I thought there was some kind of accreditation/guideline type thing? Which is why our “taught differently class” can’t be labeled AP (according to our school)
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Our school district’s teaching is subpar for AP and IB courses. But students study on their own and there are numerous sources online now which can help as well. Using this My DC did well on their AP’s and IB’s. In high school as a student I studied on my own and that is the expectation for DC as well. With all the resources students have access to, there is no excuse for relying on teaching alone.
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So I think at least Yale would see this particular sentiment as problematic.
For one thing, they are going to require you to take courses outside your major, and in fact they are a classic “distributional requirements” college where you have to cover all of the traditional core areas:
https://catalog.yale.edu/ycps/yale-college/distributional-requirements/
I think the other issue is they are a general admissions college, meaning you are not admitted into some particular major, and they are specifically one of the colleges that seems to really value exploration before you pick a major:
And so in Podcast Episode 26, Should I Even Apply?–which to me is now looking like a preview of sorts of some critical things on their mind in response to the massive increase in applications–they say things like:
We need to see that a student is being consistently strong across a wide range of courses.
And:
It’s also not a great sign that if you’re applying to a place like Yale that has 2000 courses and 80 majors and has really rigorous courses across the board that you’re going to be someone who’s really excited about that. So there’s an element of fit here. It’s not just a matter of how academically accomplished are you.
And most critically:
HANNAH: We don’t admit students who are going to come to Yale and study one thing in a vacuum. That is not the type of education we offer here at Yale.
It’s a place where students inform their studies across disciplines. And you need to really be excited about that in order to be a successful, happy Yale student.
MARK: I know that every year I’ve read some really accomplished and very impressive applications from students who have just done amazing things and they’re going to do great things in college, but they are just a terrible academic pick for Yale.
And it seems that they’ve applied to Yale less because they’re actually interested in the four year experience of learning here and more just because it has an impressive sounding and prestigious name. And sometimes they’re confused like how did I get denied? I’m so accomplished. And we say, well, did you know what you were signing up for?
HANNAH: Right. Right. We want to set you up for success. We want to admit students who are really going to thrive in that interdisciplinary approach.
This just Yale, however. It is entirely possible some other highly selective colleges would not see things quite the same way.
OK, and then the role standardized testing should play in all that is another question too. But they more or less said one of the many purposes of the new policy is basically to help them continue to communicate these concepts, and to continue to act on them.
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Exactly. That is why the exam is there, to provide quality control and accountability for the course.
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Sure. Like the baseball analogy, there is more to being a good student than a high SAT score (though your daughter appears to have done very well on the SAT part that is is relevant to her major, so it doesn’t really dispute the correlation).
None of this makes the SAT inherently flawed or unfair. Just like I don’t claim the essays are unfair to my very numbers oriented student and he should be exempt from writing them. Even though his very talented writer sister definitely had a leg up in completing all her supplemental essays.
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Could it be Yale etc signaling they will be changing tacks on that account? After all, at some point they changed their FA policy and refined it to ensure greater economic diversity.
By that, I meant that if an applicant has lopsided tests scores or differences between test scores and GPA, that the admin peeps can put that all into context. No need to worry as long as your intended major aligns with test scores and gpa.
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Could it be that they can, in fact, achieve their diversity and institutional goals and admit primarily from top test scorers?
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Exactly. Years ago, there was an AO from UVa who used to post that he was partial to applicants that did theater, so he gave them a small bump, but his colleague was impressed by students who take Calc in HS.
Well, she did not apply to Yale so we’ll never know.
But in terms of distribution requirements, her university has a few as well. She is just trying to find the least science-y science requirements and the least math-y quantitative requirements. It seems like they have these sorts of classes that are geared towards social science/humanities majors. She took one so far and did well. Also, as has been talked about a lot on many threads, everyone at these schools gets As or Bs in every class so she is not worried about doing well in those distribution classes.
In terms of exploration, she loves exploration - perhaps a little too much! Just not in math or science. But she has taken classes in a bunch of different fields.
So to bring it back to the thread, I hear what you are saying, but I still don’t think a lopsided score would make one struggle (at these specific grade inflation colleges like Yale) in any distribution requirements. And it seems like there are plenty of majors to explore and be curious about in the social sciences.
But I think Yale should do whatever they want. I definitely think test scores can highlight certain strengths, specifically a fast processing speed. My S24 has this strength and it showed in his test scores so he is thrilled that somebody cares.
You mentioned that she may be interested in pursuing a PhD in Sociology, correct? I’m guessing that some concepts of probability and statistics will be useful to that end. So – I would suggest that she at least take a Stats course during her undergrad, if she is interested in grad work in a social science.
I’m hoping that others who have (or know someone who has…) a PhD or MA/MS in Sociology, or another social science, will chime in with additional insight, or revisions to my advice.
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Probably more along the lines of history, ethnic studies, American studies, etc. She’s still exploring…
But I do think stats would be very useful - not only for school, but for life as well.
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No idea. I am neither a teacher nor a College Board employee nor someone that fixated on the AP label, as long as the class is rigorous, it doesn’t matter that much to me either way.
I should note based on what you said it is entirely possible they would have actually been happy to admit her. I think it is more they might want to see the test scores, but then understand how she did well in her classes, how she planned to explore her options, and so on. I could be wrong, but I don’t sense they are trying to institute any one hard profile, more the opposite actually.
The pitfall is when you trust that the class is doing its job without outside materials…
I don’t understand what AP accreditation effectively means… when there are stories of HSs where the average scores are really low.
(My friend from HS had very very similar scores to your child. Attended T10, grad school at another T10. Now a prof at a… T10. Now that was a long time ago and my friend did not attend Yale, but yeah there are pathways for lopsided scores. My eldest is also similar, but those chapters are yet to be completed 
)
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Hence the need for test scores?
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It depends on the quality of the teacher and the students in the class. For eg. AP physics 1- if the students don’t have a good understanding of Algebra 2 and precal how do you teach mechanics? But is accredited irrespective of the AP scores of the students.
Yes agreed. We’ve seen within the same HS good AP classes in one dept and subpar AP classes in another. Need to know the scenario to vet what needs to be done (if anything).
But they did not achieve financial diversity. Not with 70% from the top 20% by income, and 20% from the top 1% by income. More recent studies by Chetty indicate that, at least for the classes of 2015-2019, things hadn’t changed much.
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