@nrdsb4:
There is a theory that it is better to let racists and bigots express themselves, that it ‘lets off steam’ and so forth. On the other hand, when people call them on this speech and/or behavior, then you get the whining that people criticizing them for their statements or answering back are ‘restricting their freedom of speech’, like when customers were angry that the head of a tech company supported anti same sex marriage initiatives and ended up getting fired by the board because it was affecting the company’s sales.
At this point, I don’t think any of us can distinguish between the ordinary deplorable crime and behaviors versus that directed at identity groups based on hatred, ignorance, and some sense of license, since last Tuesday.
No, I do not believe the media is finally doing their job.
But yes, he unleashed something. Now we wait for the churches/religious groups, local leaders, school admins and others to exert some influence. And I wait for my peers to stand by (and stand up for) these targeted groups. It’s not enough to abhor the behavior and spread links to more reports.
Anyone want to say what they are actually doing?
edit:
I refer, though, to how he empowered them, gave them a voice, reflected their anger. That’s on him. It’s not all fringe. That’s a big part of the issue. His support was not all loonies, who live “somewhere else.”
@fractalstr:
I think you are missing the point, and it is a big one. @Nrdsb4 is correct, i don’t think trump is anti lgbt (though I also don’t know if he would be willing to stop the rest of the GOP when they inevitably try to find ways to roll back LGBT rights measures). No, I don’t think the ‘fringe followers’ like the KKK represent Trumps own beliefs, U doubt that despite the kind of crap he has said publicly.
That said, though, the point is that Trump, by publicly saying the kinds of things he did on the campaign trail, claiming Muslims were terrorists, Mexicans were rapists and criminals, and the disdain he showed to women and others, set a tone for those who were members of the coalition that elected him, saying it was okay to voice racist and other ugly beliefs. A lot of these people didn’t just suddenly start voting GOP with Trump, they have been there all along (anyone remember McCain during the 2008 election telling people to shut up when they started the Obama as Muslim/terrorist supporter crap?), or the videos people did of people at GOP rallies who basically said Obama because he was black ‘didn’t have the ability’ to be president?). The southern strategy that the GOP used to take the south was based to a large extent in people disaffected by civil rights law, and they have been part of the GOP coalition ever since, so this is nothing new…but the GOP as a party and its leaders have done a lot to try and keep that tamped down, Trump did not.
More importantly, Trump as far as I know ever disavowed David Duke or the endorsement he got from the KKK or spoke out on it, and that is important. When the rioting happened during the G7 meetings in this country (Seattle I recall), Obama denounced the rioting and the damage to property.
Personally I suspect 90% of what Trump uttered or utters was simply said to allow him to get elected, I doubt he is pro life, I doubt he is anti gay, I know he isn’t the least bit religious, but doesn’t stop him from using those to get elected, either, one thing I can tell you from observing him for many years, he firmly believes the end justifies the means.
@lookingforward Well, I disagree with you there. If anyone gave them a voice, it was the news media.
I think it’s unfair to associate a terrible group with someone, since it wasn’t that person who called for their support in the first place. I’ll just leave it at that.
The LGBTQ community is more worried about the VP than the P. The VP supports conversion therapy, among other things. During the VP nomination phase, someone who turned down the offer to be trump’s VP said he was told he would be “the most powerful VP in history” and would be in charge of “domestic and foreign policy.”
A number of people are commenting on Twitter that the news media is now normalizing having an anti-Semitic white nationalist running policy in the White House. So, no, I don’t think that is “doing their job” for the news media.
Not sure which media you mean “used them to slander him.” But as a group, his supporters were not watching CNN. MSNBC, or reading NYT.
The fact he may not have courted a rightest extremist group doesn’t mean his words had no impact on them.
@lookingforward --“And I wait for my peers to stand by (and stand up for) these targeted groups. It’s not enough to abhor the behavior and spread links to more reports.”
YES! I agree that it’s time to stop whining, and time to DO something. Here’s what I’ve done:
- made a contribution to Planned Parenthood
- made a contribution to ACLU
- continue my work with a local organization helping to resettle political refugees -- all Muslims -- from Afghanistan, Syria and Iraq
I’d like to do more. Maybe I will, if time/finances/life allow. FWIW, I support the protesters, too. They’re being active in their own way.
Anti-Semitic? His son-in-law, reportedly who is one of his closest advisors is Jewish. So is Ivanka (converted) and another daughter-in-law.
Anti-Semitic white nationalist = Steve Bannon
If he wanted to reach his followers, he would Tweet that instead of saying it on 60 Minutes. He hasn’t.
I doubt Trump is anti semitic, given the class he grew up in, and growing up in NYC, and the business he works in, I very much doubt it, the people he did deals with, the clients for his services, would have more than a few folks who happened to be Jewish, and given his age he grew up when NYC had a lot more Jewish population than it does today, so not likely. There are people around him I have doubts about how they feel about Jews, but him? Not likely.
Probably just a coincidence. I’m sure our President-elect calling Mexicans rapists and murderers is just a coincidence. Nothing to see here.
Trump is beholden to the people who put him into power; the people who did this were people riled up by Trump’s own racist, xenophobic, hatefilled rhetoric, that and outright lies by the likes of Steve Bannon and Breitbart news, which deals in white-supremacist, anti-Semitic hate speech and manipulation through propaganda.
Now Bannon is Trump’s Chief Strategist. We can hope he is benign but all evidence points to . . . ?
To bring this back to Uof M and the hate-fueled crime described in this thread,
- Michigan may still go to Hillary--she's 11K votes short and more votes are being counted;
- Michigan conservative students are now circulating a petition that says that the administration is anti-Trump.
Not clear why anyone would bother sending around a petition like this about any administration and any political leader, frankly. Since this doesn’t make logical sense, it probably makes more emotional sense, that conservatives on campus are feeling strong enough to attempt to get the admin to kowtow in some way to Trump publicly. A bit of chest thumping it seems.
Her current popular vote is 700K more than Trump’s. I wonder if that makes a difference to the students?
Things that I have done since Tuesday: Donated to my favorite charities, including Planned Parenthood. I am heading out today to buy a warm winter coat for one of the needy minority families in my area. I also have decided to participate in the Women’s March in Washington on January 21 and will volunteer on the state level to ensure that women who would like to participate and can’t afford to will be able to. Anyone else going?
I also donated to Planned Parenthood and I did it in honor of our future VP so he would get a little thank you card. PM me if you need his address.
I’m most frightened for Muslims and Mexicans since they were specifically targeted and denounced. Also for our environment which could be irreparably damaged. For women who wear a headscarf, it must be truly frightening. They are usually not marketed as “non-flammable” because that shouldn’t need to be a consideration! I’ve never liked the tradition that dictates women must cover their hair, but if they choose to that is their right.
@Knitkneelionmom, Sadly, I can’t go to the Washington march, but hope to join a local one. I would love to see this a nationwide statement. Hope you tell us here on CC what it was like!
Good idea about donating to PP. I meant to do that even before this year, so thanks for the reminder.