<p>I’m assuming this would be me at 21, as the OP’s daughter is not a 20-something?</p>
<p>I don’t need your patronizing sadness, and neither does anyone else who is happy with the choices they make. And not doing something doesn’t mean that you think there’s anything “wrong” with it.</p>
<p>I also find your assertion that if a boy gives a girl gifts and hangs out with her - in other words, treats her like a good friend (and the OP did say that not only is he the girl’s friend, he’s her best friend) - but doesn’t want to date her, he must be playing games with her, to be unfair to this boy. He flat-out told her that he wasn’t interested in dating her.</p>
<p>I do agree with you that it sounds like the daughter has some confidence issues, since she seems unsure if she will be able to uphold her own principles.</p>
<p>haven’t read all of the posts so hopefully I’m not repeating what anyone else has written, but there was an article in the NY Times about a month ago about abstinence groups at Harvard and Princeton. They have nothing to do with religion. I bet your daughter could find one at a SUNY, too.</p>
<p>I have to say, both my Ds and their friends have some AMAZING guy friends, who they hang out with, HOWEVER they don’t do this
according to the OP
"They went to homecoming together, they spend loads of time together, he gives her gifts, and does a million things to keep her pining for him. In fact, homecoming felt so much like a date to her that she cried for months because he was not “really” her boyfriend.'</p>
<p>My Ds both had lots of really really good guy friends, and they were friends, but there was never gift giving, never actions that appear like BF stuff, but aren’t</p>
<p>no matter if the boy said “flat out” he isn’t interested, he is sending all sorts of signals to the girl…and that is called game playing</p>
<p>as well, many gay young men play at being straight so others don’t get the “wrong” idea because they are afraid to admit to themselves who they are</p>
<p>My D is going to a dance this week with one of her best guy friends, unless he is interested, no way would my D come home feeling like it was a date, UNLESS the boy did things to show interest…</p>
<p>And PS_ if someone says they aren’t interested in that way, but do lots of things that LOOK like they are interested…that is game playing and dishonest with all parties involved</p>
<p>Let’s be realistic, the men who are “willing” to wait till marriage to have sex with their girlfriends are either pretty bad looking or have some serious confidence issues and can not get laid. As a male I have a very difficult time believing that a college guy will pass up sex in order to respect a females decision to wait for marriage. It would be extremely rare to go throughout college sexually inactive. </p>
<p>The truth is the girl will most likely lose her virginity the first year of college. She will go away have freedom, meet many men she will be attracted to and that will be that. There is no need to fuss over this. I’d hate to be harsh but she is obviously longing for a boy who either insists on playing mind games with her, but to me it actually sounds more like he is a homosexual.</p>
<p>You don’t understand the pull that religion can have with some people, if you think the only way this is the case is if he’s ugly or gay…</p>
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<p>I would really agree with you if she were a he and we were talking about this woman’s son. Girls can stand more to lose and certainly face certain dangers much more readily than boys. Thus, while I think you’re right it’s most likely to play out basically the way you said, I do think it deserves care and concern if not fuss.</p>
<p>Whether the boy is gay or repressed seems largely irrelevant; he’s not going for her and she’s done a lot to try to see if it might work out. She should move on.</p>
<p>Uri - you’re wrong. I would have thought you were right until I met the boyfriends of a good friend’s daughters. Granted, they did meet through a church organization but they have dated all through college and have stuck to “the pledge.” These boys are popular, outgoing, athletes (full ride lacrosse of all things for one) and very good looking. My friend’s main concern is that they may rush marriage because of their commitments. These kids all attend Ivy or Ivy caliber universities. It might be more common than you think.</p>
<p>Let’s be honest with ourselves, that is extremely unrealistic. Regardless of what you tell your son or daughter about sex, they will make their own choices, usually based on how attracted they are to someone. Most college guys (especially good looking ones) are usually not looking to have serious relationships, just flings with random girls, the more the merrier. There are studies that show the longer you wait to have sex, the more frustrated you will become. We’re in the 21rst century and casual sex is something society has accepted to be completely natural.</p>
<p>Parents: Think back to your college experiences, how many of you made thoughtful decisions when it came to sex. It was either get laid or don’t get laid, and 99% will chose to get laid if they had the chance. Some may not like it, but that’s the sad reality. Young girls are just as curious and willing to have casual sexual encounters with charming young men as vice versa.</p>
<p>When it comes to sex regardless of what you have taught your children they will most likely use the quote “bring it on”</p>
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<p>I have plenty of friends who will not admit to their folks that they have been having sex, when asked about it they will say “we are waiting” mostly to keep the parents opinion of the girl good and vice versa. </p>
<p>I’m not saying it’s the case for everyone, some may indeed abstain, but it is becoming more common not to. </p>
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<p>May be true, but there are also a fair share of folks who chose that path because they feel guilty due to their sexual orientation or lack of ability to have sex. Refer to all the recent scandals with church officials and young children.</p>
<p>Listen up folks before you take my words out of context, keep in mind that I am not saying children will have unprotected sex, but that many parents are unaware of their children’s sexual activity. Lord knows mine are.</p>
<p>Uri speaks some mean truth, but truth nonetheless.</p>
<p>As long as the fathers aren’t there with their chastity organizations and pledges, I think girls should have the freedom to keep or give their virginity.</p>
<p>I do think that parents are generally clueless about their children’s whereabouts, activities (including sexual) and much of their thinking. I say this as a professional with 30 years experience working with adolescents and young adults.</p>
<p>As a result, my eyes are wide open with my own children. I don’t make proclamations; just provide information, an open ear, and trust in their abilities to make good decisions. In the end, that’s all you can do.</p>
<p>My friend whose daughter’s made “the pledge” really had nothing to do with the decision - and neither did their dad - he was as surprised as she was that the girls made that choice. They made the commitment with a group of church friends and my friend assumed that it would never stick into college but it has. My friend doesn’t even attend the church. She has had a lot of talks with her girls about it and they know that there will be no disappointment on her part if they change their minds. I think this is probably an unusual situation, but it does tell me that very normal, healthy, beautiful girls and good looking guys do sometimes make that choice on principle. It is not something I personally understand but then I don’t attach religious beliefs to personal decisions like that. They do.</p>
<p>something else- the definination of sex by the “chaste” is one wide spectrum…you have from not holding hands to doing everything but…</p>
<p>and I would almost bet you at least half who say they are doing nothing, are, if surveys are to be trusted, doing something…</p>
<p>In a 2004 study of 12,000 teens who had taken an abstinence pledge, an astounding 88 percent said that they had nevertheless gone on to have sexual intercourse before marriage.</p>
<p>“Let’s be realistic, the men who are “willing” to wait till marriage to have sex with their girlfriends are either pretty bad looking or have some serious confidence issues and can not get laid”</p>
<p>That’s a pretty strong statement. It will probably offend a lot of young, good-looking men who are actually willing to wait. I would like to believe that they do exist. It only takes a bit of love and respect…</p>
<p>I’ve previously posted in this thread and made only 2 suggestions: (1)discuss and “arm” OP’s daughter with birth control (condoms) “just in case” and (2) counsel her to disclose her “no sex” position in absolutely clear language, up front and not give off mixed signals.</p>
<p>I’ll stick to those suggestions.</p>
<p>BUT, there have been several recent posts that snipe at Men (including fathers who parent only sons) as all thinking only with their “equipment” as if only the girls (and Moms) address or care about sexual choice and related issues.</p>
<p>That is so incorrect. I have told my S that if sex involves use of substances by the female (even if she brings it, suggests it or has already taken it) he is a predator if he has sex with her. Black and white, no gray. Introduce substance use and “consent” is a joke. </p>
<p>Did I live by this credo myself as a teen and college student? NO, but I’m now a father of a S and I now understand that what is now called “date rape” was just another Saturday night in the 1960’s and early 1970’s when it was me doing the “hunting.” I was wrong then and I’m right now.</p>
<p>I told him if a girl he was interested in for anything other than just sex was unsure, he should “back off.” Since I am not stupid, I also mentioned that if he wanted sex it was a fair guess that there would be girls who were interested. I pointed out that in HS he had not been particularly drawn to girls who had multiple sex partners and drove home the point that if “sexual selectivity” was something HE valued in a girl he liked, perhaps that was another reason to respect a girl that likes him but isn’t ready.</p>
<p>I’ll just say, you Moms do your job in dealing straight with you daughters on “teasing” and use of birth control and I’ll do my job to tell him not to let his equipment make him into a predator.</p>
<p>with upwards of 80plus percentage of pledgers having premarital sex and the std and pregnancy rates at least the same, it is still really important to talk about safety and protection</p>
<p>I think it’s very, very important to give boys the date rape talk. I think in many ways they are much more vulnerable than girls. If drinking or drugs are involved it’s always going to be their fault.</p>
<p>Are there ANY mothers of daughters out there who don’t assume that their daughters will lost their virginity within 6 months of starting college? Something about that attitude doesn’t sit right with me. No flames, please.</p>
<p>I never waltzed or square danced. I didn’t know how to dance and thus was reluctant to do it anyway, but I wouldn’t have minded doing it with the assurance that it was platonic and for fun. I might have even done it, under this specification, once or twice in high school; I don’t remember.</p>
<p>Of course I had physical contact with people. I was not so much with the <em>intimate</em> physical contact - that was pretty much limited to a hug, pats on the shoulder, or a rub on the back of a sad friend (or them doing it to me). Part of that is part of my personality - I don’t really like to be touched except by very specific people. Part of it was not doing anything that could reasonably be construed as non-platonic unless I was sure that I <em>wanted</em> something non-platonic.</p>
<p>Did I ever kiss someone on the cheek? Sure, when my high school class did a French exchange program. Also, family members, plenty of times. Nobody else, prior to having a boyfriend.</p>
<p>A bridesmaid dancing with a groomsman is presumed to be platonic (or am I that clueless about wedding tradition?). Therefore, I wouldn’t have minded from the perspective of this particular issue. I probably would have minded, had it come up, on the grounds that I am a klutz and don’t know how to dance, especially not in fancy high-heeled shoes (I can barely WALK in those things!). ;)</p>
Also, family members, plenty of times. Nobody else, prior to having a boyfriend.</p>