<p>As my dad used to say “what you allow will continue”.</p>
<p>The vast majority of that, cobrat, was completely irrelevant to this story. </p>
<p>OP, I give you credit for sticking around this long, but I really don’t think that unless you leave without him, anything is going to change. Some people are on their own schedule and haven’t a clue that they’re inconveniencing anyone else.</p>
<p>Actually I found cobrat’s post interesting. If you find his posts irrelevant, it is easy enough to just move on.</p>
<p>*I think it’s interesting that everyone who has posted is an on time person who is annoyed by late people. *</p>
<p>that’s cuz the chronically late folks won’t get around to seeing this thread til, like, Wednesday.</p>
<p>Is there a chance that you could discreetly get the coach involved? Clue him in if he doesn’t already know the back story for why the boys are always late, and maybe he could have a “talk” with the boys/parents in the position of annoyed professional authority figure</p>
<p>While a coach probably wouldn’t get involved with the car-pool issue in particular (doubtful that a coach would tell the other son/mother, “you’re being rude to keep that other mom/child waiting”)…the coach could address the issue that HE has to deal with and that’s the fact that these two kids are arriving late to his sessions. On that issue, the coach can/should speak up.</p>
<p>When my kids swam the coach hated late swimmers. If someone was late to practice, he barked at them and made them do push ups on the deck before they got in the pool.</p>
<p>The kids often complained that it wasn’t their fault. But invariably, it would be a long time until they were late again, if ever.</p>
<p>In the activity my kid was in(where we ditched the late carpool participant), the director actually gave it to anyone who was late, and restricted participation in events for late arrivers. The “late one” in our carpool seemed to think the rule wouldn’t apply to her. My kids didn’t want to risk it…one of the reasons we ditched the late one.</p>
<p>If this has been going on “for years”, maybe the coach doesn’t care either…otherwise there would have been a consequence from him/her long before now.</p>
<p>Okay, a lateish person fessing up here. I feel that what is on time is up to ten minutes late, however I am never late for reservations or something that I am paying money for. If someone is waiting for me I find myself gauging if they, themselves are a late person. If they are a lateish person, I can relax and know calling them to say I am running late is okay. </p>
<p>I get stressed if I know I have to meet someone that is annoyed at me being five minutes late. I find that they think “on time” means five or ten minutes EARLIER then the agreed upon time. </p>
<p>For instance, if I am five minutes late for work, I’ll stay over five, ten or fifteen minutes. I would never think that the five minutes I arrived later for work was not something I was accountable for. </p>
<p>If I was the late Mom, I would very much appreciate the OP having a heart to heart talk with me about the time. My guess is the late Mom and son have put this carpool in the column of “okay to be a little late” or “Good friends that don’t mind waiting”. </p>
<p>I have all of our clocks in our house set 7 minutes ahead of time and actually do forget that, which helps get me out on time more often then not.</p>
<p>“OP clearly isn’t interested in solving the problem”</p>
<p>That’s pretty dismissive, MOWC. Why don’t we try to help the OP instead of bashing her? Yes it seems hard to believe that the problem has gone on this long, but there are definitely times when we all put up with something that’s kind of a low-grade nuisance then we just don’t want to put up with it anymore and we need some help. It sounds like OP is at that point.</p>
<p>She has tried her own solutions; they don’t work. Other people have suggested other solutions (let the coach know). At this point, I think the OP needs to make her own decision about whether to keep carpooling with this kid or not.</p>
<p>And yes, sometimes we start threads just to vent, but I really believe OP is asking for ideas.</p>
<p>Some of my kids’ teachers routines are making a lot more sense after reading about this unbelievable situation. It’s hard for me even to imagine this situation going on for more than a couple of weeks, much less years.
I think talking to the coach might work, but then I’m also surprised that the coach has let this continue as long as it has! None of the coaches my kids ever had would have allowed it.
My son’s sixth grade social studies teacher used to count students late to her class if they weren’t in their seat, with their book and pencil on their desks! This was one young woman who really made use of her 50 minutes. And three classroom tardies at this middle school meant a detention.</p>
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<p>Not to put you on the spot, (well, maybe a little) but why do you feel this way? Is it the way your family did things when you were growing up?</p>
<p>Some people just run late, I guess. That is OK for them…as long as they can adjust (like KathieP) if needed. It’s OK to be a little late for a bike ride, or walk. It’s ok to be a little late when shopping, or going to the grocery store. In my opinion, it is NOT OK to be late for concerts, dinner reservations, movies (the late arrivals always seem to come in and sit right in from of me…even if the rest of the theater is empty), plays, or anything else that has a specifically stated start time ( music lessons, coaching classes, etc). </p>
<p>The troublesome thing about the OP…there IS a specific start time, and these kids have been late “for years”. That is NOT adjusting, which cuts short not only the late one’s kid, but also the carpool driver’s kid. </p>
<p>Some people are luckier than others when it comes to work. As a teacher, if I had been five minutes late more than once without good reason, I would have had a disciplinary letter in my file. And we didn’t have “flex time” so making it up at the end of the day was not an option.</p>
<p>Someone upstream brought up other situations where being late will certainly be problematic…bus, train or plane schedules, for example. The us is NOT going to wait for someone to get ready. If you call a taxi and it comes to your house and has to wait…the meter will be running.</p>
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<p>It may also impact the other kids on the team or in the class while the late kids are brought up to speed.</p>
<p>Also, I don’t think I agree that it’s ok to be late for shopping, a walk or bike ride, etc., if someone is waiting for you. Other people’s time is important, and waiting for someone is annoying and a waste of their time, even if there isn’t a formally scheduled event. Ocassionally, yes, it happens, but not ok as a general practice.</p>
<p>I have a good guess as to what sport this is. If I am correct, it requires a lot of equipment as well as a number of sport-specific pieces of clothing to be worn. The OP has a long-term close relationship with the other family and doesn’t want to jeopardize that relationship. Additionally, she wants to carpool because she doesn’t want to drive the long distance to the lesson every week.</p>
<p>This situation would drive me absolutely nuts as I can’t stand being late, and the lessons cost a lot of money. OP, would this idea possibly work? If the other young man is always late, could he just gather up all his equipment and clothing in a bag and get dressed at the facility where the lessons are? This way, your son would be dressed and ready at the start of the lesson, and it would be the other kid who would have to dress there and might have to miss part of the lesson because of his habitual lateness. Could you suggest to the mother that he just have his large bag ready with both clothing and equipment on time and not worry about him having to get dressed before you leave? Or, would this just shift the problem around? If he’s not dressed when you get to his house, how about suggesting, “Why don’t you just throw all that stuff in the bag, and you can dress as soon as we get there?”</p>
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<p>Ditto. As a nurse coming in to the ICU for 7a-7p shift, being late to take report from the nurse who has been up all night would have caused a major problem for me. And after working 12 hours, I was very ready to give report and get the heck out of there to go have dinner with my family or at least be there to give the kids their baths and read to them before they went to bed. You are EXHAUSTED mentally and physically after a shift and you cannot legally leave until you have reported on your patient and that nurse has officially accepted care of that patient. Waiting on a chronically late nurse-not happening on my unit. She’d be gone after a warning or maybe 2. No tolerance at all for that kind of nonsense.</p>
<p>I feel that what is on time is up to ten minutes late,</p>
<p>Like the person above, I also wonder why you “feel” that “on time” is up to 10 minutes late. </p>
<p>JMO…Late is late. However, someone who is a a minute or two late isn’t too much inconveniencing anyone, but waiting 5-10 minutes for someone can be annoying.</p>
<p>However, I agree that if your job has flex-time and no one is waiting for you to show up, then being late isn’t a huge deal at all, especially if you make up the time. H is late all the time to work, but he has flex time and unless he has a meeting to go to, it isn’t a big deal for him to show up late.</p>
<p>I, too, like to keep the home clocks a few minutes fast. It was very helpful when the kids were young because they had a harder time with the concept of travel time and traffic issues.</p>
<p>*When my kids swam the coach hated late swimmers. If someone was late to practice, he barked at them and made them do push ups on the deck before they got in the pool.</p>
<p>The kids often complained that it wasn’t their fault. But invariably, it would be a long time until they were late again, if ever.
*</p>
<p>I was wondering why the coach hasn’t said anything yet.</p>
<p>However, is this a coach for a team, or is this some kind of “private coach” thing…like a personal batting coach or whatever…someone who doesn’t really care if you’re late cuz he gets paid no matter what.</p>
<p>^^^^I think it’s the latter. These are private skills sessions.</p>
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<p>So if it affects you negatively, you can be on time, but if it’s just inconveniencing someone else or wasting their time, you are okay with it. I appreciate your honesty, but that attitude is exactly what we are referring to when we say it is very rude, selfish, and disrespectful. Is it the worst thing a person could do? Of course not. But don’t kid yourself; 10 minutes late is not on time, it is 10 minutes of someone waiting on you whose time is just as valuable as yours. It’s late, not “on time.”</p>
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<p>I really don’t think there are many people who “don’t mind waiting.” Particularly in the OPs scenario, where time is money. Once in a while, yeah, people can be accommodating and not mind at all. But on a regular basis, no, I don’t believe this would be likely.</p>
<p>HarvestMoon, I love your dad’s saying!</p>
<p>To answer a few questions that have come up, Nrdsb4 is right, these are private skills sessions with a pro. I should say that I was particularly frustrated yesterday, because we were so late (15 mins). Usually we are “only” a few minutes late, because I set things up to have a lot of padding, because I know the other boy will be late. I don’t know how late the boys are or are not the times that the other mother drives.</p>
<p>Yesterday I was not able to include any time padding because it was a complicated day for me. I was also particularly frustrated because the other mother, who was going to be picking the boys up, told me that she’d have to pick them up a few minutes early because her other child had a “date” to work on a project with a schoolmate. (They couldn’t be “a few minutes” late for this, or set it up a little later?) So the time was cut short on both ends.</p>
<p>I am going to talk to the mother. I’ve been reluctant to do so because I like her so much. She is really unusually warm, kind, generous, and I like her a lot. And I like the boy a lot, too, and I’m glad that he and my son are friends. They are friends because back in first grade, when my son was the new boy in the class where kids had already formed groups the previous year, this boy noticed that my son was alone and reached out to him. They have been best friends ever since. This boy is always the one who makes friends with the kids who are lonely and the kids who are scapegoats. He has always been this way.</p>
<p>So it’s a wonderful family. I hate conflict and I guess I worry excessively about risking relationships that are important to me. I could never, never leave the kid behind or make the mother drive him when it was my turn. She has a complicated schedule, like mine, and we rely on one another for support. </p>
<p>I’ve learned a lot from this thread - sort of like a therapy session! - for one thing, how being late has a strong effect on me, even physically. </p>
<p>Thanks for all the comments and advice.</p>