<p>Can I say again that ALL names are American and ALL names are “ethnic.” There is no such thing as an absence of ethnicity. </p>
<p>This is one of my pet peeves. Sorry.</p>
<p>You still can’t assume you know the ethnicity or appearance of a faceless poster.</p>
<p>Ha, I suggested we don’t know enough- NOT to dispute OP, for heaven’s sake, but to try to rein in some of the wild speculation. In fact, I deleted a post stating there was more speculation than fact, only to find OP had piped in just ahead of me and explained more. So, I deleted the post. </p>
<p>It’s true this country has an issue with racism. That shouldn’t make us find shadows around every corner. Or run wild with assumptions. On.this.thread.</p>
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Ain’t that the truth.</p>
<p>Thank you, sseamom and others, for speaking out on this. </p>
<p>Although those who ask these questions may mean no harm, it doesn’t stop the fact that the child is placed under a spotlight. I can remember so many occasions when I was put under the spotlight in class and had my differences pointed out. It made me feel vulnerable and embarrassed. I dont know why I felt embarrassed, but perhaps, it was the fact that the teacher kept on asking, “But your hair…but your skin color…but your mom…but…but…but…” By the end I felt as if I was picked apart and made “different”. I am different but you can’t blame a kid for wanting to not be picked out of the crowd in the middle of class.</p>
<p>If you find offense in little things, you lose the impact of the things that should inspire outrage. Like the successful actor handcuffed and humiliated for the crime of being affluent while black.</p>
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<p>And yet, little mention of the contortions and wild speculation about the sub’s “good intentions”…especially the odd part here:</p>
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<p>That’s not how I nor most folks who have had that question posed to us countless times would have interpreted it. Especially if it has already been established he singled out students “with foreign sounding names” per OP’s first post.</p>
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<p>Classic red herring strategy used by folks to discount accounts by those directly impacted by racism and other forms of discrimination. </p>
<p>If you’re not the one directly impacted by the given situation, you do not get to dictate what’s offensive or discomforting to others. </p>
<p>Also, who’s to say that one cannot be offended by both or more importantly, that by being concerned with the “little things” that there are eventually fewer “bigger things” to deal with later on?</p>
<p>One of my friends has fraternal twins. One is VERY fair and the other very bronzed. Strangers would always come up to her and ask whether they had different fathers and if they really WERE twins. They would be very disbelieving and insulting and she would try to laugh it off but did sometimes get irritated, especially as the twins got older and could understand the questions.</p>
<p>Our D had a really nutty teacher when she was in 2nd grade. The woman went around the room yelling at the kids and then went outside the classroom and pounded her head against the brick wall or door and yelled, “I can’t take this any more!” The counselor came in and saw the chaos and then left the kids with that woman for the rest of the day. The next day, the principal came in and lectured the 2nd graders for having the sub lose control, making them late for their field trip.</p>
<p>D was afraid to go to school after that. Nothing happened to that sub, and as far as I know she was allowed to continue subbing after that incident. D transferred schools, as I would not leave a classroom of 2nd graders (in a 2nd floor classroom) with someone so out of control and then refuse to tell parents why the kids were afraid to go to school. (There was also a kid in the classroom who would regularly threaten and terrorize other students–the kids were told to be understanding of her because she was “special needs”.)</p>
<p>Sorry that so many have had such odd and some insulting and very inappropriate experiences. It’s important to figure out how to deal with these issues, as unfortunately, they do come up.</p>
<p>Well, cobrat, it had already been established countless times that you have a unique and fascinating perspective on absolutely everything.</p>
<p>Himom, you make an excellent point. Kids need to know when the crazy is dangerous or when it is merely inappropriate. If the latter, it can be responded to clearly and politely. If the former, then action above the level must be sought.</p>
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<p>And like how some posters here have tried to make it the OP’s and her classmates’ responsibility to be more “understanding” of the sub, this principal has got it completely backwards. </p>
<p>Teachers…including subs are the ones responsible for everything that goes on in their class…including their own behavior. Not only are they in greater positions of authority relative to the students, they are also older adults who should be more mature and know better. </p>
<p>In Himom’s account, that counselor and the principal need to be strongly counseled and monitored and/or be strongly encouraged to seek opportunities outside education. As for the sub, she’s definitely exhibited signs she’s unfit to teach K-8…or even K-12 and those observing her should strongly considering sending her in for a mental health evaluation considering her behavior in front of her young students.</p>
<p>The union backed the principal and counselor, so we just left the school and gave up. I had been head of the PTA at that school the prior year.</p>
<p>Consolation, I think it is too easy, and somewhat disingenuous, to just say “every name is American, and every name is ethnic.” The same goes for people who are criticizing the OP for her use (in quotes) of the word “normal” to describe more typical American names. </p>
<p>We all know which names are considered and have traditionally been mainstream American names. These are usually names that are now commonly used by people of many races and ethnicities - “Eric” could be white, black, Asian, etc. Nearly everyone knows someone with that name. People are unlikely to make cultural assumptions based on it.</p>
<p>“Sunil” on the other hand, is an Indian name. Of course, there is an Indian population in the US whose kids, whatever their names, are as authentically American as anyone else. That doesn’t change the fact that you aren’t going to find a lot of Sunils outside of that particular group, or that most people who hear it either won’t have heard it before or will immediately identify the person as Indian or Indian-American. Perhaps one day, it will become a name used by Americans of a variety of backgrounds, but that hasn’t happened yet. </p>
<p>Pretending that we don’t see the difference between these names is excessive political correctness, and it isn’t productive, any more than saying “I don’t see color” is a productive way to deal with racial complexity in America. </p>
<p>cobrat: I mostly agree with you on this issue, but you’re getting extreme here. I don’t think this would, or should be an automatically fireable offence at most workplaces or schools. It calls for a conversation, not a pink slip. And I have no idea what you could possibly mean by saying that consequences would have been even worse at Oberlin - unless Oberlin has acquired some sort of police power I’m not aware of, there really isn’t much the school could do beyond firing someone.</p>
<p>I encountered the “where are you from?” question a few years back on a business trip to a place in the US that was something like 85-90% white. As a member of a visible minority (traveling with someone of a visibly different visible minority), we went into an ethnic restaurant of a visible minority ethnicity that was different but might be mistaken for at first glance. The question came from the waiter, who was probably of the ethnicity matching the restaurant. (My answer was a well known US city where I worked.)</p>
<p>"If you find offense in little things, you lose the impact of the things that should inspire outrage. Like the successful actor handcuffed and humiliated for the crime of being affluent while black. "</p>
<p>Oh no, not at all. It’s stopping the LITTLE things before people start thinking the BIGGER things are ok too that’s important. One can speak up without overreacting and perhaps make a difference when little things are involved. If enough of us did, then perhaps one day people like my husband won’t get questioned by police when he is the one who CALLED them, people like a former city council member won’t be detained on the way to a formal function, people like a respected pastor won’t be frisked outside his own church, people won’t be suspect for “walking while black”, and on and on. </p>
<p>If we can stop otherizing folks, stop suspecting folks, stop questioning them for looking or being named different from the majority, MAYBE the bigger outrages won’t be as common.</p>
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<p>apprenticeprof,</p>
<p>When I attended, the student culture was such that most of the students would still have the inclination to mass together in a loud campuswide protest to voice disapproval and disseminate information about the offense and in so doing, make the individual/group’s stay so uncomfortable they’d voluntarily leave. </p>
<p>One extreme example of this was what student activist groups did to ROTC personnel there during the height of the Vietnam War. While it’s still celebrated among alums from that era from what I read in the alum magazine, I felt they went too far when they surrounded & immobilized their car and prevented them from taking bathroom breaks for several hours.</p>
<p>Are you guys really comparing “Where are you from” to the Vietnam War? OMG!</p>
<p>There’s no “you guys” about it, Flossy. Cobrat is alone on this.</p>
<p>Good…</p>
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<p>I didn’t say I necessarily agreed with it. Just explaining how things would have gone down based on the student culture and history. Granted, it changed not too long after I graduated.</p>
<p>Which has zero relevance to how the campus would respond to a non-malicious if somewhat tin-eared and awkward remark on the part of a faculty member. I mean, Vietnam? Really?</p>
<p>Going away before someone brings up Kent State…</p>