<p>I had posted this in the MIL housing arrangements thread-</p>
<p>Think twice before you invite an aging parent to move in with you; if you do, try to have a totally seperate living area.</p>
<p>My mother moved in with us 9 years ago. It seriously impacted our family dynamic, in a mostly negative way.</p>
<p>My mother had lived about 5 hours away from us; she had/has a serious illness, and the life expectancy was about 2 years, so that partly went into our decision.</p>
<p>We had both sold our houses and bought a larger place to accomodate her; however, without a seperate living area. With the real estate decline, selling and moving her to an assited living place is not an option at this point.</p>
<p>Martina- just wondering, was the level of negative affect a huge surprise? In hindsight were there signs you overlooked, things you did not consider?</p>
<p>My Dad died recently and since I work from a home office, I had been doing half days from their home the couple of months before he went, and he went several months before expected. Once he was gone, I continued to work half days, but it never felt like enough, I was so aware that my mum was lonely and alone.</p>
<p>We recently moved her in with us and we know it is not ideal that we do not have a private space for her, we share the kitchen & laundry; she does have her own TV room, but we all go through the same common areas, so it is not a true suite situation.</p>
<p>So far, so good, she is bound and determined not to be a burden and she never said anything, but with her here, I just do my normal things and she is happy to have other bodies in the house. I am sure we will hit some conflicts, but if you have any warnings, things to watch for, do tell ;)</p>
<p>Momma-three, I hope you have time to reread the comments you’ve posted, and the other comments. Not many people have the devotion to do what you have been doing on a daily basis. You cannot always take on the dirtiest and most time-consuming chores; there has to be an limit.</p>
<p>Talk to your brother about the vacation conflict. Why are his plans more important than yours? The answer is that they aren’t, but you have got to take a stand and set limits. You should absolutely insist on taking that time off for yourself and getting a cleaning person and caregiver in.</p>
<p>momma-three, I started that thread almost a year ago now. There may be some information that will be as helpful to you as it was to me last year. Best of luck to you. I know how difficult this is.</p>
<p>somemom, yes we did not put enough thought into it, we definitely overlooked some things.</p>
<p>First of all, it’s one thing to visit with someone for an overnight once every few months, another to live with them 24/7. I had been away from home for 20 years, and I had forgotten things about our relationship living together that had gotten glossed over with time.</p>
<p>When she lived on her own, she was very involved with her church and friends; when she moved up with us, she didn’t put much effort into making new friends - partly no doubt, that it’s tougher to start again, but she blew off quite a few overtures. Which brings us to …</p>
<p>Boundaries. A crucial mistake was not setting boundaries initially. Part of the not making new friends or interests is that she decided she was going to devote herself totally to helping us out. Which was incredibly stifling. She would plan our weekend activities, and did not understand that we had activities that would preclude us from having large sit down dinners every night. I had no free time to do what I wanted, it was always ‘what are we going to do today?’ So when I saw the need for boundaries, it was a very unpleasant situation and not something that could be done without hard feelings after the fact.</p>
<p>And just general interference in parenting decisions. It was tough having someone there second guessing what I was doing. And actually sabotaging their health in that she would sneak the kids large amounts of junk food. My S still has a weight problem, you can actually see on his growth chart when grandma moved in, his weight spiked. </p>
<p>I could say more, but you kind of get the drift. Boundaries are important, and in our case a separate inlaw apt. would have worked much better.</p>
<p>Wow. To momma-three, if your father is incontinent he needs to be in an assisted living or nursing home. You can’t be self-employed, take care of your family and take care of him without help. </p>
<p>Families just need to talk to each other frankly. About money, about family dynamics about your own health, everything. Most parents do not want to be a burden on their children. </p>
<p>I’ve witnessed many families in this situation. The teenaged kids resent the time mom spends away from home and them taking care of grandma. The kids who live far away have no concept of how much time is involved or how it impacts the woman (usually) who is taking care of the aged parent. The woman herself sees her last good prime earning years go away or sees those years when active retirement might have been possible go up in smoke. One woman I know dreamed of traveling her whole life. Instead she ended up dying before the elderly mother and never getting to live out her dreams. </p>
<p>Assisted living is very nice. The one near us is like a Ritz Carlton, without the pool. There are activities with people your age, a library, beauty shop, classes, computers, etc.
It’s much better than trying to struggle by in your own home, if you can afford the 4,000 a month.</p>
<p>It’s true that assisted living is pricey, but remember that virtually all of one’s living expenses are covered by the rent. The resident no longer has to pay for rent/mortgage, homeowner’s insurance, property taxes, maintenance and repair, most utilities, or food. If they give up their car, there will be some savings there as well. We put together a spreadsheet to figure out how much Mom & Dad were paying to live in their own place, and assisted living turned out to be not that much more expensive.</p>
<p>Also, if the resident has long term care insurance, check the policy to see if it would cover any of the cost. And if the OP’s dad is a veteran, he may be eligible for the little-known VA Aid & Attendance benefit:</p>
<p>teriwitt—To clarify who is not in favor of an assisted living arrangement or strangers in the house. My father raised us to believe that only other people did that to their parents. He always said that “those places were only for people who could not move or feed or toilet themselves”. My parents took in his mother when she was only 42 years of age. My parents who were newly married at the time viewed her as an old person. She lived to be 89 and my mother passed away 6 months after she died. My mother was a better daughter than most daughters would ever be. </p>
<p>My father talks about our family and the strong bond and love, and I feel guilty for having these thoughts. As the family caregiver of several loved ones I seem to be running out of steam. I think I have grown tired and somewhat resentful that I have been there for my family but have no knowledge of my dads finances. I will be upset if my dad passes away and I learn that he had more than what I thought. My brother tells me he does not have much but he too, is closed mouthed about these things. I don’t know what he considers much because my brother is very wealthy, so not much to him maybe more than sufficient to bring in some help. My brother paid all of my dads expenses for nearly 1 1/2 years because my dad would not rent his house out. Finally he agreed to do so. Not once did my father even question how his bills were being paid and my brother led him to believe that he was paying it when infact my brother will be paid back later in the future when the estate is settled. I also think this is why my father seems to expect more from me in terms of time and chores. He seems to value my brother far more as a result of the perceived generousity of my brother (dad is unaware that my brother sent letters to my sisters children and myself that he would pay expenses so dad did not worry about the high cost of his current apartment and then be reimbursed later) and this has caused my husband to see this situation somewhat negatively. My husband feels that I was there for my mother for the three years she was sick, with three surgeries, chemo and all the appointments and for my sister when she became ill with the same disease that my mother passed from (brother in law passed away 4 years earlier). My sister lived with us about two weeks out of four every month. Within four months of my sisters passing my father in law came to live with us.</p>
<p>After my moms passing 20 years ago, My father shut down and seemed like he could not handle anything at the time. For the two years after my moms passing we had my father with us everyday and we had four babies under the age of three and a half. He came in the morning and my husband drove him home everynight. He had three car accidents in the span of those two years and we would not allow him to drive to our apartment. We had not moved to our current home until I knew my dad had found his social niche and was able to move forward. We lived with four children in a two bedroom apartment at the time and he still made me feel guilty for leaving him. He refused to move with us at the time but we needed a home a raise our children in.</p>
<p>My dad was the most wonderful father growing up. He was always a quiet man but his devotion to family has both my brother and I feeling like we want his last years to be as happy as possible. The problem is that my father is so sad all the time and that is how my day begins and ends. I am going to discuss this with my brother so that we could come to some agreement as to what is acceptable. This feeling is so unusual for me but I think because I am getting older I just don’t have the same stamina that I once did. </p>
<p>This is such a difficult decision because my brother is also wired the way I am. He however has far more down time than I do. My dads’ house is probably worth somewhere between 650.000 to 750.000 but it is useless the way my father set it up. I am a half owner of a house that I don’t own and one third of the proceeds must go to my sisters children. I just hope dad isn’t sitting on alot of money when he does pass because I will be PO that things got this difficult and he tied our hands in regard to the house. </p>
<p>Another poster asked if I have asked for some help from my sisters children. I have asked for help but they were self centered SOBs when their father was sick, and useless when my sister became ill. One of them barely made it to my sisters funeral. They are all too wrapped up in their lives to even give an afternoon to their grandpa. Family is a weird thing sometimes, and we just don’t get to choose who we are related to. </p>
<p>I think what makes these situations difficult is that you know things don’t get better they get worse and you don’t know how long they will continue. I will be very sad when my dad is not longer here because I will miss the father I had. He is not that man anymore and that is so sad.</p>
<p>But in reality, he is not toileting himself if you are cleaning up urine all the time, and if you are doing all the meal preparation that you say, then he’s not capable of the tasks needed to feed himself (it’s not all about just the eating). </p>
<p>You need to set some boundaries before, in the heat of exhaustion, you say or do something you will regret. How is your own health? It can’t be great with the enormous list of responsibilities you have. What’s your blood pressure? Headaches? Weight issues that aren’t being dealt with because you have no time to get regular exercise? Anxiety? Sleeplessness? Perhaps you can go to your own physician and discuss whatever health issues you’re having, then your physician can be the villain as you explain to your father and brother why you need to cut back. </p>
<p>I’d like to suggest that, even if you cut back your work hours (or took early retirement like your brother suggested), at the rate you’re going, even if caring for your father was the only other responsibility you had, other than your spouse and kids, this kind of commitment would run you into the ground eventually. </p>
<p>Your dad needs to make some choices, but he deserves the respect of making informed choices. Perhaps some education about assisted living facilities is in order. Frankly, the people in these facilities almost always have all their faculties about them because otherwise they wouldn’t be accepted as residents. There are some incredibly bright and interesting folks in those facilities when you get to know them. But ultimately it’s his choice, but with the caveat that you will be setting new boundaries over what you will and what you will not provide. </p>
<p>I also think it’s rather manipulative that you are committing so much time to him, running yourself to the ground, and your father and brother are withholding financial information from you. You have no obligation to risk your children’s college funds to pay for extra help if he has the money, in one form or another. I think you have a right to know what’s available, and then make your decision as to what time you’re willing to commit. Again, much of this is just plain negotiation, but if you don’t step up to the plate, you will only have yourself to blame when (not if) you have caregiver breakdown.</p>
<p>momma-three, I agree with teriwtt, it is time for you to set boundaries and demand the respect you deserve. You have given and given and given, and your father and brother have taken and taken and taken. IMO they would let you keep giving until you keel over. You’re being emotionally blackmailed and you’re being used as unpaid labor, which is especially offensive given that there seems to be plenty of money floating around which could be used to pay for your father’s care. </p>
<p>You’ve talked a great deal about what you owe your father. What do you owe your husband and children? What price are they paying? It is time to turn your attention to your other family, and make them your priority. </p>
<p>You are tired to death, I can hear it in your posts. You have demonstrated your devotion and it is not appreciated. It is wrong of a father to ask his daughter to sacrifice herself and her family to him. It is wrong of a brother to take advantage of his sister’s generous spirit. But they are not going to stop until you stand up and say “No more.”</p>
<p>^^^^ Yes, that is how I am feeling and it needs to be addressed before my fathers inaction results in permanent discord between my brother and myself. I have known a few caregivers over the years and I think that the ones who do best are those who do not have siblings. Seeing my dad like this is very sad but I don’t want all of wonderful memories to be replaced with what is going on now. I will ask for full disclosure of dads finances and hopefully my brother will see that dad saved for a reason, and this is a good time to use it. There is manipulation involved, and I sure as heck hope that I never become that way when I get old.</p>
<p>My mother, lives alone in a condo within a mile from our house. She can not drive due to macular degeneration, but at 80 outlived her four siblings and is very lonely. My sister and I are here for her. </p>
<p>But, unlike your father, she has always been honest and open about finances, and wants us to know every detail. </p>
<p>The fact that your brother knows financial information and you don’t seems unfair. </p>
<p>Your father, and YOUR brother are lucky to have such a devoted daughter, but you are right, you are risking your relationship with your brother if you don’t know the “rest of the information” .</p>
<p>^^^^ yes, many times, and the answer is always “not much”. That does not mean anything. As I said earlier my dad was a world traveler (every continent including Everest) I find it hard to believe he does not have much left. It has become very difficult to even bring it up anymore based on previous conversations.</p>
<p>momma-three: I was going to give you some anecdote about my own situation, but after I typed it I realized it’s nothing compared to what you are going through.</p>
<p>I understand your guilt, but your obligation is to your children and husband. What you are doing for your dad now is just being a cleaning lady, which you could easily hire someone to do. Why couldn’t you have the same agreement with your brother to see if he could pay for a care taker for your father, when your father passes away he could take it out of the estate. </p>
<p>Your father sounded like a great dad for you growing up, and that’s the person you want to remember. You are beginning to sound resentful because you are doing all the things you don’t want to do. Does your father know you are stretched to the limit? I would tell him how tired you are and your doctor is worried about you. My sister’s MIL was like you - care taker of the whole big Italian family. She was always there to take care of anyone who needed her. Many years ago, she had a nervous breakdown. She just couldn’t do it any more. Don’t get to that point. </p>
<p>I am moving in a month to another country. I worry about my parents, mainly of my dad’s health. I thought he would be the one to tell me not to go. But he said to me, “Go, we can take care of ourselves. We appreciate having you around for so many years.”</p>
<p>We all need to face elderly parents care at some point. It’s not easy. There are some great advice from people who has been through it. Come back here to vent, and we’ll give you support.</p>
<p>momma-three, you know, just because your brother wrote a letter stating that he will get back the money that he spent to pay your father’s bills, does not necessarily mean that he is entitled to it legally. Also, why doesn’t your sweat equity count to equalize things a bit? I see a huge communication problem. If you quit your job or took less hours as your brother suggests, would that money come out of your dad’s estate (assuming he had the money to cover it)? I am not advising that you do that, btw, just wondering what your brother thinks since he recommends that you cut down your work hours to take care of your father.</p>
<p>If you are going to pay your brother back out of the estate, and you don’t charge a penny for what you have put into your father’s caretaking, I do think that you should use your father’s money to hire out some of caretaking chores. I don’t see why your father would resist having in someone to do laundry, cook, change the sheets and sweep/dust.</p>
<p>My dad has been trying to move my mom in with me for a couple of years now. He’s in better health and although he loves her he wants to live a more active life. If it weren’t for my DH’s emotional support, I would have given in and had my mom move in with us. She is sweet but very demanding. It would have been terrible for our kids and marriage. But my dad has been angry with me over this for quite awhile. He sees me as his only daughter, not currently employed with nothing better to do than take care of my mom so he can travel, exercise, socialize. It’s pretty repugnant, actually. Strange to get to this point in life and really have to cringe at the behavior of your parent. I have come to believe that the most self-centered ones live the longest. Very disillusioned. But in some ways it’s good because it makes me understand a lot of the not-so-good stuff of my childhood and youth with more clarity.</p>
<p>sewhappy, unbelievable. Can you give your dad a break though, by staying with your mom for a long weekend, or for a week so that he can take a vacation and get a break from her? </p>
<p>I can tell you that when my MIL was in a nursing home, we took my FIL on a family vacation and he lied to his wife about having to go away on a business trip (usual routine for his job and he really was still working). He needed an occasional break. He took a few trips to visit family in other states and he told his wife the same story. She was fine with it.</p>
<p>have you ever asked your dad about his finances? He may be willing to share the information. My dad regularly sends me a list of his assets, where the funds are with phone numbers, account numbers etc. so things would be easy when he passes away. </p>
<p>If not, you’re in the house every day, he must get monthly statements in the mail from banks or brokerage houses, you could take a look. </p>
<p>If your money situation is tight, you should talk to your dad. He should have his will drafted so that you get compensated for all the time you are spending taking care of him. If he had a home health care assistant it would cost him $20 or more per hour. </p>
<p>A frank talk about all these things, done calmly and in a loving manner, could clear the air. It sounds like you, your father and your brother don’t talk about all these things that are bothering you.</p>
<p>momma-three, a little late chiming in, but your situation really resonates with me after years of working with my sister to manage the logistics of care for two infirm elderly parents, including our mother, a long-term paraplegic. Our parents’ care has required considerable sacrifice on the part of my sister’s and my families, in terms of time spent away from our immediate families. So far, it’s been worth it, but at some point the balance may tip and it will become clear that we need another plan. Our situation is somewhat simpler now that our father passed away (though we miss him very much), and now we have only one parent to help care for. </p>
<p>It’s often not as simple as it might appear to conclude that an elderly parent should move to assisted living or a nursing home - especially elderly parents whose mobility is restricted so they wouldn’t be able to take advantage of some of the potential upsides of such a place (social life, taking meals with other elders, etc.) For many elders, staying in one’s own home has so much to offer, especially privacy and perhaps better ‘personal care’ than would be available in many institutional settings. There are many elders who thrive in assisted living/graduated living facilities, but it’s still worth exploring all the options before deciding what’s best for any particular person.</p>
<p>Even if Dad has no money at all (which I find hard to believe), it still isn’t right that the burden is falling so heavily on the OP. Brother needs to start pulling his share of the load. And if Dad does have money or assets which can be sold (yes, the house), then he needs to be paying for care, not using the OP as unpaid labor. </p>
<p>OP: You’re right, you do need to have a frank conversation with your father and brother. You’ll need to do it when you’re calm, and you need to use “I” statements. (“I can no longer come over here every day.”) As much as possible, stick to facts (“I cannot give you the care that you need.”) Present the problem in as few words as possible, and some possible solutions (“I am willing to help you find a good assisted living community.”) Since they don’t share financial info with you, don’t let them rein you back in with financial excuses; in fact, don’t engage in financial conversation at all (“I don’t have much information about your finances, so I can’t help you with that part of it. Perhaps brother can.”) Avoid explaining your statements; they are simple and clearly understood. Keep the conversation(s) short; the longer they are, the more opportunity for you to be drawn back into a role which is destroying you. Put the ball in dad’s court.</p>
<p>And then you need to be prepared for what will come next, because all hell to break loose. There will be tears, anger, disapproval, guilt trips, accusations, re-opening of old wounds, threats, stalling, every manipulation you can think of. * You are changing the rules *-- rules which have greatly benefited both of them at your expense. And they won’t willingly allow those rules to be changed. Don’t expect them to understand, cooperate, or support; do expect them to fight you every step of the way. You’ll need to rely on your own strength, and begin putting together a support network for yourself (could your DH come with you for at least the initial conversations, just to back you up?)</p>
<p>So before you have the conversation, have firmly in your mind what your boundaries are. If you find yourself wavering when you talk to them, leave. Whatever you do, don’t let them suck you into a negotiation about what you can or can’t do. The only topic you should discuss is “What can the three of us do to get Dad some help other than me?”</p>