<p>Look at it this way, Opie: you beat the odds. Like getting into HYP. <g></g></p>
<p>emeraldkitty, </p>
<p>I have never seen that passage used to justify the things you mentioned. There are separate passages that are used to justify slavery, but slavery was voluntary and debt-induced during Biblical times. </p>
<p>To the poster,
I think it really depends on what faith you are. I cannot respond to Mormon, for example, to tell you how they would respond. I am very familiar with faiths that require shunning and I do know people who would shun their child. If that is the case in your family (where you are part of a small religious group that is very conservative and set apart-- perhaps with different dress codes and the like), your parents will probably respond by separating themselves from you. If, however, your parents are part of a generally conservative religion that does not require shunning nor is set apart from the world (like many conservative Christians or a strict Catholic), your parents may respond a number of different ways and could surprise you.</p>
<p>I think there are a few things that you really need to clarify to yourself: Are <em>you</em> a bonafide member of your faith? If you are, then <em>you</em> need to – I don’t know how to say this-- to integrate the parts of your life. It is very stressful to be one thing to one people and another to others. If your church accurately represents your view of God, then there is one set of actions to take. If you feel that this church is not correct, then I would advise that the <em>first</em> step would be to find a church with which you agree. Why? Because if you are a member of a church and your parents are also members, they may be required to deal with you a certain way. By telling them, you are putting them in a difficult position.</p>
<p>If, however, you are part of a church where attendance is broad and obedience is a bit more lukewarm (I’m specifically thinking of a standard Roman Catholic Church where many people have done things that are not in keeping with the teachings-- things like birth control, divorce, etc.-- but people continue to attend), your issues are strictly with your parents. I go back to wondering what you want from them. Do you simply want them to let you live your life? Aren’t they already doing that? </p>
<p>I wouldn’t <em>lie.</em> I wouldn’t date a girl or go out with one. I might even say, “I’m not particularly interested in girls” if mom or dad tried to match me up. But I might not sit them down for a talk if I thought it would complicate things unnecessarily. I would wait until college wouldn’t be a question. I wouldn’t advise waiting until you have a significant other because your parents may blame <em>that person</em> and think he made you that way and that would be difficult for him and you.</p>
<p>By the way, you asked what would cause us uneasiness and I would have to say that telling <em>my</em> parents would cause me uneasiness. They are old and would be very, very upset. I know my relatives in my generation (siblings, cousins) would disapprove-- and would be very cold to my child and maybe even to me-- but telling my parents would be harder. But, then again, people can surprise you. Many years ago, my very conservative aunt (my mom’s older sister) told me that her nephew on her husband’s side had died. I asked of what. She took me aside and said of Aids. I was surprised and said, “How’s that?” She (remember, old, conservative lady) said, “I don’t know if he was doing something he shouldn’t have been doing or not doing something he should have been doing.” 
So they can surprise you.</p>
<p>I don’t know if my experience will help, but I went through a similar thing before going to college. I had a girlfriend during my senior year of high school. My parents are devout Catholics. They found out about it, and I was forced through therapy, antidepressants, etc. because it was just a phase. I told them because I wanted to be honest with them and I wanted them to know about something that was important to me. But, since their reaction was so negative, I just said I was bisexual and tried not to push the issue. </p>
<p>I went away to college, with my parents insisting it was just a phase. I tried to be straight, because it was much easier than dealing with my mother telling me that I “ruined all her dreams” and I was “an abomination and a freak.” But, in college, I knew that I was gay and I continued to hide it. They eventually found some pictures of me my freshman year with my arm around another girl. They took away my car, my tuition, my cell phone and I was forced to move home. I could only talk on the phone with one of them listening on the other end. It was horrible, to say the least.</p>
<p>I had to move out and ended up putting myself through school while holding a full time job. I live with my partner now, and I’m finishing my bachelor’s. They’ve gotten better about it, but it is still difficult. I’m not saying everyone’s experience would be as bad as mine, but I never considered the possibility of my parents taking away my education to try to “turn me straight.” I still don’t get any assistance from them, nor do I want it at this point. I’m lucky enough that I’ve gotten scholarships to help with the cost. </p>
<p>All in all though, if I had the choice, I would do it again, because I was being honest and true to myself. I hope this helps.</p>
<p>that is so sad…that parents hate their children so much like that, and it is hate, whatever religious excuse they want to use…and I have to say, many Cathoilcs would not do that…they may not be PFLAG members, but they would not put their kid in “therapy” for it either</p>
<p>Hmmm, if I was the OP, I would be who I was, but maybe just be lowkey about it, but not let that stop them from joining support groups, etc…</p>
<p>it is kind of creepy to me that the OP has to fear others on campus from reporting back…what kind of religious people do that?</p>
<p>Okay, a lot of you have suggested that I separate myself from the religion and find another one. Actually, this too would have the same consequences as coming out as gay, so it really wouldn’t help the situation.</p>
<p>Since I’m a member of our church, if I leave I am considered to no longer believe in it and so I’ve gone against God’s true teachings and as such should be excommunicated and actually be regarded as very, very dangerous because of my contradictory beliefs.</p>
<p>We aren’t free to reason with the Bible in any way that the church does not deem appropriate. They set the rules, we follow them. Trying to reason against its beliefs is another “felony”.</p>
<p>Ultimately the problem is that, in terms of college, they would be extremely reluctant to let me go away if I do not live with a family of the same religion, which of course, would bring more problems in terms of living openly at college. And if I don’t live with a family, they would see me as rebelling or actually not even let me go.</p>
<p>And homosexuality is regarded as a higher sin. Adultery, fornication, etc., if the person repents for their actions they would simply be talked to and disciplined. However, homosexuality is an automatic excommunication.</p>
<p>And I haven’t had any sort of relationships at all.</p>
<p>Anotherusername, you have a very important decision to make. If you choose to stay with this religion, it looks like you are either going to have to hide your orientation or vow never to act on your homosexual orientation. You are NOT homosexual in the eyes of your church at this point if you have never had a relationship. It is acting upon your feelings that will put you over the line in the eyes of your church. </p>
<p>If you want to act on your feelings, you will not be able to stay in your particular denomination … at least not if what you state in your last post is true. </p>
<p>It’s entirely your call. Only you can decide what is right for you.</p>
<p>For what it’s worth, I am a Christian. I cannot fathom how what you describe can be considered a religion that follows the teachings of Christ. I try not to put down the beliefs of others … but for Pete’s sake, Christ was the very embodiment of loving everyone, no matter what. Sure, Christians differ in what they will tolerate as acceptable in the eyes of God … but those who follow the teachings of Christ are not acting as He did when they shun others as you say your church would shun you. Love the sinner, hate the sin.</p>
<p>well I guess what you have to figure out is which is more important yourself or your church? </p>
<p>There’s lots of religions out there to choose from, only one you. </p>
<p>Good luck.</p>
<p>I don’t want to stay with this religion. . .at all.</p>
<p>But that’s another “coming out” story all-together. Another issue of being ostracized and seen as a threat. </p>
<p>Not only don’t I agree with some teachings, but I also don’t want to be celibate or confine myself to completely solitude for the rest of my life; I think that’s frankly unfair.</p>
<p>At this point it sounds like you are a junior. You still have quite a bit of time living in your parents home. I would put it to rest for now. You already have the battle of just going to a school away from home. That might be a big enough battle for now.
You also seem pretty assured you will get into this one specific school. You haven’t even applied yet. How about researching some other schools that might interest you and find a few to apply to that require freshman to live in dorms.
Are you a Jehovah’s Witness? or Seventh Day Adventist?</p>
<p>Do not lie to yourself. Your parents can ignore the issue because they don’t officially know about it yet. You know, and I don’t see how you can reconcile the religion you have been raised in with who you are, who God made you, as it were. You will always have a conflict between who you are and who your current Church insists you need to be. Since you can’t change being gay one of these years you need to change religions. Once you get to college you will be able to meet people within Christianity and the gay community to help you resolve your conflict. For the time being it may be better to have some patience and wait to officially tell your parents- there is a reason cliches exist, “what you don’t know can’t hurt you” is the one that comes to mind for your parents in this situation. By waiting they can maintain their current relationship with you. Later you will have many more tools/much more knowledge to enable you to handle the news giving. You can’t continue to hide who you are forever, it is not fair to yourself to stress yourself longterm. But, at the juncture of living at home and going away to college it is better to wait- you and your parents can enjoy the remaining months of childhood, graduation…</p>
<p>You are almost at the point of independence from your parents, and of being where so much helpful advice can be obtained. You are at a point in your life it would be nice to tie up loose ends, but please wait for better timing. It is hard when graduation et al is just around the corner. You may find the advice from those in similar situations in college may advise you to wait until you have financial independence. Kudos to you for having the maturity to realize who you are at this age. I had two college friends who discovered their sexuality years later- looking back their personalities/behaviors fit their sexual orientation. They both missed out on a lot, had a lot of anguish going through discovering who they were (no help in the '70’s).</p>
<p>Another important issue for you is religion. Going away to college will help immensly in your growth in that area. Even without the sexual orientation issue you will find many others to discuss religion/parents and related issues with. Consider this- your ancestors at some point in the past disappointed their parents greatly by deviating from the religion practiced by the past generations, even if it was switching amongst Christian churches. Ultimately all Christians broke with the faith of their ancestors- becoming Christian instead of something else, becoming Protestant instead of Catholic…- in everyone’s family tree the person was doomed by breaking the faith. Therefore, don’t worry about your immortal soul any more than some ancestor did- do what is right for you. Eventually, months, not days, from now.</p>
<p>Good luck to you. Hopefully you will join a lot of us good people in the afterlife who won’t be in someone’s version of heaven, but will be in the true heaven…</p>
<p>Thanks for your words of wisdom wis75.</p>
<p>Churches don’t have eyes, only people do. Some of them are blind. </p>
<p>If God wanted you to be different than you are, She would have made you that way. </p>
<p>Celebrate.</p>
<p>I love “she”. 
And to that argument it would be said that it 's due to Adam and Eve’s sin and thus imperfection.</p>
<p>anotherusername: Nothing about a child of mine being gay would disturb me. We have gay family members. One of my cousins married her wife in Massachusetts when she could, and we were all happy for them and gave them gifts.</p>
<p>If were my child I would want to know, and I would want him/her to tell me because sexual identity goes beyond someone’s sex life and it would a big part of my son or daughter that I wouldn’t know about or be able to discuss with them.</p>
<p>About privacy, no I wouldn’t want to know the details of their sex lives, but that goes for straight sex lives, too. But I would want to know how he/she felt to him/herself – dreams, hopes.</p>
<p>If this is dangerous for you,in that you may risk losing college funding, then perhaps it’s better to withhold this information. However, I always want to live openly, particularly to those I am close to.</p>
<p>As for religion, it’s hard to do anything about people’s religious convictions. They run very deep. You certainly don’t need to practice this religion once you go to college. I wouldn’t play a part in my own life.</p>
<p>If you you tell your parents this may be a huge loss for them so it would be kind if you could be understanding and not self-righteous if they do not react as you would wish. It’s hard being the grown-up, but you may have to be in this case.</p>
<p>many many people have left their religion and found other "familes"m support groups, etc…</p>
<p>and sadly as others have pointed out to get through it, to be able to make your path, sometimes you have to wait, and not be as open as you would like</p>
<p>consider this, perhaps your parents know you are gay, but have chosen to not confront you too much, in essence doing what they need to do to get through life…maybe for a little bit, you just need to do the same</p>
<p>as for the religious part of it…what you know in your heart- that you aren’t a threat, that you a re a good person, is all you need to know</p>
<p>if people can’t see beyond who you fall in love with, will its their loss, not yours</p>
<p>in the long run, don’t worry about hell or anything they have “taught” you- its just words that stem from ignorance, imo, and I don’t know that I need to be tolerant of hat I consider hateful speech in the name of God</p>
<p>Well, junior ya got some planning to do. </p>
<p>What you should be working on is a list of colleges you can swing on your own. Chances are very good orientation or not, your parents are going to extend some sort of pressure over you if they control the college purse strings. What you have to figure out is how you’re going to get from a to b and that may mean worrying about gay, straight, bi or plaid until after you’ve figured out school and how you are going to pull it off. </p>
<p>You sound like you have alot of issues that really you will probably need to break clean from in order to be what you want to be… and that’s only dealing with your major… </p>
<p>Are you bright enough to get scholarships? if not, are you working? Are you saving? are you willing to work and go to school part time year round?</p>
<p>Anotherusername, I have been watching this thread since you started it and have agreed wholeheartedly with posters like Marion and many others. My only uneasiness for my kid’s being gay would be borne of concern for how they would be treated by others. I have refrained from posting because I don’t have much to add beside support for you as a normal young person worthy of acceptance, love, and respect for who you are.</p>
<p>The way I see it, you are trapped and if you break out of the trap now, you are likely to be a different, and equally unhappy, kind of trapped for a long time. Those who have advised you to be yourself without making any pronouncements are offering sound advice. It’s not ideal, but it’s not a decision born of cowardice or disingenuousness (if tha a word?), but of survival. Your family and your church don’t seem likely to support you if they know you fully and if you gamble that they might, and they don’t, the damage to your current social network will be done. </p>
<p>I believe you have to look after yourself, even if that means witholding a part of yourself from those you love until you can take care of yourself without their help, which is what you have to plan to do whenever you do go public. Being able to take care of yourself is going to happen sooner for you in an accepting community (college), and ultimately, with a college degree and gainful employment. Coming out now, while it will make you feel better in some ways in the short term, is likely to cause more problems for you than it will solve right now. </p>
<p>Three years ago the mother of one of my son’s friends told me tearfully of the pain that mean kids had caused she and her family by continually calling her elder son gay. She went on about how cruel kids can be and how it had been going on for years (I was new to the area), how hurtful it is… As I listened to her, all I could think was, “yeah, kids ARE cruel, but your son IS gay. You don’t know this???” So I asked her how she would feel if he were gay. I don’t recall exactly what she said, but, basically, she got deadly serious and said he couldn’t be, her church doesn’t allow it, her husband doesn’t believe in it…yada yada yada. I told her briefly that my husband has two aunts who are a couple, so our family is pretty accepting, and I dropped it and made a mental note to be very nice to her son and tell my kids what he’s up against. He’s a senior right now and I truly hope he’s not going through what you are. </p>
<p>Whatever path you take, I fear it won’t be easy. I’m glad you brought your problem to us and hope you continue to come to us for support. Hopefully you’ll find support at college too. I still don’t know if I added anything to the discussion, but I will definitely support whatever you do.</p>
<p>You did add Schmoomcgoo. Thanks for your input. And I had gone through some of what your son’s friend went through. My parents imposed on me a ‘change’ to be more masculine and so now I rarely have problems, so that is probably a reason they think it was a phase. And I really appreciate the support of the CC community. Ultimately, I think that I’ll just have to live silently for a while, but I’d like to send you a PM.</p>
<p>Opie, I could save up money to pay for my tuition and living, etc., but my parents would rather I not move away unless I’m in “good hands” with “extended” family.</p>
<p>You know, I’m beginning to rethink my earlier advice about waiting.</p>
<p>If you are now a junior, and 16 or 17, and your parents will actually throw you out of the house or formally shun you if you come out, as well as withdraw college support, then it might be to your financial advantage to tell them sooner rather than later. </p>
<p>If they follow through on the worst-case actions you have described, you can probably become an emancipated minor, and as such would be eligible for substantial financial aid–possibly a full ride. If you are simply a “rebellious” child for whom the parents do not wish to cough up $$, you are likely to get nothing.</p>
<p>It may sound like a cynical course of action, but on the other hand there’s a church near here which caused several families to shun family members, to the point that several adolescents found other families in town to live with in order to finish HS, and one elderly man was no longer spoken to by his children, grandchildren, and wife of 40+ years, dying alone except for the kindness of non-family members. On the orders of the pastor, another member accused a man of sexual abuse to punish him for leaving the church. Bizarre, but true. And these people are NOT Amish, Mennonites, Seventh Day Adventists, or any other denomination associated with this type of behavior. Just a small town church in New England!</p>
<p>All of this leaves aside any emotional or spiritual consequences, of course.</p>