<p>I see. The Mexican students I work with (N.Cal, East Bay and Central Valley) seem to think it’s racial, but maybe they don’t know if their teachers know their parent’s status. We get a lot of seasonal workers here. I absolutely think the parent’s status affects how they interact with agencies, including the schools. I just have to say how impressed I am with their values. Mom AND dad show up for appointments, and sometimes the extended family. You go, families.</p>
<p>For the record, I am not Mexican, but I am black, and some seem to assume I will understand. Blacks/African Americans are relatively small numbers in all but a few California zip codes, at least in N.Cal, so we are sometimes fly below the radar.</p>
<p>Suppose I was in a grocery store, waiting in line to check out. The person behind me is speaking to their children with a foreign accent. Would it be OK for me to ask them where they’re from just because I’m curious? If the person is just trying to check out and deal with their kids, they may find this annoying and rude. I could just say I wasn’t very sensitive.</p>
<p>Now the grocery clerk, on the other hand, is not supposed to make customers feel uncomfortable or waste people’s time by asking personal questions. That clerk has probably been “trained” to understand what type of questions could be considered as inappropriate. So they must hold themselves to a different standard.</p>
<p>Where I shop, the grocery clerks are very friendly. They often ask what I am up to that day (Trader Joe’s does this all the time - I assume they are trained to do this). I think it is nice that they make it personal. I know other people are bothered by it, as the topic has been discussed here on CC. I think showing interest in others one is transacting with, falls more into the “good manners” category, whereas ignoring their humanity would be more in the “bad.”</p>
<p>Bay, I also live where people who work in stores talk to me. It’s nice. I like it. I feel sorry for the people who live where cashiers are so restricted. You might as well use self check out machines.</p>
<p>Bay, yes it’s fine to ask benign questions like, “How is your day?”. But, " What country are you from," ( a possible loaded question) may be a bit too personal for many people. It doesn’t matter that “you” think it isn’t. </p>
<p>What if you were paying with food stamps and the clerk just nicely asked, “How’s the job search going?”.Their intent may have been purely positive and sympathetic, but the question is still inappropriate. They did not come to the store to be asked about their job search.</p>
<p>I personally hate when grocery clerks look at my food and ask if it’s good and whatnot.</p>
<p>I feel invaded. It’s personal. But I also realize that this is a dumb quirk of mine and people will occasionally ask. It’s also kind of obvious, since I’m buying it.</p>
<p>Clerks around here are usually friendly and outgoing. That’s who gets hired and they are definitely not trained to be robots. Honestly, clerks are not trained all that much at all. One day to watch and off you go.</p>
<p>Regarding grocery store clerks and level of interaction, it varies depending on the local cultural expectations of a given region.</p>
<p>When I attended college in the midwest, the grocery store clerks made it a point to chit-chat with me and lines were slower…but most didn’t really mind as the locals expected/wanted that from their grocery clerks. </p>
<p>In the NYC area and Boston, most grocery store clerk training emphasizes getting customers’ groceries checked out ASAP with little/no conversation encouraged…especially if there was any line. Only exceptions are when there are no lines and the customer is a friendly regular who is willing to exchange pleasantries/short conversations. </p>
<p>According to one owner of a local supermarket in my area, if the grocery clerks in his employ carried on the types of conversations I recounted from my Midwestern college town days when there’s a line or with a new/known unfriendly/in a hurry regular, he’d counsel them first that this wasn’t acceptable considering the volume and most local customer expectations. If it happened again, he’d conclude they didn’t take his counseling to heart and invite them to seek other employment opportunities. </p>
<p>Incidentally, the local Trader Joes in my area has clerks who seem to have been trained to read your expression to see if you’re in a hurry/there’s a long line or not and use that as a determination to strike up friendly chitchat or just exchange quick pleasantries and check your out ASAP as with most NYC/Boston supermarkets.</p>
<p>Yeah well, some (most) of this is culture not training. In NYC you don’t make eye contact on the street you take care of business, in CA there’s more smiling but people are usually in cars, and in the Midwest, it’s true, people expect more smiles and chatter.</p>
<p>Grocery checker training is universally minimal. At Macy’s however they do encourage clerks to say things like oh how pretty to make a customer feel pleased about their purchase. It’s called Macy’s Magic. At grocery stores, not so much.</p>
<p>Not sure if I agree with this. Some of the bias appears to be more about Mexicans than generic illegal immigration which would not be limited to Mexicans. Remember Proposition 187 in 1994? While nominally about illegal immigration, it was widely seen as anti-Latino (and anti-Asian to a much lesser extent), which may have accelerated the decline of the Republican Party in California.</p>
<p>I love my grocery stores I frequent two local chains, but mostly the one about .5 mile away.I have gone there several times a week for the last 28
years. ( we usually walk so we only get a couple bags) Several of the clerks I know because they are neighbors or former classmates of the kids.
They are very friendly and it really gives me a pick me up to go there.
( plus it is a great store- quality & selection)</p>
<p>Clerks can make or break an experience.
I hardly ever go to Nordstroms anymore and one of the reasons is because the clerks are obequious.
You’d think I was the second coming of whatever that actors name is whose married to Matthew Broderick.
I like a store where I can trust the clerks opinion.</p>
<p>How is this example supposed to illustrate a racial bias? Not that there is even a Mexican race to begin with.</p>
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<p>I agree with Bay. I do not understand why “what country are you from?” is a “loaded question.” I lived in Europe for a short time and was asked that question all the time, probably daily in fact. I never once thought that people were being rude or that I had cause to get huffy about it. I didn’t consider it a “personal question” either. WHY is it rude to ask that? I saw a headline one day: “America, the land of the perpetually offended.” I’m starting to think it wasn’t far off.</p>
Its really, really hard to believe that this ever actually came up in any conversation with a supermarket “owner”. Maybe, MAYBE possibly with a store manager if one had an issue with a store clerk and chose to call over the manager, but the rest, its just … well Pizzagirl has pointed it out over and over. Its just not believable. How many of us even know who owns a supermarket, let alone have conversations with them about their policies with their clerks. Really. </p>
<p>And another side vent before I have my morning coffee. Why do some folks conflate nationalities with religion/ethnicity?</p>
<p>Cobrat illustrates the problem with assuming our anecdotes yield some universal understanding. </p>
<p>This thread shows how easily we add our own sentiments and experiences to what is sometimes a very simple matter and then give it sooo much weight, roil it up into a big mess, get emotions involved and come up with a crisis of larger proportions. Simple fact: the sub may not have been the best person to run that class. Maybe the time not spent teaching is a waste, but most of us have experiences with subs who don’t step right into the regular teacher’s shoes. </p>
<p>The example of living in Europe is interesting. There have been many times when being an American brought assumptions about our individual lifestyles, political sentiments and all sorts of negatives. And sillier. I have been told we don’t have sidewalks, don’t wear coats in winter, and all sorts of gobbledygook. Progress comes from interactions, not hiding, nor lecturing. It comes from getting to better know each other.</p>
<p>We are a melting pot (not saying it works perfectly.) What does it mean to get to know each other? I often find assumptions more limiting than just asking a question.</p>
<p>Agree, lookingforward. Many anecdotal stories, when believable and pertinent can add value to the discussion. Off topic or phantasmagorical ones tend to hijack the thread in another direction. </p>
<p>There are unfortunately many stereotypes of people from different countries or different ethnicities. Its funny when someone from overseas asks us if we know someone who happens to live in the same state we do. I recall as a kid being asked by the children of new neighbors where my horns were. When we were on vacation in Mexico, another young tourist asked my son where his beanie was. At least that one was a little closer… Its out of ignorance, not malice (usually).</p>
<p>Back to the OP and the issue of appropriateness… if the question was intended to spark a conversation pertinent to the subject of the AP class, then perhaps the intent was good but the delivery- not so much…</p>
<p>Sweetcupcake, I totally believe you when you said that the sub was a nutjob. And haven’t we all encountered plenty of them and don’t they drive us nuts?</p>
<p>As far as being in line in a supermarket, I am the nutjob lady who coos, makes faces and chats with the kids either in front or in back of me in the line. Yes I do do this. I don’t think I’ve ever had anyone offended when I said to their kids “could you possibly be any cuter? No I don’t think you could!” But I shop in Wegmans so people are just friendlier (I’m kidding). I don’t think I would ask the ethnicity of the people, though unless it came up in some natural way. But I could see circumstances under which I might ask someone if their name crossed my path. But maybe not because I am not the chattiest person in the world. Except with kids. I adore kids.</p>
<p>Sorry I didn’t read all of the replies but responding to an original question, I don’t see a problem with teachers asking about the student’s nationality or cultural background.
I think very often it can spark very lively exchanges and serve as a an ice breaker.</p>
<p>We came to the US over 20 years ago from Ukraine and my son’s and husband’s last name (I kept my maiden name) seems to create a lot of interest and also a lot of difficulty for people, not sure why as the pronunciation is very phonetic.</p>
<p>I think this saying has been charged to “we are a salad bowl.”</p>
<p>I’m wondering if all this inability to agree is regional. I live in an area where a certain minority is seen as " lower class". The perception increases with the country of origin. </p>
<p>I’m also wondering if it has to do with life experiences. Many CC posters are well educated and surround themselves with people similar to themselves. The well educated are less likely to be intolerant or “threatened” by people of other races or countries; they tend to welcome their insight and are indeed curious. They also tend to have better manners and can “read” a social situation.</p>
<p>On the other hand, there are many people out there that are not curious. They think immigrants are stealing their jobs and living off the government. When that stereotype gets attached to certain races (or recent immigrants) it behooves us to “filter” our curiosity.</p>
<p>There’s a long thread in the cafe right now that exemplifies this perfectly. </p>
<p>I absolutely agree with this. I honestly don’t remember the last time I was offended. And that’s WITH seeing people dress up like my ethnicity for Halloween (I think the Roma/Gypsies are the last ethnic/racial group that it’s “socially acceptable” to imitate at Halloween). Being offended just seems like such a waste of time and brain power. </p>
<p>Now that I think about it, I was often asked when I was abroad where I was from. Many people would incorrectly guess “Canada”. I often let them continue to think that ;)</p>
<p>I was just about to say that Limewire! America is not a melting pot. To still think America is a melting pot…now that is being stuck in the last millennium!</p>
<p>Limewine, I like what you said. I remember when I passed the citizenship exam and my co-workers decorated my desk with some Americana trinkets but there were also some people who told me that I still wouldn’t be a “real” American to whom I said two things:</p>
<p>one - unless you are of a Native American descent, it’s almost like insulting your grandma or a great great great grandma whichever the case might be. At some point, some generation of your family came here as immigrants.</p>
<p>two - depending on how you look at it, I might actually be more of a “real” American since I’ve made a conscious decision to come here and had to actually pass a test to become a citizen unlike some natural born citizens of this country who just happened to be born here and probably wouldn’t even be able to answer most of the questions on that test (which I actually tested on some of my co-workers).</p>