D has applied to 4 schools with EA deadlines of Nov. 1. One teacher LOR still has not been uploaded to Naviance as of this morning. Not happy. :-w
D will check in with her GC this morning. I will let her handle it.
On another note, one of D’s friends was in tears because her parents just figured out that they are full pay for the schools their daughter wants to attend and they can’t/won’t do full pay. The GC makes parents sign a form that says that all colleges are affordable options when the student submits the finalized college list to the school. This was over a month ago and they just figure this out now? Well, better now than in March, I suppose.
So I ask D what her friend is going to do. She’s still going to apply “just to see” and the parents tell her that if she gets into an Ivy they will “make it work somehow.” Sigh…
Happily D’s friend already has an acceptance to ASU in hand and has the stats for a tuition scholarship and the Barrett Honors College so she won’t be without options. Still, I anticipate many painful conversations next Spring should the girl get into an elite private school at full pay.
@littleray@greeny8 I spent sometime yesterday looking for no fee, no supplement schools staring at CommonApp Requirement Grid. :-? :))
Found one DS could reuse his current supplement :)) not sure we should do it though ;
Some folks have no idea how much they will have to pay until they get the rude awakening of their FAFSA EFC number. People should have a general sense, but many have expectations of big financial aid dollars. Unfortunately, the donut hole is huge and growing.
@mamaedefamilia — sad. Up until last year that was. Assuming it wasn’t going to be bad; plugging our fingers in our ears and not really sitting down to educate ourselves. Soooo thankful for the surgery last spring that forced me to sit and have tons of time to hit Google, find CC and start researching.
The forums are going to be full of kids just like the one you described come spring.
@carachel2 Full disclosure, that was us, too! But we figured out the error of our ways early in the fall of D’s junior year and had time to readjust expectations. Thank you, CC!
I can understand reluctance to to run those numbers and confront the rude awakening of how much it will cost. But after the wake up call, to continue to allow your kid to apply to schools that you know aren’t affordable seems like a very bad idea. This girl would be eligible for merit at many places that share qualities with her unaffordable “dream” schools. I hope that the GC can point this family in a different direction while there is still time.
@carachel2 I am not sure how the kids are getting the skip day excused. Our school doesn’t require verification from the college - however it does require a permission slip signed in advance from all 7 of the students teachers and the GC. So I would think at least one of those people would refuse to approve if the majority of the Sr. are asking for the same day off. (of course if they all ask at various times well in advance it may not be as noticeable)
Honestly I would guess most of them just take the unexcused absence. And my guess it a lot more sr. actually don’t skip then my D lets on (although her text to me this morning was “whatever this is so stupid nobody is freaking here and im just in a bad mood”
@mamaedefamilia and others - Still NO LOR uploaded to CA today (at least one of her schools has a 11/1 deadline. I begged her to go talk to the GC at school about it today. But from her response (above) I am not sure it is going to happen. I am really focusing on the Serenity Prayer when it comes to college acceptances right now.
@STEM2017 I don’t even think finding out your EFC is stopping many parents from forging ahead with schools that are unaffordable. Just a lack of understanding in most cases, I think. Some just sticking their head in the sand, too, of course.
@carachel2 So, you credit your surgery for forcing you into spending time on CC last year. What’s your excuse now? =))
We live in an area where many families can afford being full pay (as well as many who can’t). And, there are also a lot of smart kids (no surprise. Lots of privileged kids). Makes it hard for those who either can’t, or choose not to be full pay, but have smarties.
It is sad not figuring out the finances first - makes it tough on the kids. However, I also think a lot of parents are told - “apply and see what happens” - maybe they are hoping for scholarships/merit aid.
QOTD: I hate the saying, but are you a believer in a kid having ‘skin in the game’? Will you have your kid take out student loans, even if you may be able to cover the loan amount in your budget, too (i.e., even if they don’t need the loan)?
In our case, we have a budget. Our thought right now is that if a schools is ‘within’ budget, then no loan. If it’s over budget, but the $5K (or whatever) student loan can cover the difference, then that is on her. Her choice. Hopefully, in the end, we can eventually pay off her loan as some sort of present…or not.
I’m toying with her taking the loan, anyway. I assume if they are paid off after graduation, it helps with credit rating? (I’m talking about the unsubsidized student loan)
I am a believer, however, since I already told my kid “we got this” so therein lies my dilemma. I’ve heard that 5K is a good number to expect your kids to contribute, however, I know D will be extremely active without a job and unless she has a job, well, how will she pay 400/month? My thinking at this moment, is that it’s a huge transition. She may decide on her own to get a job if she feels she has the time - to pay for incidentals, entertainment, etc. (she does that now). So perhaps I will wait and see how the first year goes.
And I think taking a loan out would help with credit - good point. I did add D to my credit card this year and since it’s in her name and she had to fill out an app, I think that would help with credit as well.
"Skin in the game" No. Our kids are fully aware of the sacrifice we are making to pay what we can. They also know that college is their developing their skills for their future. All of our college kids have been honors students in college and not one has had to take out a loan.
This Dd may end up with her loans if she decides to go to the highest cost school on her list. It is just beyond our ability to pay unless she wins one of their top scholarships. She will only have loans if that is a decision she makes.
QOTD: since I was fortunate enough for my parents to pay for my college I want to do the same for my children. I can afford it but I did tell my D17 that if she picks a college that costs 65,000 a year, she will have to pay for certain things like sororities, car on campus etc.
@hadmeathello - We are taking the same tact. We have a college fund that we started when DS was born. 2007 brutalized that fund but it has bounced back somewhat. So there is a chunk of money there that is earmarked for College (or trade school, or whatever else). We also plan to continue to contribute our monthly to the college fund so it will continue to grow over the next 5 years. I expect him to save money this summer for college. When it comes time to go, we will also pay on a monthly basis. So we have a total amount of X. Anything beyond X will have to be scholarship or loan. That is his choice. We will help with the loan after graduation but there is no guarantee.
I have this on a spreadsheet with the COA and scholarship. It will show what 4 years of debt will look like for him.
Hopefully that will encourage him to complete his degree in 4 years with a dicipline that will allow him to pay back loans!
@Mom2aphysicsgeek You are very lucky. I think it really depends though on the student’s understanding of $$ - some have no concept of what things cost until they live on their own. I certainly didn’t at that age. I had no clue the value of a dollar. Some kids do, some don’t. Some kids waste 50K of their parents’ money in the first year. If they had to contribute toward that, maybe they wouldn’t have.
That being said, I’m in your shoes - I told my D the same thing - I will/have sacrificed and I will pay. I also do things to try to get her to learn the value of a dollar at the same time in other ways. It’s a very interesting philosophical question though - will kids study harder if they are paying for it?
"Skin in the game": I go back and forth on this. We probably will have our kids take out student loans (but no loans beyond the Stafford); if we’re able to, we may quietly pay all or part of them as a graduation gift, but we’d figure that out at the time. Also: there’s a cashflow element, you know? For something like education, being able to stretch a smallish amount of it out for a while is a good thing, I think.
Halloween report: First trick-or-treaters just shy of 6:00p, 10 pounds of candy given out by 7:34p following my usual rule: If you’re a little kid, you get about six “fun size” (how’s that for an evil, evil marketing euphemism?) pieces, tweens get a little less, and if you’re old enough that you’re (if male) sporting a 5-o’clock shadow, you get two.
Stresses: D17 hasn’t been feeling entirely well lately—there’s a virus going around, I’m pretty sure she’s caught it but doesn’t have it badly enough to admit she’s actually sick, not to mention entering the dark time of the year—and had a bit of a freak-out that she’s not going to get into college anywhere and she’ll never be a success at anything and so forth. I had to talk her down for a bit between handing out candy; interestingly, it really appears that she’d been discounting the importance of having already gotten two acceptances (plus scholarships making them quite affordable) because they’re already there, and so they don’t count—it’s like she was unwilling to grant herself any security for fear that that would get her to slack off too much. I think I succeeded in getting her to realize that’s not an entirely healthy way of looking at things and that she needs to enjoy what she has, but we’ll see.
Application annoyances: My daughter has a fee waiver to one of the EA schools she applied to. An automated message came to both her and me overnight that she needs to pay her application fee before they can review the application. The Common App interface apparently understood that there was a fee waiver (since it didn’t ask for payment), so why can’t the school itself?
QOTD: I’ve always felt that a $20,000 student loan upon graduation will keep him honest and organized. If all goes as planned (it rarely does) he should graduate with an engineering degree and job making enough to cover the monthly payment.
QOTD D only has 4 schools on her list because of her major constraints. She knows we can/will pay the COA of our state flagship (not one of the 4). With auto merit, one school is down to room & board. The costs for other 3 are up in the air—within $5 K with highest base merit for 2, only affordable with the two highest merit scholarships at the third.
D will be working for the govt or an NGO after graduation. She does not want to take any loans because her future earnings will be on the lower side, at least starting out. Her current favorite is one of the up-in-the-air schools. She may need to make a very difficult decision this spring.
