<p>I’m 24 and I’ve been to two weddings of my friends in the last year. So it’s not very common. But basically I, and many other young women I know, are just opting out. The average guy under 40 isn’t looking for a real person as a life partner. He is looking for a glamourous piece of arm candy who fits in with the Hollywood ideals he has been exposed to (through the media) since birth. He wants one of the women from “Desparate Housewives”. Well I’m sorry but I cannot live up to the expectations of society. I cannot be an academic high achiever, a sporting superstar, a domestic goddess, super-mother and model. So I quit, ok? As far as society is concerned I (and many thousands of others like me. All ordinary normal women in other words.) will always be a failure. So why bother? I don’t even think the marriage and family route is open to me, as a woman studying for a PhD. Guys just want a stupid woman to hang off their arm and giggle. I’m afraid I’m not about to do that.</p>
<p>I am sure several parents are going to post and say “you will find the one for you” and other comforting thoughts of that nature. I don’t believe that’s true. I thought that guys in college would be different and more mature. If anything they are even more superficial as they grow older. I don’t see any benefit of being in a relationship, ever. I don’t treat myself badly so why should I let someone else do it?</p>
<p>My DD is a first year student in a doctoral program. She is planning to marry this summer, just before turning 23. She is able to pay her way through fellowships, and her future H, also in a graduate program, is doing fine financially through his marketable skills as a musician. I have rarely seen two people better suited to one another and it seems to make sense for them to marry; they are both very mature. Still, I have some fear and trepidation for them, concerns others have mentioned about the potential difficulties of meshing their careers in the same geographic location, especially since future S-in-law will complete his program before D. I guess you have to trust, at some level, and hope that all will work out, even if it is not always easy.</p>
<p>You really can’t take your experience with guys in college and project it out all the way to guys age 40. There’s a HUGE difference in maturity between 22 & 30, 30 & 35, 35 & 40. There are also lots of variables in particular men. I can point to 45 & 50 year olds who fit the description in your post. And, most men, regardless of age, appreciate eye candy…the only variable is the giggling. </p>
<p>BTW, there are women who also fit your description…lots of them. I know plent of talented single women who don’t want men who are too much smarter than them. </p>
<p>And, if your career is going to be a focus AND you’ll be making lots of money, you’ll have other challenges on your hands when finding a mate. This can be a real problem area for couples. </p>
<p>I say go ahead and opt out…because that basically means nothing. Things are going to happen when the time is right, regardless of how you label yourself today.</p>
<p>Momsdream, I certainly agree with that it’s so true.
Cupcake; Hey, there are SO many options open to you- and believe me, if guys aren’t working out- thank goodness!!! Like what kind of options- hey, women can adopt or foster a child alone, and receive help for doing so, and there are some kids who are SO grateful! A child doesn’t have to be talented or smart, it’s the soul that counts. I wouldn’t say this if I haven’t seen it.And there are kids who need you now.And animals too. But I would get involved in dating in some way- like go to church singles or social functions or whatever. Just to be out there occasionally. But have personal interests- like join the Sierra Club or swim or go to arobics or join a birding group. Hey, birding is FUN - you go to neat places and see neat birds. It’s a lot of fun standing in tall grass with funky people wearing silly hats just waiting to see a bird! Like my thing was history and got involved with reinactors (sp sorry) when I was young.Dressed in funky costumes cooking over a fire marching in the wilderness. (with bozos- we were bozos!)It was fun.
And I got my heart broken plenty, too. I don’t blame ANYONE for opting out. The point I’m making is- there is no need to feel remorse or cheated or annoyed- there are SO MANY options to have a happy forfilled life. There is so much need out there for everyone.</p>
<p>Oh my, where to start? I married right out of college, have a demanding career, 4 kids and lots of interests. Were there bumps? You bet. I wouldn’t have done a thing differently though. </p>
<p>Well. I guess I might not have married so young. As a woman at any ivy school in the late 70s, it never dawned on me that I could not have it all. We were headed to top grad schools and top careers every bit as much as our male counterparts were, and we never even discussed any concerns about doing it all. Many of my college friends married right out of college as I did, I can only think of 2 still married to the first spouse. This is not all bad, in fact many of my friends found much better marriage fits the second time around. </p>
<p>Backhandgrips daugher has chosen a profession she can do most anywhere. It sounds like she and hubby have a workable plan. I would not have a problem if my child married at 22 if this were the case. I do, however, worry about kids who want 2 high flying, eightly plus hour/wk careers thinking they will easily coexist. In my first marriage I married a man I admired for his hard work and will to go to the top. I divorced him for the same reason!</p>
<p>Cupcake, the boys will grow up after college. Some faster than others. Date and have fun but fulfill your needs right now. It is harder for women who are very high achievers to meet their match. But they’re out there. And a great man will enrich your life as much as your great education and great career. But I’m proud the women of your (and my daughters’) generation are thinking about a full life and not sacrificing all for a man. Is it any wonder valium was so popular among 50’s housewives?</p>
<p>I don’t envy the young women today. So many difficult choices. On the other hand, so many options. So long glass ceiling, you girls are going places!</p>
<p>I became a father for the first time at 40, and the second time at 43. My wife’s a year younger than I am; we had no fertility issues, but in view of the experiences of some of our friends, we count ourselves as extremely fortunate. </p>
<p>Our children are now 3 and 6, and exceptionally considerate of others (and to a degree that surprises and delights me, considerate of each other). </p>
<p>I have a slightly older sister who has two grandchildren. I thought she and her husband were exceptionally good parents, and I think the same of my wife and I. </p>
<p>On my next birthday, I’ll be the same age my grandmother was when I was born, and the age my father was I started my junior year in college.</p>
<p>My wife put her career as an attorney on hold when our first child was born, and plans to resume it part-time (maybe) when our youngest is in first grade.</p>
<p>I bring things to fatherhood that I couldn’t have offered as a younger man. There are trade-offs, but on the whole, I’d guess our children have come out ahead by having older parents.</p>
<p>Hey, Greybeard, nice to see someone else on CC with young children!..I was almost 36 when I wed. (not by choice, but Prince Charming didn’t come along til then)…He was worth the wait. Had my son at 37 and daughter at 41…I’m 49 now and exhausted but so happy that I have these kids!..My husband’s just a couple of years older …sometimes we look at each other and say, “are we too old for this?” and laugh…but they do keep us “young”…There’s a mother of my daughter’s classmate who I thought was the au pair on parent’ night because she’s 27…I can’t imagine having that responsibility at such a young age…My college friends have kids who’re out of college now, and they’re looking for second careers. While I was working all of those 20 and 30-something years they were in the kitchen and now our roles are reversed…I didn’t have the maturity then that I have now, but I know that they did…and are happy with the choices that they made…Fertility issues are a reality that can smack you right in the face, though…we were so fortunate!</p>
<p>I just had to throw in my anecdotes. My mother had me when she was 21 (almost 22) and she and my father (about a year older than her) were married two months later. My mother was close to receiving her Bachelor’s Degree but was unable to finish and my father never did go to college. My brother was born 13 months later. In their case, they should have waited (I don’t think I ever had a childhood and most of the time was confused about who was the parent).</p>
<p>I married one month after my 18th birthday to someone who was five years older than me. He needed a caretaker so I gave up my plans to go to college. Luckily we didn’t have any children, and we were divorced almost six years later. I am now working hard on finishing college and getting into the career that I’ve wanted since middle school. Luckily I also have found a great guy, but we certainly are NOT getting married for a while (and neither of us are interested in having children–we both raised our siblings, now it is our turn).</p>
<p>To add a twist, I’ve also seen my parents as “older” parents as my sister is 12 years younger than me. She has been raised differently than my brother and I were–and in this case she has been given too much “indulgence”. They used to joke about how they were too tired now to worry about the big stuff.</p>
<p>I’m not saying that anyone who marries young will have problems (there were many other issues involved), but I do agree that the people who chose to wait are doing the smart thing for THEM.</p>
<p>Dke,
There’s a difference of 19 yrs between my youngest brother and me. My mother needed the extra help, so I ended up attending a local community college the first 2 yrs. I always ended up carrying my baby brother at the checkout line at the market…you can imagine the comments!!! I was definitely not happy about that.</p>
<p>Demingy,
Yes, live and let learn. There’s 8 yrs separating my oldest and our 3rd child. If there’s anything they’ve learned, it’s…1 child is good…2 is manageable…3?! Forget it. LOL Our oldest D says she’ll have 1 child…then ship it to D2 to raise (she loves children). My advice to D2 was to bill her for it… :)</p>
<p>Jym626: Your comment brought back some vivid memories in the parking lot of our supermarket!!! Arrghh! Funny how some things are plastered in our memories…just like those contractions with the first-born! LOL</p>
<p>Archermom- When I read your post, my mind quickly jumped from trying to hold onto little ones in the supermarket parking lot to memories of the first time older s. got behind the wheel in a baseball fields parking lot :eek: Years go by and you still can’t hold onto them in a parking lot!</p>
<p>Funny quick memory. Just as S was about to take the car (actually, minivan at the time ) out of “park” someone pulled into the lot and sat in her car for a while. S. was petrified… We waited a few minutes, and when she didn’t get out or move, I walked up to her car and tapped on her window. Scared her half to death. I said " See that minivan over there? My s. is behind the wheel and he just got his learner’s permit a few hours ago. I wouldn’t sit here if I were you! She was looking at her map for directions. I helped her out with directions, we thanked each other profusely, and she cleared the parking lot !</p>
<p>You know, isn’t it more about finding a good fit than timing? </p>
<p>My mother and grandmother were both in early 30’s with established careers (physician and teacher) before marrying, while I was married at 22 and DH was 23. I was not ready to get married at all, but DH was, and I thought so much of him (and still do) that I wasn’t going to let him get away. I remember worriedly talking to my mom about it just before we got engaged, and her response was that it should be more about the person than the timing. Good advice.</p>
<p>I also decided I wanted to be with DH all the time - didn’t want to launch a career away from him and have to make arrangements all the time to be together - and he felt the same. If this was indeed what was going to happen, and we knew we wanted to be together, it made sense to get married. I was terrified. It felt like jumping into the water with both feet and no life jacket. But I was just as afraid to not get married - what a conundrum! But it has worked out great so far, although no one escapes without bumps.</p>
<p>I also think this isn’t about having kids anymore - couples just have kids and then get married… or not. Getting married for many is no longer a prerequisite to being parents. </p>
<p>I was in five friend’s weddings the summer right after college and only one of them is divorced. Between my husband and me we have 14 siblings with 11 married, most right after college, and only one divorce so far among all of them. </p>
<p>What I am noticing <em>much</em> more is folks around my age - mid 40’s - who are getting divorced after years together (and with several of these couples marrying in their late 20’s so they were supposedly more mature), usually because of the involvement of one of them with someone else. Who ever can be assured a marriage will last? People change, relationships get weary if couples aren’t careful, the stress of raising kids takes its toll on the marriage first.</p>
<p>Greybeard: DW and I were just a couple of years older than you when we had our (only) child. I agree that our accumulated wisdom came in handy, especially after we had years of watching friends and relatives working at raising their kids. The only problem we had (aside from people sometimes thinking that we were the grandparents) was that we tended to be 10-15 yeras older than the parents of S’s classmates, which sometimes inhibited developing our own social connections with other parents.</p>
<p>Well, you can have your family sooner or later, guess there are benefits to both. I for one, after being the ‘ultimate mom’ to 4 am REALLY looking forward to youngest going off to college, and spending winter vacations in Florida watching pre- season baseball games. Hubby and I deserve it, we did it all for those kids .
Yikes!..and now for my daughter’s baby shower!</p>
<p>What I am wondering is, are your daughters and sons worrying about these questions in light of their future careers? I am going to start another thread asking that question.</p>
<p>Interesting to me is that the one mother here that posted in support of a young marriage has a daughter who is not on the “fast track”. Is this a matter if education and career choice. Will women in this generation that are ambitious in business marry much later and much less often?</p>
I was definitely not happy about that.</p>
) out of “park” someone pulled into the lot and sat in her car for a while. S. was petrified… We waited a few minutes, and when she didn’t get out or move, I walked up to her car and tapped on her window. Scared her half to death. I said " See that minivan over there? My s. is behind the wheel and he just got his learner’s permit a few hours ago. I wouldn’t sit here if I were you! She was looking at her map for directions. I helped her out with directions, we thanked each other profusely, and she cleared the parking lot !</p>