Please chance me for mid-sized T20 schools and help me pick my ED/REA!

Chance Me / Match Me
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This is a combined chance me/match me thread. Still trying to decide on early round, so that’s where the match me comes in. Thanks!

Demographics

  • US Citizen
  • State/Location of residency: New England
  • Type of high school (or current college for transfers): Public
  • Other special factors: Legacy at Harvard, Yale, Duke, and Rice

Cost Constraints / Budget
Parents say budget is not a concern.

Intended Major(s)
Environmental Science and Biology

GPA, Rank, and Test Scores

  • Unweighted HS GPA: 4.0 (all As)
  • Weighted HS GPA: N/A
  • Class Rank: N/A
  • ACT/SAT Scores: 36

List your HS coursework

(Indicate advanced level, such as AP, IB, AICE, A-level, or college, courses as well as specifics in each subject)
3 APs junior year — all 5s
5 APs senior year — unknown

Awards
Only really have school/city awards and National Merit

Extracurriculars
(Include leadership, summer activities, competitions, volunteering, and work experience)
Leading sustainability projects in school, stable long-term job, tutoring, one research and two non-research internships, organizing school events, leading two clubs, etc.

Essays/LORs/Other
No supplemental LORs but pretty strong teacher LORs

Schools
(List of colleges by your initial chance estimate; designate if applying ED/EA/RD; if unsure, leave them unclassified)

Still unsure where I’m EDing/REAing — recommendations appreciated! Would love advice on odds at the Ivies and mid-sized T20 schools. Will also be applying to some state schools.

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If you don’t have a clear favorite, it’s really, really, really OK to apply RD and make a decision in April once you have your options identified. Honest.

What’s the point of “chancing” you for Dartmouth if you hate the cold and snow, or encouraging you to apply early to Stanford if you don’t want to be a plane ride away from home?

Tell us what you want in a college. Tell us what you DON’T want. And you really don’t need to “pick” your ED school. ED is for your absolute favorite, “I’d go here with no second thoughts” college and it’s really OK not to have that college by October.

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Thank you! That’s really great advice, and I’m definitely contemplating just RDing or REAing. I do love Brown, so that’s the main school I’m considering EDing to.

In general, I want an academically rigorous mid-sized school with a strong ecology program. Ideally located in the suburbs or a small city, preferably close-ish to or in New England? But I don’t mind the south or midwest.

I dislike Greek life, and I hope to find a supportive and (mostly) grounded student body. I was turned off when touring Harvard because of the student body.

I want a school that will prepare me well for grad school, ideally with good research opportunities and access to internships.

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Brown sounds like a good choice. Would you also consider Wesleyan?

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No. Seriously, no.

If you don’t have an absolute favorite based on your own priorities for the next four years of your life — a place where you will live and study — you should not ED. You cannot outsource this choice.

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I’m looking into Wesleyan for an RD. My main concern is that it might be slightly too small for my taste because I go to a bigger high school, but it’s definitely in the running

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Do you think it’s a better idea to REA at somewhere like Yale, or to go all-in for the regular round? I’ve toured Brown twice now and it’s 100% perfect for me in terms of student body/campus, but it’s not quite as good in my major as a school like Duke or Yale. I do think waiting for the regular round makes a lot of sense

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My advice is simple: there is an opportunity cost to ED and REA. The willingness to pay that opportunity cost is up to the individual. Your best chances for a successful academic career are dependent on finding the environment where you will thrive. I cannot believe that the narrow slices of ranking difference between your top options will matter more than that.

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Can you imagine yourself being reasonably happy at your state’s flagship u?

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Then this is probably the school you should ED too, if you decide to ED at all.

You have only asked about reach schools and chances and well…they are all reaches/low probability. This could be true of the state schools you mentioned.

Do you have at least one affordable highly likely admit? There are many schools with great environmental science or biology programs that prepare you well for grad school and are not reaches…you should spend some time identifying these schools to flesh out your list. I would encourage you to limit reach apps to a max of five.

Make sure to make all EA deadlines for schools on your list that offer that round (as long as that is ok if you choose to apply restricted EA somewhere.)

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I will echo others and say you should not ED at Brown, or anywhere else, unless you are SURE you would not pick an offer from any other school over Brown. And it sounds like you are not quite there yet, and that is fine. For what it is worth, Brown explicitly says you should not think your chances would be higher in ED, so you can take them at their word that you are not somehow missing some strategic advantage by making such a decision.

REA/SCEA is a lot less high stakes, of course. Like it does sound to me like Yale is at least a relatively good fit for you. So suppose you get into Yale SCEA. That doesn’t mean you have to stop applying to Brown RD. But you can stop applying to any other college you would not plausibly choose over Yale. And that might well save you a lot of unnecessary applications. So that to me makes sense in more scenarios, although it isn’t a big deal either way.

OK, then you see where you actually get admitted, and maybe if you get merit or honors offers, and maybe revisit a short list, and then make a choice.

And like others again, to make sure you really have a good set of options at that stage, I would urge you to have a good list of Likelies and Targets, not just Reaches. Indeed, at least properly defined, most people who apply to a robust list end up at a Target. So that is where a lot of the real action is–your favorite Reaches may be fairly obvious, but you may have more choices for Targets, so you can really dig in and find Targets you would be particularly excited about.

And again, maybe you get into an REA/SCEA school and can cut most of those. But maybe not, and then you are well-prepared to get some exciting RD offers to consider.

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I concur. In my view, it makes sense for the applicant to apply to the school that they know they would choose above all others if they are putting in an ED app because it’s a commitment. If the student is accepted, the student might always wonder what if they had been accepted at the other school?

REA seems to be the way to go here and one of the choices mentioned was Yale which also holds the advantage of being one of the schools for which @sugarcookie17 is a legacy. Seems a logical choice unless the student has already considered all of this, has already come to the same conclusion and yet is hesitating because Brown is really the school the student actually does love most but does really want the boost that legacy provides. Also possibly the legacies in the family might not be as supportive of an early app at a non-legacy school as they would just be throwing away that legacy boost during the possible boost of an early application period. That may be why Duke was also mentioned as it has the program along with Yale, it also might have an ED boost and there is the legacy boost there that isn’t available at Brown. If this is the case and Brown is truly the favorite, then the EDing to Duke should be out as that would mean Brown can never be in consideration if the student were accepted while REA’ing to Yale without a commitment to attend would still allow an RD app to Brown, especially as the latter school has stated that there is no boost in applying early.

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just an FYI, many schools (not sure about these) only count parents undergrad as legacy - not sure if you are talking about parents+step parents undergrads or biological parents + their grad degrees. Grad degrees may or may not help you at all depending on school.

For chancing I would want to know if you are taking highest level of courses offered and context of your HS a bit more… If most kids are taking 12 APs (and this is obvious from school profile), then 8 isn’t super impressive (though good!). If your school only allows 7 APs and you get special permission to take 8, that is different. Are you in BC calc or highest level math offered? etc etc. Basically if you are highest rigor offered and have all As AND a 36 you are definitely in the mix pretty much any where.

Also, I applied ED because I was very confident there would be no “what ifs” later…turned out to be true. If you are sure you would not think 2x about other schools if you get into Brown, then ED brown. I am curious if Yale or Duke really has THAT much difference in their progams…(possibly). Also I am a bit surprised if you love Brown and like Wesleyan that Duke pops to top of a list. (Yale fits more into that mix to me, than Duke from people I know that have looked at all of them).

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Given your affinity for Brown and your desire for academic rigor, grad school prep, and no Greek life, I’d add Grinnell to your list of schools to explore. I realize it’s smaller, but is possibly a good fit in many ways. They also have the Conard Environmental Research Area.

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I’m primary legacy at Yale and Duke and have connections + a parent who went to grad school to Harvard. Two of my grandparents went to Rice, so I’m secondary there (and I don’t know if other relatives count for secondary legacy, but an aunt went to Cornell? We’ve never spoken but I’ll take advantage of what I can get lol).

Many APs are offered, but you can’t take them as an underclassman. You can fit maximum 9-10 AP courses, and you’d need special permission to do that — the most I’ve ever heard of is 9. There are also a handful of kids at my school who self-study or take extra courses. Last year, I took APUSH, Lang, and Statistics. This year, I’m taking Calc BC, Biology, Literature, French, and Psychology.

Yale and Duke have significantly better programs in ecology than Brown, but Brown has great environmental science. I loved the Duke campus/offerings/etc, but I am concerned that I wouldn’t fit in well with the student body, and I dislike the Greek influence. Brown and Yale are much higher on my list.

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Thanks, I’ll check it out! I honestly haven’t done much research on it so far.

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I am 99% Harvard only counts parents who went to Harvard College (the main undergrad program) towards a legacy bump… Going to HKS or HMS doesn’t help you, sadly. I am not up on the other ones… I think it may be the same at Yale (I suspect Duke is more forgiving but don’t know that).

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My understanding is that Duke still gives legacies a significant bump in ED. Alumni Admissions | Duke

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