Naked parties at northeast colleges

Parent Cafe
61

<p>Good one, concerneddad. :slight_smile: </p>

<p>I actually didn’t see much encouragement for these activities here from any parent posters, just acknowledged realism that they occur and that, like every other new experience for our kids at college, the KIDS are the ones who are going to have to make the decision whether or not to attend such a function and if they choose to, will have to handle it on their own. This is not unlike many things they’ll have to do while at college, and although I would never encourage any of my Ds to attend such an event, if they did choose to, that is entirely up to them and I would never denigrate their decision to do so. </p>

<p>There seems to be an awful lot of self-righteous posturing here that those parents who object to these parties are somehow ‘better’ parents than those parents who have children who may attend. This is nonsense and offensive, in my opinion. With the amount of time I’ve spent around college age kids, both in my profession and in my personal life, I’d like to make two observations here:</p>

<ol>
<li><p>Anyone who thinks kids aren’t ‘getting naked’ and having sex, whether it’s initiated at a ‘naked party’ or otherwise, has their head in the proverbial sand.</p></li>
<li><p>It is often the case that the parents who protest the most are the ones whose kids are going to be participating in such activities, just like everyone else’s kids. </p></li>
</ol>

<p>A discussion of this topic seems to appear fairly regularly here at CC. I recall posting in a previous one about a couple of family friends whose kids were involved in similar events. One at the U of Chicago in the winter naked run (his mom saw the photo online from the student paper and her son was front and center in all his glory! :)) and another who went to Luther College, a fairly religious school, that had a naked co-ed soccer tournament every spring. These things happen, to some extent, probably at every college campus and the students are the ones who have to make their own decisions as to whether they want to partake or not.</p>

62

<p>

</p>

<p>alwaysamom~</p>

<p>I would respectfully disagree with this statement. To the contrary, it is more often the case that more traditonal parents are made to feel like they are somehow not “with it” by the more “enlightened” ones. </p>

<p>I am under no illusions about my child(ren). I am well aware that they must take responsibility for their own actions and monitor their own behavior, and I fully expect them to be “normal” college students. That said, I <em>will</em> offer them the wisdom and knowledge that I have collected over many years of living. This is called “parenting”, and there is nothing shameful about it IMHO.</p>

<p>I don’t know if you are aware of the “upskirting” phenomenon that seems to be all the rage now. Guys with camera phones or other small video devices are clandestinely placing these devices so that they can take pictures up the skirts of unsuspecting females, and then they are often posting those pics on the internet. There are whole sites devoted to these “collections”.</p>

<p>We live in an age of amazing technology, and that technology can be used in positive or negative ways. Naked party pictures could come back and bite someone in the butt years later. I am not being a prude or demonstrating “corrosive” behavior if I choose to calmly explain this to my children. </p>

<p>I have brought my children up to think in these ways…to examine all of the possible outcomes of their decisions. Not everything that is done in the here and now STAYS in the here and now, especially in this age of technology. I am just asking that my children THINK and consider all of the repercussions before they take part in this sort of activity. If they still should choose to do so, then so be it. </p>

<p>~berurah</p>

63

<p>Personally I cant imagine all the logistics involved in a naked party
do you shave first?
where do all the clothes go?
It can be hard enough to find your coat after a party, what about your underwear? If you are nervous what do you play with if you can’t jingle coins in your pocket?
Do you put makeup on or not?
jewerly?
piercings ( oMG I don’t want to know about everyones piercings)
ending here :eek:</p>

64

<p>“Get your heads out of the gutter, folks. I ran this by my D–she said, these were explicitly not about sex, and there were very specific rules of behavior.”</p>

<p>(Chuckling…)You must be kidding! How can a gathering of naked coeds NOT be about sex? It’s not a matter of one’s head being “in the gutter”. It’s about good old fashioned honesty! To say that these parties are “not about sex” is like holding a meeting in a room that has a full grown elephant in the middle, with the rule being to, “just ignore it”… Easy right? Or like holding your hand over a candle flame and saying, “s’not hot at all!” Saying it’s not about sex doesn’t make it not about sex, no matter how often you say it. Did your D spell out these very “specific rules of behavior”? Did they include NOT staring at the bodies of those around you? Did they specify that male students in particular (who are often EASILY visually aroused) have to leave the party if something—er—“pops up”? I assume touching of any sort is off limits(?). As are, I assume, drugs and alcohol(?). These rules might keep the participants from sexually acting out right then and there, but they are very likely to be sexually arousing (in the same way that you’re likely to want at least a nosh while standing in line at a smorgasbord), and at the very least, probably cause the need for a cold shower afterward. </p>

<p>The “other gatherings that ARE about sex” are just openly bacchanalian. At least that’s honest—not noble, “intellecutally freeing”, or “socially ground-breaking”, but honest. But these naked parties that are “NOT about sex” are just “politically correct” (and blatantly disengenuous) posturings.</p>

<p>College students who didn’t attend strict religious schools (or historically black ones) have been been pushing the envelope of generally acceptable moral behavior for generations. I’m not naive. Most graduate with stories to rehash at reunions and intimate gatherings. But if they were to get seriously introspective about it, they would probably have to admit that they behaved rather immaturly (rebellion for its own sake), that they often didn’t stop to examine their own motivations, nor consider the implications of their actions, that they were just trying to set a new benchmark for “outrageous”, and that they might have made a different decision with the advantage of hindsight. There was nothing noble or intellectual or “ground breaking” about what they did. It was just kids “getting mom and dad’s attention”, flouting authority, or just experiencing the momentary thrill of getting away with something scandelous.</p>

65

<p>Well said, berurah! Wow, someone thinks like I do.</p>

66

<p>FWIW, I’m on the side of “get a grip”. A naked party is not the end of the world. Kids who hook up drunkenly in high school with lots of clothes on and have sex with others who do not love them - now that I can get apocalyptic about. This is because of my political stance. Your opinion on naked parties depends on how you center your morality. It’s political morality vs. personal morality. Is it a crime against society or a victimless crime? Depends on your political stance.</p>

<p>So where I sit, these “naked parties” are more a political act than a moral act. It is a resurfacing of the bohemian meme that shows up in American society with regularity. Notice who is for and against here? Political. And since my morality is not political but personal, I don’t find them immoral. Unless someone was being forced to attend.</p>

<p>Million dollar bet that most of the people for the naked parties vote Democratic and don’t want their girls having sex without love. Million dollar bet that most of the people against the naked parties vote Republican and don’t want their girls having sex without marriage.</p>

<p>Sometimes even I have to call a spade a spade.</p>

<p><em>puts on asbestos hood, covers head with arms, runs out the door as fast as possible</em></p>

67

<p>berurah, I guess, as in many things, it’s all a matter of perspective. :)Comments such as these are what caused me to reply:</p>

<p>“Hey y’all, it’s <em>O.K.</em> to be a PARENT, to DISAPPROVE, to offer guridance, to offer the benefit of your years of life experience for your child’s benefit! Don’t worry, they’ll still respect you…probably even moreso.”</p>

<p>That implies that those whose children attend, do NOT do all those things. It’s a bit patronizing. My point was that these kids are young adults who are making their own decisions, and this is how it should be. If we’ve been good parents, our kids should be pretty well versed on what we approve or disapprove of, and they certainly have experienced our guidance. This isn’t to imply, in any way, that our job as parents is over, it isn’t. However, our job has changed once they reach college age.</p>

<p>“Being a real parent can’t be all that bad.”</p>

<p>Again, an implication that you’re not a real parent unless you express disapproval at specific behaviors. </p>

<p>I’m very well aware what “parenting” is, I’ve been doing it for 24 years! I didn’t see anyone say anything about sharing parental wisdom and experience being “shameful”. I agree that we should share our views with our children but, in the end, it is their decision to make when it comes to behavior, in any situation, when they become young adults. No one is asking that you apologize for your ‘traditional’ approach, everyone has their own way of parenting, and heaven knows we all need all the help we can get. I just don’t think that it does anyone any good to put on the -‘I’m a better parent than so-and-so because I’m more protective and I disapprove of kids doing such-and-such kinds of things’- hat. This isn’t specific to this discussion but it does seem to come up whenever such discussions take place, in my experience. There was a similar discussion in the musical theatre forum some time ago when someone raised the issue of how people thought about their sons and daughters having to perform naked onstage someday. Nudity always seems to be a flashpoint issue, for many. I guess, in the end, I try to appreciate everyone’s point of view and realize that, although I cannot imagine ever attending a ‘naked party’, even when I was in college, which was back in the dark ages, I can understand why some kids might find it perfectly ok, and ultimately, I want my kids, and those I counsel, to make intelligent and rational decisions which are right for THEM. Preparing our kids to be in a position to make their own decisions seems to me to be one of the most important jobs we have as parents.</p>

68

<p>Whatever became of just setting them free in the forest and having wolves adopt and raise them?</p>

69

<p>

</p>

<p>alwaysamom~</p>

<p>Well, it seems that we definitely agree on the above statement. Even with my college son, though, I still help him examine the possible consequences of his choices. I am an adult, and <em>I</em> still ask people for advice all the time. </p>

<p>I certainly didn’t mean to come off as arrogant or superior, and I apologize if I did so. I guess I am just frustrated with some of the things I see around me. I know several parents who are literally SCARED of their children. They kowtow to their kids and fall all over themselves indulging their kid’s every whim. They are afraid to ever correct them or to offer well-considered advice.</p>

<p>I have no problem if someone decides to attend a naked party after having considered the risks and benefits of his actions. I DO take issue with ONLY giving approval without at least contemplating the possible negative repercussions. And yes, I would actively discourage my kids from doing this because I happen to think that the risks of a naked party outweigh the benefits. However, that doesn’t mean that I think that my kids will always listen to me, nor does it mean that I will love or care for them any less if they don’t take my advice. In the end, their lives are their own. But I do consider it my job to help them make those lives as happy and successful as possible and to protect them to the best of my ability as a parent.</p>

<p>~berurah</p>

70

<p>

</p>

<p>alumother~</p>

<p>You would be wrong in my case ;).</p>

<p>Also, no need for the asbestos suit…I actually haven’t noticed any blowtorches in this particular thread. Only reasonable and rational differences of opinion! :)</p>

<p>~berurah</p>

71

<p>PH–gee, you used to be such a nice guy. I’m not gonna bother arguing; you know what you think; why confuse you with real experience?</p>

<p>Thank you, Alumother–I think that, overall, your analysis is dead-on.</p>

<p>By the way, I believe they had the first snowfall in Princeton…;)</p>

72

<p>I remember an incident circa 1972, in which my two cousins, age 22 or so, stopped by the house after streaking through the city park with 1000 other youngins. My conservative parents did not ‘encourage’ them, nor did condemn them --or make the leap to ‘upskirting’ or wanton sex. They were more concerned about what happened to the streakers who were trampled by police horses.</p>

<p>My sons do not have photo mobiles so I doubt they are upskirting–and I wouldn’t guess that would be part of their interest in the opposite sex. Of course, my motto is, Never Say Never. That behavior would get the sledgehammer from mom whereas one-off naked streaking or swimming or partying might not. </p>

<p>Realistically, if someone invites my boys to a naked coed party, my bet is that they would be there in a heartbeat. I don’t think mom would ever hear about it. Thank God! Nevermind wanton sex or upskirting or strip clubs, these are boys and boys are quite keen to see live naked women.</p>

<p>Heck, if someone invited my H to a naked coed party I’d be in trouble…</p>

<p>However, if I found out that googly-eyed sons or husband were making a habit of naked coed parties, then more stringent advice/action might be warranted–along with my usual advice that habits of casual sex will make it very hard to stay married in later life. </p>

<p>There is middle ground in this debate. Don’t you think there is a difference between realistic expectations and ‘encouragement’, b? It is a tricky line to walk–not so much for naked parties but birth/disease control.</p>

73

<p>Sure, cheers, the line is tricky. I think that all of our children will do their share of typical kid things regardless of our “encouragement” or lack thereof. I wish I could make my position more clear. I am SO not a repressive parent…in fact, both my oldest son’s gf and my oldest daughter’s bf stay over at our home ALL the time. And I am NOT in denial about their attitudes or their activities. In this PARTICULAR case of naked parties on a college campus with the alcohol flowing, I am just not in favor, and I just can’t apologize for that. Again, this does NOT mean that I would think less of my children (or anyone else’s) if they chose to partake…it just means that I would attempt to exert my (possibly futile) influence to make sure they were well aware of what the possible repercussions MIGHT be…not WILL be…MIGHT be.</p>

<p>~berurah</p>

74

<p>Editorial cut-and-pasted from the Pomona Student Newspaper, re: “Oct 2005 Foam 5/C party at Harvey Mudd”</p>

<hr>

<p>Party Crosses Into Dangerous Territory </p>

<p>By The Editorial Board</p>

<p>Last weekend, 5-C party planners followed in the footsteps of the great European dance clubs and held a foam party at Harvey Mudd. Complete with bad hip-hop and flashing lights, the party featured two foam machines spilling out gallons of suds from a second floor balcony onto crowds of eager students below. </p>

<p>Though every college party features some degree of debauchery and delinquency, the Mudd foam party event went above and beyond the normal standard, crossing the line and becoming dangerous. </p>

<p>The danger began for many partygoers as they stood in line. At one point during the night, the line stood so tightly packed that people could not keep their balance as it moved, resulting in a veritable stampede. Students were flung to the ground as the volume of the line pushed over a fence, and many entered the party nursing trampled limbs or twisted ankles. The single Campus Safety officer at the entrance was too overwhelmed to deal with the crisis, allowing students to flood into the event without so much as presenting a student ID-card. </p>

<p>Though as the night wore on more security officers arrived, the lack of control at the onset of the party is disheartening and worrisome. Campus Safety needs to be prepared for the volume of students attending such functions. No student should enter a party feeling unsafe, much less injured from standing in line. </p>

<p>The party itself presented an entirely new set of problems. Like the line, the dance-floor was packed with revelers, but with an added layer of sludge from the foam. This problem, though unpleasant, is unavoidable at a event centered around foam—more worrisome to this paper is what was happening amongst the suds. As people slipped and slid their way towards the center of the crowd, many students were witnesses to numerous couples having sex on the dance floor. As one student wisely said, “We should be handing out condoms.” </p>

<p>At a school where there are numerous organizations promoting safe sex and educating students about safe sexual practices, it is surprising, to say the least, to see couples having sex in public, on a filthy dance floor, surrounded by hundreds of other students. </p>

<p>One couple performed the deed twice, as others danced around them. The female student didn’t even notice when she was hit in the head by an enthusiastic partier, and the male student proceeded to vomit all over the floor minutes later. This slop of foam, mud, vomit and other bodily fluids was hardly a healthy environment to stand in, much less to get naked and roll around in.</p>

75

<p>So this is not the naked party that was described previously. Nobody would want anyone’s kids at the event described above. Immoral or not it sounds simply dangerous to emotional and physical health.</p>

<p>This happened at Harvey Mudd? The engineering school? What is the world coming to…</p>

<p>And yes, they had the first snowfall at Princeton. The nude Olympics have been banned. But some kids from Ivy, that most staid of institutions, still ran out naked in the snow. My D kept her clothes on. </p>

<p>If she wanted to run naked in the snow, and her friends were doing so, and there was no alcohol involved, so be it. If she wanted to go to a party where kids had sex on the floor in the mud in front of a large group, um, thinking I have no problem telling her that’s a stupid idea.</p>

<p>I agree, Beururah, that there are parents afraid of their kids and trying too hard to be pals. But it’s also possible to be very good at saying No and still be one to tell their kid, “If you want to go to a party in a safe and polite space where everyone is naked and feeling daring and pushing societal boundaries but not getting crazy drunk and having sex in the mud - I trust you.” That decision is a question of one’s political identity, as I said previously.</p>

76

<p>Justaparent,</p>

<p>Re: Are Naked Parties about Sex</p>

<p>I only hope there will not be…

</p>

77

<p>So what if naked parties are about sex? Isn’t part of the college years engaging activities in that you aren’t going to engage in when you graduate?</p>

<p>Letting go is also an important concept. These students are growing up. It’s their lives.</p>

78

<p>The thing I warn my Ds, and any other kids who will listen, about appearing naked in public is not the risk wanton sex breaking out. I warn them that someone will be at the event with a camera, a video recorder, a video cell phone, or what not, taking pictures of the whole thing. And the next day they will appear somewhere on the internet in all their naked glory for everyone to see. And these pictures will circulate on-line for YEARS - forever memorializing their moment of youthful thoughtlessness in a sort of cheap version of Girls Gone Wild.</p>

79

<p>WW, let’s not be disingenuous here. The parties being discussed initially and the reported foam parties seem to me to be very different types of events. It’s interesting that what transpired at the foam party at HM is much more problematic behavior than probably is likely to occur at the aforementioned naked parties, and yet, by many, initially anyway, would seem more innocuous simply because the participants didn’t start off the evening sans clothes.</p>

80

<p>

</p>

<p>This, perhaps, strikes to the heart of the issue. I agree wholeheartedly with Cheer’s post. I don’t think that anyone here can doubt that the college years are, along with great intellectual experimentation, a time of sexual experimentation. Garland speaks of her daughter in this thread, and I have no reason to doubt a word of what she is saying. I have always found her posts interesting and happily lacking in artifice. I could easily believe there are girls (women) out there, beyond her daughter, who could view naked men and women as an intellectual or cultural exercise and experience of demystification (though I am not quite clear on why that would necessarily be a good thing). However, I, having been condemned to manhood, cannot fully expect that many 18-21 year old boys will enter a room full of naked womem dispassionately enough to be “Demystified.” </p>

<p>How many female posters in ccLand believe that their husbands/boy friends, son’s, male co-workers would be likely to experience such a party as “enlightening” or simply liberating, releasing them from the shackles of mundane Eros in a dispassionate attempt to “see…if it can be demystified, a bit”? That is, hanging with naked women for a night-time party, without a strong sense of Eros.</p>

<p>I have little doubt that the female of my two children could attend such a “gathering” of naked bodies as an analyst, even a sage; however, the male would likely have different motivations, ideas and ends in mind (in about 5 years).</p>

<p>Really, it is an offense to common sense to suggest boys, between 18-21 years of age, will be dispassionate in a room full of naked women. </p>

<p>……………………………….
Dstark, your frank consistency is, as always, much appreciated…really.</p>