S lied about having part-time job

Parents Forum
41

<p>The fact that he KNEW that he didn’t have a job…and therefore he KNEW that he wasn’t going to have the money to pay you back for the concern tix is another serious issue. This goes waaaaay beyond anything else that has been discussed. It suggests an inability to have any foresight at all of any obvious consequences that will soon be coming around the corner. It is an obvious display of gross impulsiveness. </p>

<p>After all, if you hadn’t found out about the lack of a job, what would have happened when you asked to be repaid for the tixx? Would he have just told another lie that he spent all the money on dates with the GF?</p>

<p>If a person truly can’t get a job, and they don’t want their parents to know, then they don’t borrow money that they KNOW that they can’t pay back. </p>

<p>When people are out of work, they don’t say, “Let me charge on your credit card for concert tix (an unnecessary expense) and I’ll pay you next week when I get my first paycheck from my new job,” when they know that they have no job!!! NO…if the person had any sense of honesty, he would “lay low” and not spend any money …because he would know that he had no money to spend. </p>

<p>That said…in some families there can be a dynamic that encourages lying. I don’t mean that the parents lie…I mean that kids quickly learn that the best and fastest way to shut mom and dad up is to just tell a lie.</p>

<p>One of my best friends is in this situation. She and her H “made” her kids do 2 musical instruments each (piano and another)…and she would nag about their need to practice so they learned to frequently lie about their practicing. (She caught the lying about piano practice by secretly putting some tape on the part that closes over the keys…and when she came home, she saw that the tape was still there. </p>

<p>They weren’t allowed to have cell phones because mom thought they would be a “distraction” from school and music, so the kids secretly purchased the “pre-paid” phones. </p>

<p>They were told that they couldn’t have Facebook…well, they had them with fake names and no profile pic of their faces. </p>

<p>I’m not saying that this kind of stuff is what’s going on in your household, but if it is, you might want to have a family meeting to get this all on the table.</p>

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<p>is a smart kid headed off to college iin August. School ended about 2 weeks ago and he claimed to have gotten a part-time job at our local Sears. H and I have asked all our kids to have jobs or be doing something during the summer. I’m not as insistant on it as H is but I still think it’s important to not be a homebody. </p>

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<p>Wouldn’t you have all figured it out when it came time to do taxes and there wouldn’t have been a 1099 form for the summer job? It would be very difficult for teens to lie about summer jobs when their forms need to be turned in / collated with the parents.</p>

43

<p>Oh, OP, I in no way meant to imply that you were unfaithful! Not at all! I was just trying to ask about what your son has been able to observe about being less than truthful - most people tell “white lies” or “omissions” for tact - we would all be in trouble if we didn’t - but other people tell their kids to not disclose this or that to Grandma, in which case they are demonstrating that “lies of omission” to parents are really OK. The fact is that teenagers “split” - everything is all black or all white - they don’t yet get the nuuances - and if you have ever done ANYTHING regarding “lying” and he knows about it - he will use this as an excuse that it is “OK”.
We all have family patterns, and these patterns can often repeat themselves generation to generation. We may not have been “allowed” to disagree with our parents - very common in our generation - so we lied, or didn’t communicate. We may have had controlling parents - so we lied, or didn’t disclose. Our parents may have acted very hurt or disappointed in us if they knew of certain things, so we pretended things that were not true. These patterns can easily get passed down. I am not saying that this is the case in your family; I was just asking to try to understand what is going on here.</p>

44

<p>Lying about ones whereabouts and activities at that age is so normal. Not acceptable but normal. Most kids I know will tell “keep them off my back” lies. </p>

<p>I do believe that young people need to have some structured activities to do or it becomes too easy to find trouble to fill the void. Also, you and your husband want him working, and I assume the family can use money to get through the summer, not to mention the upcoming college year, so your son should be looking for a job. But some kids just don’t know how to do that, can’t get the motivation to do it, and jobs are hard to get these days. How about working with him to find a job, or a volunteer position for him to do this summer, rather than punishing him?</p>

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<p>*Wouldn’t you have all figured it out when it came time to do taxes and there wouldn’t have been a 1099 form for the summer job? It would be very difficult for teens to lie about summer jobs when their forms need to be turned in / collated with the parents. *</p>

<p>If this was to be his first job, then it’s likely that he never thought that far ahead. Or, he thought that he would just claim that he filed the taxes himself. </p>

<p>It’s understandable that a kid his age wouldn’t be thinking about tax returns…many months from now…but it does seem disturbing that he said that he would pay you back with his first paycheck (in a week or so), when he certainly knew that there was no check forthcoming. He had no business buying tix under such a false premise.</p>

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<p>I think the issue is not so much what he did, but how he did it. He duped you into buying the tickets, and then he lied about having a job. I’m sure if he had been honest with the OP and said, “Hey, I’m having trouble finding a job, the economy’s really tough right now, but I’ve been looking.” His parents probably would either have a) helped him or b) let him pay for the tickets in sweat equity (mowing the lawn, weeding the garden, painting the shed, planting the flower beds, whatever). But he didn’t do that, he lied to them because he thought he could get away with it. It doesn’t make him a bad kid. Most teenagers are lazy, and would rather hang with friends than work. More or less all teenagers will lie about as much as they feel like they can get away with it. I once read a parenting column where the author said “Trust is to adolescence what fair is to childhood.” That’s why they have parents, to discipline them when they lie and to encourage industry when they’d rather be chilling. So he’s not a bad kid, but he did something wrong, and for that you have consequences, naturally. </p>

<p>I agree with someone who posted here earlier: sell the tickets on stubhub or craigslist. That will be a punishment worthy of the crime. Also, loss of privileges (cell phone probably the best one, or at least cut off the texting plan) for lying to you. If he wants to keep the tickets he can work off his debt around the house, but the loss of privileges for lying still stands.</p>

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<p>OK, so more drama. I sat down to talk the situation over with S and suddenly he got very upset and said I reacted like this just because I dont like his GF, which isn’t the truth at all and I don’t know where he got this from. It’s bizarre, like I said I’ve met this girl once and we liked each other fine. He put on a defensive drama queen attitude and even though he eventually said he was sorry but before he got there he said I was a bully for always wanting him to be doing something, that H and I just wanted him out of our sight ect. </p>

<p>When asked about the all the lying all he had to say was “they weren’t hiring” and when I asked why he didn’t just tell us he went on a rant about how he should be able to enjoy his last summer. Well when I asked about it and why he didn’t just talk to us about THAT instead of going to the effort of spending hours a day at someone elses house he said we would have yelled at him. Also note that through this whole conversation I didn’t raise my voice though I admit i had to bite my tongue a little. We both needed to cool off after this and so now hes in his room (we’ve taken away the keys and phone so he isn’t going anywhere). </p>

<p>I don’t know what wrong with him this time, he’s always been about the most temperamental member of our family and he’s always had that edge but this time I just don’t really know what to do because he’s older and I don’t want to over step my bounds as the parent of a college bound kid. As far as course of action probably we’ll ground him a while and sell the tickets (feel a bit sorry for the GF who I guess my son told they’d be going together to the concert) and try to help him find something else to do but as far as how to talk to him I’m just at a loss for ideas.</p>

48

<p>*I think the issue is not so much what he did, but how he did it. He duped you into buying the tickets, *</p>

<p>Exactly! It really bothers me that he knew that he didn’t have a paycheck coming in, but he made plans to go to a concert, and then duped you into buying the tix on the premise that his next paycheck would be used to pay you back. That is just devious.</p>

<p>I sat down to talk the situation over with S and suddenly he got very upset and said I reacted like this just because I dont like his GF</p>

<p>Ok…that is just “off - beaming” …that’s when people try to distract from the matter at hand by trying to put some blame on you.</p>

<p>*he said I was a bully, that H and I just wanted him out of our sight ect. *</p>

<p>more off-beaming… And expect lots more anger…that’s to discourage you from talking about it…and to make you feel guilty. Don’t feel bad about the GF and tix. She knows that he didn’t have a job to pay for them. She can buy them if she wants.</p>

49

<p>I agree with m2ck. He’s trying to deflect the guilt and blame from himself. People do that.</p>

<p>I also agree that what he did isn’t necessarily way outside normal limits for a kid in his late teens. But I think there’s a big difference between what’s normal and what’s tolerable. We all have impulses that should not be acted upon. When we do act upon them, we deserve to be corrected, even if we don’t want to be. And when we act upon them, our parents, bosses, spouses or constituents (depending on our station in life) are within their rights to correct us.</p>

<p>I am not sympathetic to the argument that he should be able to make the most of his last summer with his high school friends. If he were my son, I would care much more whether he becomes a man who is truthful when being truthful is difficult than whether this is the best summer ever. He won’t learn that lesson only from this incident, but he won’t begin to learn it now if you let this opportunity pass.</p>

<p>I have thought a lot about ginab591’s suggestion that you don’t want to be too harsh, lest it lead to more lying. There’s something to that. But there would also be something to the suggestion that you don’t want to be too lax, lest you send the message that honesty doesn’t really matter. What you don’t want is more lying, for sure. But I think this is like a lot of things that come up in childrearing: no course of action will guarantee you the outcome you want, but you have to believe that if you keep as close to your principles and values as you can, you’ll have reason to hope that your kids will grow into good adults.</p>

50

<p>It is true, you did not say that you don’t like his current girlfriend but in post #37 you did say</p>

<p><a href=“he%20goes%20through%20girlfriends%20like%20a%20revolving%20door%20so%20this%20is%20just%20the%20girl%20dujour”>quote</a>

[/quote]
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<p>If I ever found out that my boyfriend’s mother referred to me as the “girl dujour” I would be so mad and I would never want to have anything to do with her. I had a boyfriend in high school who I was dating for a year and his mother never bothered to learn my name. It was a reflection on her, not me.</p>

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<p>^ I don’t think this is the OP’s fault necessarily. If the GF has only been in the picture long enough to meet her once, and if her son goes through gf’s frequently this is a reflection on the son, not the current gf. As the mother of son’s I can see not getting too attached to the gf’s until they are staying around. She said she liked the gf fine and had met her once. As for the ‘dujour’ comment…again, this is a reflection on the son’s dating habits, not the current girlfriend…unless the son is the boyfriend dujour.</p>

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<p>Well… I admit, there are a few red flags in this for me. Parent’s control over what concert to go to, the my-way-or-the-highway type comments, saying he is the most tempermental member of the family make me wish I could hear the son’s side of this. Wondering if there are other restrictions that have caused conflict in the past – is this an isolated incident, or a result of a buildup of resentment on his part for some reason (that might even be valid)? Of course, I accept that it could also just be an immature kid being kind of a jerk :)</p>

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<p>*I don’t think this is the OP’s fault necessarily. If the GF has only been in the picture long enough to meet her once, and if her son goes through gf’s frequently this is a reflection on the son, not the currently gf. As the mother of son’s I can see not getting too attached to the gf’s until they are staying around. She said she liked the gf fine and had met her once. As for the ‘dujour’ comment…again, this is a reflection on the son’s dating habits, not the current girlfriend. *</p>

<p>I agree…I think the OP was just trying to clarify that because S has had many, many GFs, she’s not going to bother “hating” or “disliking” any of them because they are likely temporary. I’m sure that she knows this gal’s name. :)</p>

<p>*I also agree that what he did isn’t necessarily way outside normal limits for a kid in his late teens. *</p>

<p>I think the lying about having the job is a bit outside the normal limits. Kids may lie about where they are going once in a while…but to lie about having a job…and pretending to go to that job on a regular basis…that’s another issue.</p>

<p>AND…again…the deviousness about getting mom to pay for tix when he knew for sure that he didn’t have the means to pay her back is not normal kid lying. </p>

<p>BTW…one reason why the S didn’t just say that he couldn’t find a job was because he likely knew that he’d either be encouraged to volunteer somewhere…or be expected to do some home chores for payment. Lying about the job kept his time FREE for himself…no chores, no job, no volunteering.</p>

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<p>I think a lot of parents are forgetting how teenagers think. It was clearly a “get the parents off my back” lie, and I would bet those tickets that he was trying to figure out how to make the money to pay his parents back for the tickets.</p>

<p>Impulsive? Absolutely. However, I think all the questions regarding the son’s character and whether or not they are doing drugs or not aren’t needed. It was impulse, and everyone knows that once you start a lie it’s hard to end it on your own terms.</p>

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<p>Knights, I don’t think I’m forgetting how teens think. I’m raising two teens, and I’ve taught hundreds of teens. </p>

<p>I don’t believe this should be about “how teens think.” I believe it should be about “how responsible people behave.” I think it would be magical thinking to believe that impulsive teens will grow into responsible adults if people don’t call them on, and expose them to consequences for, the impulsive, bone-headed decisions they make along the way.</p>

<p>@m2ck: Yeah, I suppose I would agree that pretending to have a job for two weeks is somewhat more egregious than saying you’re going to place A, and then taking the car to place B (which I did when I was a kid). It probably is, as you say, a bit beyond normal limits. But I believe there’s got to be something still beyond that. What? I don’t even want to know…gang initiations, maybe?</p>

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<p>I don’t think the concern over the concert is really a red flag. Perhaps this is a really conservative family and the band played music that didn’t share their values. Maybe not, but I’m just throwing out a possibility. He’s got one foot out the door so to speak, they agreed, and fronted the money for the tickets. They didn’t say no, they said they were initially not happy, but had a discussion and came to an agreement they could all live with. I don’t think that’s a crime…that’s a natural part of realizing your student is now 18/19yo and will be leaving for college. Why are we judging the parent for sharing this? I don’t see this as any sign of ‘my way or the highway’. I actually see this as a clear sign of a time where the student approached the parents with a difficult situation and they agreed to an outcome he wanted.</p>

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<p>“It was clearly a “get the parents off my back” lie,” - Yep. For better or worse, some teens have a tendency to give the answer that causes the least confrontation for the short term. Thinking ahead to January tax time? Yikes, they are not always even thinking to tomorrow. I’m not saying this is right or responsible. And I don’t know the best strategy for OP. </p>

<p>The fact that the kid picked a Sears fictional job to me says he has not yet learned to be a good liar/schemer. That at least is a good thing.</p>

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<p>I think a lot of parents are forgetting how teenagers think. It was clearly a “get the parents off my back” lie, and I would bet those tickets that he was trying to figure out how to make the money to pay his parents back for the tickets.</p>

<p>I think we all can agree that the “job lie” was a “get parents off my back lie.” NO one is arguing that.</p>

<p>But…it’s one of those lies that surely a kid has to know is going to “come out.” That’s what is odd. It’s not like he lied about going to the movies and really went to GF’s home for sex…parents not likely to find out about that. A job is something that the parents would find out about…especially when the parents said that they go to Sears a lot! </p>

<p>I’m concerned about the “disconnect” this kid has with reality.</p>

<p>As for the figuring out how to pay for the tix…well, if the tix were only - say $5k each - then it might be reasonable that he could find the money within 2 weeks (the time for his “paycheck” (ha ha) to come in. But, if the two tickets were - say $50 total + processing fees - then it’s really crazy thinking that he could come up with that much in a matter of days without some kind of job. More likely, he’s impulsive…and that behavior can get the best of people if they don’t learn to control it.</p>

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<p>I will admit to being relieved that my own kids are not better sneaks and liars.</p>

<p>At least, I think they’re not… One is surely better than the other, though.</p>

60

<p>I was thinking, well, if he is weighing career choices, this has helped rule one out. This kid is not meant to be a secret agent.</p>