I agree that most attorneys are good about referring other good colleagues, especially if they’re too busy and job is time sensitive.
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Every lawyer in my town knows who the “too busy to care” or “not busy because I’m a quack” lawyers are. And my last jury duty (a medical malpractice case) I saw one of the “reputed quacks” front and center. You felt sorry for his client- who probably got a modest offer to settle but refused it hoping for the big “kaching” which was never going to happen based on their evidence.
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When my mom moved to her CCRC, she wasn’t ready to give up her house. But she was ready pretty soon after. She was in her community though and not moving cities
If mil wants to spend time in her town, it would be much easier to rent an Airbnb, stay with her daughter or friends. Because as others have said, spending time in her house will be difficult considering the logistics.
The bigger issue imo, is paring down the stuff in the house and getting it ready to sell. Downsizing is hard! Paring down your stuff, difficult. Probably part of the reason she’s saying now that she will keep her house. The unknown and the sheer number of things that need to be done is overwhelming.
I think it’s fine to keep the house. Everything having to happen right now is more concerning. The end of October is 6 weeks away. It’s not that long.
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Just to be clear, my earlier comments do not mean that I think Bob should share in the expenses of MIL’s home if married. It likely is best (as Hoggirl also thinks) that her home is in her name and will be left to her family in her will.
I was just saying that it didn’t seem equitable, and that Bob is the one to gain advantage financially if they marry, that MIL buys into CRCC (OK, that seems needed) but also pays 50% of the monthly fees, not just the additional person fee which is less. Bob benefits with a discount on what he currently pays per month and doesn’t have to pay 50/50 on the home where he claims they will spend half their time (not saying he should pay toward MIL’s home). But the overall essence doesn’t seem equal.
I also hope your hubby can insist on finding out the time frame of the nuptials because he is helping her with the financial arrangements to put in place that are involved, plus getting legal help with the prenup (which I believe MIL agrees to get). It should not be a secret to her son at this point given his assistance.
Again, I have no problem with your MIL wanting to live with her new partner, but find the rush nature to marry problematic and unwise and see no cons to allowing more time. She can even spend a couple weeks there in the meantime and feel it all out. Rushing seems to have no benefits in my view, not that I matter, LOL.
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As an example of a time frame (I realize everyone is different!), I shared here that my FIL, who is 99 years old remarried two years ago at age 97. His new wife is currently 93. They knew one another when both couples were married, before their spouses died.
After some courting, new wife moved into FIL’s single family home that he raised his kids in. Eventually, they moved to a retirement community. They still were not married. I don’t know the total number of years they were a couple and living together before they wed, but venture to say likely at least 3. Again, they lived in the retirement community as a couple before they wed.
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Like others, I feel like MIL is not getting a good deal. I admit to having something of a “fair bone” in me, so the imbalance feels plain wrong. Having said that, I grew up with a dad who just didn’t care about this kind of stuff in his own life. He always felt like it’d come out in the wash. While he didn’t express it this way, the emotional energy that went into maintaining personal justice destroyed happiness and compromised relationships. For the most part, the energy around him was always very positive. (It also occasionally put those around him into the unhappy role of enforcer or at least of being more criticalof people.)
I worry that Bob is a taker, and the process of hammering out the pre-nup may make his motives clearer to all. So yes, super important! But perhaps MIL has something of my dad in her too and places a higher value on harmony/companionship than fairness so doesn’t really care if she’s taken advantage of. This isn’t to say those around her shouldn’t try to persuade her (because it’s easier for you to imagine this couple not being together, and if she predeceases him, the consequences will be borne by you) but that arguments about fairness may not resonate so much with her.
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Okay, hive mind. Please give me some advice.
Dh is picking me up after work and we are going to Bob’s house at the CCRC for drinks and nibbles and then driving them for all of us to go out to dinner. Their treat.
Do I bring up these nuptials? I don’t think I can sincerely muster up a hearty, “Congratulations!” or, “Best Wishes!” Do I wait for mil to bring it up? I mean she has to know I know. Going to be hard for me not to say, “Have you set a date?” but I know they aren’t sharing that. I guess if she tells me, I can say, “It will be nice having you here in __________ so we can see you more often.” ??
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I’d let your mil bring it up.
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This never came up at the finance meeting with the CCRC your dh attended?
Don’t bring up the topic until one of them does.
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I would just encourage you ALL to not tip toe. You are family. I don’t think in you will be blunt but I think you - in conversation - should not hesitate to make conversations to get information but to NOT make it an inquisition.
Look for those windows of conversation to ask follow up questions. You all should leave the restaurant with new info about each other - that is how we get to know each other !
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You mean the date for the wedding? Or a move in date? Or a sign the contract date? Not to my knowledge.
She has only said, “Sooner rather than later,” over and over again.
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Go with “move in date”.
If your MIL is getting cold feet over the marriage, don’t push her deeper into Bob’s plan by assuming that it’s a given that they are getting married. And I think it’s fine to express- in a breezy, loving tone “Gosh mom, we’ve got a lot of things to take care of, why don’t we find time to make a list of the logistical stuff” with your H chiming in “I want to run some numbers to make sure we finance the buy-in in the most tax-efficient way possible, so let’s have time just the two of us to review some data, OK?”
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Ooo - I like focusing on the move-in date. Good idea!
Dh has already talked to her about where to pull cash from so as not to trigger unintended tax consequences. I don’t think the buy-in is, “financed,” as I think of that term. It’s cash up front.
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Upthread, someone mentioned that you should just pay the 1500 to stay with Bob. Also, I wouldn’t have him share the expenses of her house other than sharing cost of food, electricity, and water. If repairs need to be done that should fall on her., obviously unless it’s something that Bob did. I’m thinking major things like moving a tree, fixing gutters, or even a new roof.
If this relationship does not work out, she will be very happy to return to her house, her friends, and her neighborhood”
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Your MIL may just be assuming “I can afford this”. Which she can.
Which is different from her looking at the spreadsheet of her assets and working with your H to decide what gets sold to pay the upfront buy in, and then deciding what gets sold on a monthly or quarterly basis to pay her share of the CCRC fees.
It may not have occurred to her (yet) that she needs money to maintain her current house (maintenance, taxes, utilities- every single month, even when empty, cable TV/internet if she has, etc.) AND a fresh infusion of cash to pay her share of the fees.
Staring at the page can be a brutal reality check. She can afford all of this. But your H is going to have to come up with the nut every single month, which means selling/liquidating assets. Let her sit with that.
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I’m sure much of that hasn’t occurred to her, but it has occurred to my dh.
She will obviously have to pay the $109k buy-in that will clearly be a reduction in her assets. Otherwise, her annual cash flow, even after taxes, will cover both the CCRC fees of $3,600 per month plus the cost of her maintaining her home. And then some. Now, if they do significant travel, spending down her assets will come into play
She has continued to build wealth even in retirement. That will certainly stop with this decision, but she really doesn’t have to go into her principle except for the buy-in.
I think many people here must be from high cost of living places.
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I would not bring the subject of marriage up. If they want to discuss that…THEY will bring it up.
WRT finances…your MIL sounds like her finances are very sound regardless of what she does. Which is wonderful. She isn’t exactly a spring chicken…and She can’t take it with her, and really, it’s her money to spend as she chooses. I’d be careful not to imply anything that relates to inheritances, for example. Just my opinion.
I think your DH helping her to make sure her finances continue to be as stable as possible is the right thing.
And if all of this works out well…I hope she does have the chance to do some more travel (although if all Bob wants to is sail across the Atlantic again…I’d wonder about that).
Enjoy your dinner tonight. My guess is MIL is at least as nervous bout this as you and your DH are. So…try to have fun!
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From urban Northeast. Had parents in assisted living in three different places (including a big city in the Midwest). Costs escalated rapidly in all three places. You are VERY lucky that finances won’t be taking a major hit!
One parent went from about 8K per month (place with no buy-in) to over 25K per month in 60 days. That’s why I’m so insistent about reading the fine print on the contract. Physician said “OK to discharge from hospital directly to assisted living and resume normal activities”. Didn’t even need rehab. Hospital social worker reported that the AL refused to accept resident back in her own apartment without 24/7 care “for as long as we deem it necessary”. Family assumed that meant a CNA or some sort of aide- no. Billed for an RN- 24/7, plus three meals a day for said RN.
It’s a blessing you don’t have to sharpen your pencils….but these places get really aggressive (they claim it’s risk management) on ancillary charges. And they can overrule the cardiologist on how much care is required? Yes they can.
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I appreciate your sharing your cautionary experiences.
I’m sure this place is no different in those areas.
Her mind is made up. We can only do the best we can do. Sigh
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