Never occurred to me to tip pre tax. But the tax here is fairly negligible (at least for the amount I spend).
I don’t exclude alcohol but it’s always only one of us drinking and it’s beer which is relatively cheap.
My dad goes to Vegas with his very well off brothers once a year. They always order a very nice bottle of wine with dinner and expect to split the costs. My dad doesn’t really drink and hates wine but without fail they try to stick him with his “share.” It’s gotten to the point where he simply refuses to go to dinner with them.
To me, THAT is cheap and rude- to expect someone to subsidize your wine when they clearly will not partake.
We have dinner with another couple every few months. We take turns choosing. It can be an expensive place or a less expensive place. The last time we chose and purchased a gift certificate to throw on the bill as it seemed that they had been paying a little more than their half the last few times. It evened the playing field in a simple way.
The discussion made me think about a related situation: organizing a vacation with friends. I’m the planner-in-charge for a group trip which could be as many as 30 people, a mix of friends and family. I’m renting a large lodge for several nights. I’ll have to come up with some pricing structure that takes note of how some of the rooms are less desirable (en suite bathroom versus shared bathroom; private room versus large bunk rooms). I could set up the prices so that it more than covers costs, just to make sure that I’m not out of pocket at all. But if it’s a tradeoff between me being out of pocket a bit more in order to make things run smoothly, I’m OK with that happening.
At the same time, the spouse and I absolutely get our pick of rooms. There have to be some benefits to being the organizer!
I’m also OK with quietly covering more costs for close friends and family when money is really tight for those folks. Thinking back to a time when the spouse and one of my siblings went on a group trip with a few other folks. My sib was still in grad school and didn’t have much money. The sib was also good friends with the trip organizer–a VERY well off relative of my spouse’s. The organizer was well aware of my sib’s financial circumstances, so my sib (foolishly, in retrospect) assumed that the organizer would make things affordable…but at the end of the trip the organizer just said “here’s how much everyone owes”. Full freight for my sib! If you’re gonna do that, then at least tell people the cost before they commit to the trip. Ugh!
Yes, I fully agree. That is also the reason why I ask for separate checks with certain friends who order a bottle of wine, always order appetizers and soup or salad or both plus an entree. They would suggest splitting the bill evenly when they know I don’t drink alcohol and I barely can finish an entree.
With other friends, we split the bill.
When we eat with close friends, we know habits. But, first time out, always safest to ask for separate checks. A simple statement, “we don’t drink” or “I just order an appetizer”. “But I want you to order whatever you want” . IRL, I said I was glad for a separate check, as I wanted a drink. My bill was less than several,others, who had full meals.
I asked Ds tonight about credit card roulette. Yes, they have played it, but only for drinks a time or two. Usually it is not decided till into the evening.
D who has been a server said that separate checks are easy with modern restaurant cash register systems. But one place she used to work had an older system or added by hand perhaps, and it was then more difficult.
This initial thread was about a family vacation. Eating with one’s family is a little different from eating with (say) another couple you don’t know well, who may have far more expensive taste in wine, order more courses, etc.
We don’t go out to eat a lot with people other than family, but honestly, rather than splitting the check, it seems that one person says “it’s on me” and it leaves the other person with more incentive to set up a future date where she can reciprocate and it all sort of balances out in the long run.
Alternatively, sometimes if I’ve met a girlfriend for coffee or such, one of us has gotten there earlier (usually me!) and already taken care of her own order, so by default we’re paying for ourselves.
I can’t stand that “end of the meal” adding up who owes “exactly” what. Women seem to do it more than men. If I am out with a good friend for breakfast or lunch we just alternate picking up the check. When out for a girls dinner we just all throw in our credit cards and have the server split the bill evenly. We all drink so no one is really “unbalancing” the bill. And I couldn’t care less if I just order an appetizer and everyone else has entrees or if some order dessert and I do not. At the end of the day over time it balances out.
"When out for a girls dinner we just all throw in our credit cards and have the server split the bill evenly. "
Typically in circumstances like that, I often see that one person puts it on a credit card and the others give that person their share in cash … not that it actually gets rung up on a bunch of separate credit cards. That’s kind of a hassle for the server, IMO. Personally in a circumstance like that I’d come prepared with enough cash so if I had to do that, I’d be able to do it.
Harvest, around here the customers do not do the dividing. It’s done by the wait staff. Again, it’s often even done even if you’re not splitting the bill.
I agree that it would be a PITA to divide manually like that.
Every single time I’ve gone out to dinner and the bill is being split – at least once a week for me – everyone just puts down a credit card and the server divides the bill among the credit cards. It is 100% the norm here. Pulling out cash would add an unwelcome degree of complexity.
I don’t usually carry a lot of cash. I use it mostly for tipping. My friends and I usually just put our credit cards with the bill and they just charge our cards equally.
I sometimes wish we could get separate bills because I tend to shy away from more expensive items on the menu because I didn’t want others to pay for my share. If I like the restaurant, I would go back with my own family. It goes both ways sometimes.
So in Michigan, there’s just kind of an assumption that when people go out they are all splitting the bill? No one ever pays for anyone else’s dinner in Michigan, ever? Even if (say) 3 couples, 6 people, go out, they don’t even assume the couples are together and they just give you 6 different checks, with tax calculated on each individual person’s meal? Are these dive bars, diners, or fine restaurants?
The problem with separate checks is so many items are shared. Who gets billed for the charcuterie plate, the bottle of wine, the bottle of sparkling water, the shared dessert? (But with all of this, obviously there are adjustments if one person is not drinking or eating more than a salad. But it makes it more of a hassle, frankly).
Actually, now that I think about it, if not everyone at the table wants to share in an expensive bottle of wine, we have asked for the wine to be billed separately. Then whoever shared in that bottle does the same thing – puts down credit cards for the wine bill and the waiter divides it up by credit cards.
No what happens is that the server splits it according to how many credit cards are put in the check billet. So if you are picking up the dinner then you just put your credit card down.
Romani, the server will split it evenly among all the credit cards, but sometimes there is that irritating person who throws a wrench in it by saying to the server “only charge me for appetizer, entree and one drink.”
Right and if someone wants to pay in cash it throws a monkey wrench into the whole thing because then you have to do the calculating that the credit card system avoids. The person paying cash has to figure out how much cash to put down and then an explanation to the waiter is necessary. It’s not a huge monkey wrench – but it does involve extra steps that are not pleasant. The credit card method is seamless – even more so in SF where so many restaurants are starting to include service in the bill.
There have to be some benefits to being the organizer!