<p>
</p>
<p>Without knowing the state of Schmaltz’ physique, it’s hard for me to know whether I should be drooling or vomiting at this image!</p>
<p>I think we’re all going to have to agree to disagree with Tiger Dad (aka POIH). </p>
<p>Most of us on thread believe that you can’t blame the cook if you didn’t help, and that criticism after the fact is pointless, AND we realize that there is never ever a 100% guarantee on college admissions - unless you are the Dean of Admissions at the college your kid is applying to. </p>
<p>OP, if your husband doesn’t understand all 3 of those things, I feel badly for you having to live with him. :(</p>
<p>*YES, DH does provide; no not long hours. The nest egg was gambled away (oh, I mean strategically invested with way too many short calls). I cashed out MY portion before the dot.com bloodbath (which I predicted, thank you) and paid off our mortgage. *</p>
<p>**He lost the rest. **</p>
<p>Aha!! I missed this post about his financial dealings. Let me share with you something that my sister (a therapist) has said many times. In marriages (and other relationships), there is often a “marble game” going on. </p>
<p>At the beginning, each person is perceived to have roughly the same number of marbles. However, as the relationship progresses, and one spouse clearly emerges as being weaker in decision-making, natural intelligence, and/or “walking around smarts,” then marbles have been lost by that person, and the other spouse gains marbles. </p>
<p>In this case, the H lost a whole bunch of marbles when he foolishly invested their money. The wife gained a whole bunch of marbles with her decisions. This created a huge imbalance of “marbles” because of the long-lasting implications of that one mistake. This mistake wasn’t something that just caused a minor ripple in the family, such as denting a car or bouncing a check. This H has to live with the fact that not only did he make a very serious mistake, but his wife’s decisions were not only better, but they “saved” the family from absolute disaster. </p>
<p>Once you have one spouse with “lots of marbles” (in this case, the wife) and you have another spouse who perceives himself as having fewer marbles, then you have a situation where the H is going to “lash out” and criticize any imaginable thing in a way to try to “take away” some of the other’s marble stash. </p>
<p>So, even when other rationable people would say that the H has no reason to criticize the wife about the waitlist situation, the H just sees it as an opportunity to say, “see, everything YOU do doesn’t work out perfectly either.” </p>
<p>Also…since such a person perceives himself as having fewer marbles, it may take him a LONG time (maybe never) to admit that he was wrong to criticize (because that means losing MORE marbles). </p>
<p>Anyway…once my sister told us this, a whole lot of situations began to make sense (situation with unreasonable relatives, nutty teachers, stubborn children, etc).</p>
<p>Seems like several DHs have lost their marbles in this thread ;)</p>
<p>My H doesn’t even try. He is smart enough to let me handle it, and just remembers to say, “Good job, honey.”</p>
<p>Wow, Mom2collegekids, your sister is good! That might explain why he has yet to apologize; not that I expected one. This marble perspective is truly an awakening moment. It really explains a lot of his behavior of the last several years…i thought he was just going through manopause!!! Honestly, can’t tell you how the veil has been lifted for me. No more jumping on his emotional rollercoaster…just going to row peacefully into my sunset, calm and cool. (of course this doesn’t preclude me from losing all my marbles for something stupid, but I don’t plan on that happening!) I’m paying for my Vegas trip with all the money saved on not requiring therapy thanks to all your sage advice on CC. Thanks again!!!</p>
<p>Manopause? I like it…</p>
<p>Love the marble analogy. I am going to go count mine now.</p>
<p>LOVE the marble analogy. Thanks for sharing that, mom2collegekids!</p>
<p>Verbal abuse is another.</p>
<p>I have to say, run, do not walk - get OUT. You are worth more than how you are being treated.</p>
<p>And we really do need to chill and remember this is not ours to own in any way shape or form - no matter what we did in the process. This BELONGS to our children, period.</p>
<p>OMG am I glad I had a “too much time on CC” morning soas to read this whole thread. That marble concept makes all the CC time well spent. Thank you mom2!!!</p>
<p>Hrmmm, thinking about how this plays into every day events. Often if I bring up something that needs to be altered in our life, DH starts listing other things that need to be altered. I get SO frustrated. I say, “if you think that needs to be changed then bring it up when you think of it and we’ll work through it at that time. Right now we’re dealing with xyz.” Then he gets mad. Then I get mad. Rinse and repeat. Now I see that he is playing a game of marbles. I just want to fix xyz. This has also happened to me at work. I just see something needing to be solved and try to approach it to work it out. Others I now know, are playing a game of marbles. HOLY MOLY. Lightbulb.</p>
<p>Ha! I just lost another marble…</p>
<p>*So, even when other rationable people *</p>
<p>LOL…RATIONAL people. </p>
<p>Seems like several DHs have lost their marbles in this thread</p>
<p>LOL!!! </p>
<p>Seriously, though, I do think that men do have a harder time dealing with an inbalance of marbles when they perceive themselves as having less because of our culture’s perception that men are supposed to be the (gag) more logical, smarter sex. When men feel that they don’t have more marbles, they can feel emasculated…so some will just be petty…and some will more seriously lash out.</p>
<p>TigerDad better be glad he did not marry Lorena Bobbitt! Just sayin’.</p>
<p>Mmm, the marble analogy fits PERFECTLY with the situation with my ex-H. Could not be any clearer… At risk of derailing the thread, my issue was always how to legitimately give him marbles back (without, you know, giving some away like we might in a game with our kids when they are little to make them feel good). Could never figure out a way to “share” the marbles that he didn’t seem to want to own, but then he fussed when he didn’t have them…</p>
<p>I read all this and do wonder if I am ignoring a situation which could lead to some serious bombing next year at this time…
What do you all think?</p>
<p>DH is the control freak, the financial organizer. He is very caring and quite involved with the kids, but he definitely does not stop himself from criticizing me when he disagrees with what I am doing with/for/to the kids. This I know is a problem.
I am the stay at home, researching type. I try to share what I learn and make joint decisions in some cases, and make some decisions on my own and leave him be, too- it is a dance that you are all describing so well here.
He has all the marbles, and resents my not making any in the last few years (I did make more than he did for the 10 years I worked, all too long ago!), probably because he is not making as many these days (his age and the economy, but still hard for his ego.)
In the college process, this is the situation:
H cherishes the idea that D is smart and accomplished and believes she can go all the way (to a tippy top school.) I see that she does have the Potential, but worry that it takes much more than that (hard work, understanding the system/game, good luck) to actually get admitted to one of these schools. Reading CC, sharing books about the process with him- these are my techniques to inform myself, but it is not easy for me to bring him into this awareness. My researching and conclusions are NOT a reflection on my opinion of my child. Not a reflection on my opinion of whether she deserves to get in to a super selective. Not even a reflection of my desire for that! Just an attempt to be realistic, get us both on the same page about the landscape, so to speak. And to enhance our chance of any of us not being incredibly disappointed next Spring. (That could mean: enhancing her chances of getting into x schools, or looking for a lower level of schools, or both- I am open, but I am sure it needs to be done. Hard to get my H to see this…)
Well, he makes fun of my research, tells me it is biased and is oriented to a bunch of over-achievers and gamers, and then gets angry that I do not “believe in” my daughter, and then proceeds to tell me I am depressing her and distressing her when I share an innocuous comment like, “Sat Prep is a 6 week process.”, or “Since you have been a member since F year, are you going to try to be head of XX Club?” And my one sentence comments to my D are made once a month or less!! [THINK of all the things I am not saying to either my D or H that I read on here!! LOL I just do not share much of it- kind of a pick your battles thing- I want to be very informed, but want to simplify things for them]. We all enjoy looking at schools, and really are pleased with what she does accomplish- she is bathed in love and admiration and has a lot of independence. She is a great kid, a great daughter, and nothing can change that. These comments are really very rare, I promise you.
My H is a wonderful Dad and a good provider (yes, those darn marbles–although that is an area he is sensitive about these days…) We have been to see “lesser” colleges. I am trying to clue him in ever so slowly that these schools are still probably reaches and certainly lottery tickets for her. When I suggest schools that are even less selective or prestigious, he resists. I am just hoping it will just take time, and he will come around. My D really does want us (me!?!) to lead her to schools that fit her atmospheric criteria, so that is fine. She is not at all concerned about prestige.
On the enhancing her chances front, it is not so easy- there are only so many hours in the day, and my husband just does not support all that much action with my D in this area. So that is that. I keep my mouth shut except when it is a particularly appropriate time to discuss anything like this.
Anyway, my mantra to my D has been at each school: do you see yourself here? would you be happy and fulfilled? you could really end up here, so be honest. No school can go on the list without a yes. I am now moving into a new mode with H (not in front of my D, of course), esp after reading this thread: Ok, how would you REALLY feel about your daughter going to any of these schools? AND How will you feel if she is wait-listed or rejected by X? by Y? by all or most? Will you regret not looking at more schools? will you regret not advising her more clearly on how to prepare??
This is a very unfortunate analogy, but it rings somewhat true: it is a little like chemotherapy- you really only get one chance to pick a treatment, and you do not get much time to select it. Yes, if there is remission, you can do it again, but it is not as effective. (Not a perfect analogy to transferring, I realize- sorry…)
But I say that we need to help our kids know what is going on in this ridiculous college process without freaking them out too much. It is not fair to hold high expectations without informing them of the realities of what they could be doing or others are doing, and how the game works, should they want to play it. And what not playing the games might mean.
It is not magic. It is not meritocratic. It is a choice- how much do you care (HONESTLY!)? Then proceed.
I just wish it were really so simple!
Any advice most appreciated…
I have already learned so much from al of you out there-Thank You!</p>
<p>Anyway, my situation is a little different from OP’s because my H IS involved in the process, but we disagree about it.
Maybe lack of involvement is not such a bad thing!!</p>
<p>performersmom, I feel your pain. My husband and I had several discussions in the last year in which he suggested that I undervalued our daughter’s accomplishments and I suggested that he was unrealistic about the college-admissions process. Him: She’s so smart! Her test grades are so high! Me: I agree. She is smart! Her test scores are high! And there are thousands of high school seniors out there like her. </p>
<p>Whenever the topic arose, I would pull out the acceptance rates of the schools my husband was fixated on and I would also, if necessary, pull out more detailed statistics (for one school, I was able to find the number of students with “perfect” SAT scores who were denied admission). I think this eventually helped my husband see the light.</p>
<p>I live in a pretty evenly marbled marriage. fortunately.</p>
<p>Occaisonally, H will get all “interested” in something he’s never payed much attention to, or I will get “curious” about an area I’ve never really participated in very strongly. But, you know, it never lasts. There’s a reason the labor has divided itself the way it has. </p>
<p>The worst is when there is something that Neither of us is interested in that still needs attention. As we’ve gotten older, though, we’ve learned to just kind of hire that stuff out wherever possible.</p>
<p>Good luck to everyone. This, too, shall pass.</p>
<p>My H is a wonderful Dad and a good provider (yes, those darn marbles–although that is an area he is sensitive about these days…)</p>
<p>“Having more marbles” can be related to who earns the most/all of the money, but it often isn’t. It is more often about which person is perceived to be the one with the most common sense, bettter decision-making skills, more well-read, has more varied interests so knows a lot about a lot of things, etc. </p>
<p>It can also occur when one spouse has an addiction (drinking, gambling, etc) or infidelity issues that has had negative affects on the marriage/family, so that spouse viciously nitpicks the other spouse so as to say…“you’re not perfect either…you make mistakes, too” (even tho those mistakes/flaws are far more minor and have insignificant negative affects on the family).</p>
<p>performersmom, in some cases a high school guidance counselor can help in this situation. If yours is the type with good advice… you could request a meeting, and maybe give them a little heads up ahead of time that you think your H has unrealistic expectations, and you could use some help building up the idea of some match/safety schools.</p>
<p>Megdog’s idea of using statistics is also a good one. You might make up a spreadsheet (we did this for D1) showing acceptance information at her desired schools. Put your D’s test scores at the top of the sheet. Then for each school, put in the 50% range for accepted students. Also some other key info (m/f ratio - as that can affect admission negatively if they are girl heavy, % of applicants accepted, GPA - you can see that for a lot of colleges at a website you can find by searching for mychances – cc stars out the site name for some reason). Then… turn safety schools (ones where she falls above the 50% range) green, match schools (ones where she is at the midpoint to 75% point yellow – I think applicants below that often have a "hook), and reach schools (all where she is under the 50% midpoint) red. Or you could use the 25%-50% as orange, and below the range as red. We were brutally honest in this. If even ONE of the two CR/Math scores was not up to snuff, it got the “lower” color. This really made it visually obvious that we were looking at too many reach schools when we started.</p>
<p>If you have Naviance access at your school, good to print that out as well for each school. It is not always the case, but men tend to respond better to actual data (but may not seek it out and organize it themselves). </p>
<p>I also think it is good to be systematic about picking safeties once you sell your H & D on the need for them. Our method (which I have described on other threads) was to:</p>
<ol>
<li> Use the Fiske book to find colleges that were strong in her proposed major. We marked them all.</li>
<li> Select the ones where her scores were above the 50% range (both scores, CR/Math)</li>
<li> Filter for other criteria (size, geography, etc.)</li>
<li> Visit some of them.</li>
<li> We took safeties off the list that do not offer merit aid. If my kid is going to help bring their stats up, there should be some compensation (price break) for that. This is another thing to bring up to your H, that she may get some merit aid from these schools. Make sure he knows the full cost (and it is rising, of course) at the schools she is looking at. Maybe another column in the spreadsheet. :)</li>
</ol>
<p>D1 loved her safety so much she attended with good merit aid. We are visiting colleges for D2, and I think one of the first two colleges we visited is an excellent safety and she loved it. Doesn’t mean she will attend, but it is nice to have one identified early in the process.</p>
<p>performersmom - I may have to go back and re read your post, but my initial take is that your H is not so much “involved” in the process as he is in giving his opinions about what you have researched. There is a difference. </p>
<p>I tend to smother myself with details so I have this saying hanging on my bathroom wall and I smile every time I read it:</p>
<p>"I just don’t like to see you waste your time on silly things,"HE said</p>
<p>“Well then,” SHE said “Close your eyes”</p>