a fellow student uncomfortable. They were way to willing to get into gossip discussions, talks about weekend plans(including drinking/drugs), and too close overall. Of course most students love having a teacher they can “relate to” but I’m not one of those. In fact I don’t even like seeing teachers than I’m friendly with in class outside school. As far as I’m concerned, they don’t exist outside the building.</p>
<p>If I were a parent, I’d really make sure that I got to know the teachers more. There are just too many ways that something can end up going wrong in that type of situation.</p>
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coasterphil~</p>
<p>Not surprisingly, my kids feel the same way as you do.</p>
<p>“And now you’re telling me it’s my responsibility to oversee teachers’ behavior with students”</p>
<p>I’m sorry let me rephrase that… YES ABSOLUTELY IT IS YOUR RESPONSIBILITY TO KNOW YOUR KIDS TEACHERS AND TALK TO THEM DIRECTLY ABOUT YOUR CONCERNS. </p>
<p>Stop wasting your time at the school board level and go see your kid’s teachers at open house and parent teacher confrences. Get to KNOW your kids teachers. Besides listen to yourself, you’re ranting about the 45 minutes spent talking about awards and what not… FOR THE STUDENTS!!! At least that what that time is spent with our sb meetings. </p>
<p>I always found it enjoyable to see students get recognition for success away from a ballfield. It’ “meaningless”? Who are you there advocating for again? </p>
<p>“Our local fourth estate does not do their job: their role is limited to reporting on the kids’ community service projects and meaningless awards”</p>
<p>Again Who are you there as an advocate FOR? it certainly doesn’t sound like the students at this point. And hey you wrote it, I didn’t. It’s becoming pretty clear why you’re having problems. </p>
<p>As far as “something I disagree with, not because something is wrong”</p>
<p>Let’s pretend your my kid’s teacher for five seconds. I don’t like you, your methods, your face, your personality, views on god, how you dress, your shoes, whatever, Does that make me right and you wrong? Should I demand you be removed from your job, even though you haven’t broken any laws? </p>
<p>One of the reasons people like yourself have such trouble navigating public schools, is you want them entirely in your image. How you think it should be. And you know what? we might agree on 95% of the same things, however, you will go for the kill for that 5%. Scorched earth, leave bodies behind. Compromise might was well mean communism. </p>
<p>I’m sorry I haven’t experienced the problems you have because I understand the give and take of the situation. It is not the public school system’s responsibility to make me 100% happy about everything. The difference between us is I would rather rejoice about the 95%, than fret over 5. Life is too darn short to have that much hate built up over little stuff. </p>
<p>I know because of my health I will be lucky to hit 60 in one piece, I guess if I hate a bit more, I’ll last longer, but why would I want to if it meant carrying around so much bile?</p>
<p>“didn’t go nuts. Just placed a calm, heads-up call to the principal, saying that as Mr. B. is the sub, he probably needs a bit of guidance in what is and is not appropriiate to introduce to a class of impressionable youngsters”</p>
<p>You honestly called on that? 
Really? Seriously? you felt that remark was so damaging to young ears that you needed to call? Honestly? 
That was worth a call to the principal? </p>
<p>I could tell you WHY things aren’t happening your way, but it wouldn’t do any good. Your words are your own worst ememy.</p>
<p>A sub telling kids he had a fake ID to work as a 16 year old? That’s evil? How did you feel about the young men sometimes 14-15 years old that enlisted in the army during WW2? They breaking the law too?</p>
<p>For crying out loud his job was to play piano for people who drank, not to get himself drunk. Did you ever for five seconds think that maybe that was the best income he could produce for his family (parents) cause they needed it and he was helping out the best way possible? As you said he was like 60 years old… so at age 16 would have been what era? Kinda quick on the prinicpal trigger maybe?? of course not.</p>