Why?
You should be truthful and that would mean consistent. At Princeton, you won’t choose a major that early I don’t believe - not til 4th semesters.
Absolutely agree…wherever you enroll, plan on spending your entire time in college there. If something happens to change those plans later on, so be it, but plan on being there for four years. As you yourself said:
This is a great attitude to have; I love it!
I can’t speak to Edinburgh, but right now you have a list with one likely acceptance (Rutgers) and 22 reaches, and only about 5 of those reaches offer merit aid. I’m not going to talk about the financial aspect, as I’ve already mentioned it upthread. I am, however, going to talk about the mental and emotional impact.
You’ve visited Rutgers and liked it, and it’s a likely admit for you. That is fabulous! Since you have a likely that you’d be happy with, you’re now thinking of having an extremely reach-heavy list. What happens if April 1 rolls around and you only have 1 acceptance and 20+ rejections/waitlists?
For some people, rejection is like a fuel that fires them up to be even more awesome and incredible where they land and prove all the naysayers wrong. For individuals like that, it’s okay to have a very reach-heavy list.
Most people, however, feel hurt when they get a rejection/waitlist. And if they get an acceptance in the fall and then rejection after rejection after rejection after rejection after rejection after rejection after rejection after rejection after rejection after rejection (and I only typed out 10 rejections), it can have a real impact on their emotional and mental health. Even if they get one acceptance, ten rejections, and then another acceptance, a string of rejections can still cause a serious toll on the person.
Additionally, even if they were happy with their sure thing, they can start to doubt the school and their acceptance. Is that school really any good if it was the only one that accepted them? This is just a downward spiral that is far more common than I prefer.
Generally, I find that most people do better with more acceptances than rejections. That doesn’t mean that’s what’s right for you, but I would strongly urge you to have some serious introspection on this issue and talk with your family about possible impacts if admissions decisions don’t go the way you want them to and then craft your application list accordingly.
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Yes, my counselor said I could be anywhere in between the top 11% - 15% - we really don’t know.
I mentioned different majors because it is a strategy my counselor, parents, and myself are discussing. Regardless of whether they admit by major, many schools still ask for intended major or area of interest on the application. For example, putting CS as an intended major would likely make it more competitive than putting Classics. I want to study Government/PPE (and relevant areas), Economics, and work in some writing too. So I’m adjusting the mix of which ones I put down as my area of interest/intended major depending on each school, particularly because Princeton has an especially top econ program and might thus be more challenging to get into as an intended econ-area student rather than a writer (though obviously, everything is crazy competitive with a school like that).
At this point all I can do is put my best foot forward with my essays. And - I think this applies to everyone - the saying “you’ll end up where you’re meant to be” is pretty true. If a school can’t see your value, then you weren’t meant to go there anyway. Though of course I’d love to get in to some of the reach schools, if Rutgers is my one shot then that’s okay too - I’ll try my best there, learn and do everything I can, and enjoy every moment knowing that the others missed out. Thank you so much for your advice!!!
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I see what you’re saying here - I’ll think about it while doing my college research and have a talk with my parents. The main thing is that I know if I had Rutgers, Penn State, and Pittsburgh as acceptances I would easily choose Rutgers. What differentiates just applying for Rutgers vs. applying for multiple safeties - is it that having the choice would feel better emotionally, even if I already know what I would choose? Thank you!
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Also, Edinburgh should hopefully be more likely than some of the others - though pretty selective overall, based on their website’s explanations I am significantly past the threshold in terms of stats (Edinburgh doesn’t even look at GPA if you have the test scores). I also have many relevant experiences supporting my interest in law (I would apply as a law major) and am going to make my personal statement as strong as possible.
I agree with your logic - Rutgers is enough.
Only thing I’d add is - you’d be amazed how things might change in the next 6 months.
May not…but may.
Didn’t see Pitt on your list…it’s strong in most everything…so it’s a great choice and more importantly, get your app in early - August, early Sept - and have an admission in the bank!!
Things do change for some - my kid was set on WUSTL - til he visited Purdue and decided to enroll there after they accepted him - and at the last minute changed his mind and wanted to enroll at Alabama.
He’s not you in that you are rank focused - but the point is - things do change - so having some acceptance is a good thing - and maybe even a few at a few different sized schools - since you have Wellesley on your list - to Rutgers.
Maybe you want to ensure an admission at each size school?
This is not true, rank can be inferred (for students from schools that don’t publish rank) in a number of ways. This info can impact admission decisions.
For example, some colleges sort all apps from a given HS by GPA, so it’s clear on a relative basis where a student falls, especially when combined with information from the school profile and/or counselor LoR.
Right now this is what your list looks like.
Extremely Likely (80-99+%)
- Rutgers
Likely (60-79%)
Toss-Up (40-59%)
Lower Probability (20-39%)
Low Probability (less than 20%)
- The rest of your list, with the possible exception of Edinburgh.
If we take @tsbna44’s suggestion of looking at the type of schools on your list, this is what I see:
- Big State Schools
- Medium to large private schools
- Small women’s college
For big state schools, you’ve got Rutgers as an extremely likely admit that you like. No need to find more.
Medium to large private schools: Odds are, you won’t get an acceptance to one on your list. But as you have a couple of Jesuit colleges on it, maybe you’d consider Loyola Chicago or Loyola Maryland (the latter of which is in a consortium with Johns Hopkins) as extremely likely admits. Or College of the Holy Cross as a toss-up or lower probability option. You’ve also got CMU on your list which I think of as a tech-y school with some arts creativity. You might consider Rochester Institute of Technology as an extremely likely admit or U. of Rochester as a toss-up.
Small women’s colleges: For an extremely likely admit you might consider Agnes Scott in Atlanta which is in a consortium with Emory. Bryn Mawr has already been offered as an alternative. Mount Holyoke or Smith could be contenders as well.
So then your list might end up looking closer to having a selection like this:
Extremely Likely
-
Rutgers
-
Loyola Chicago
-
Loyola Maryland
-
Agnes Scott
-
Rochester Institute of Technology
Likely
Toss-Up
-
Bryn Mawr
-
College of the Holy Cross
-
Mount Holyoke
-
U. of Rochester
Lower Probability
- Smith
Low Probability
- Your favorites of the low probability schools
I don’t expect that you’ll add as many toss-ups and extremely likely schools to your own application list. But I think it’s very reasonable to provide yourself room to change between now and May 1 (most seniors do change). And in giving yourself choice about what kind of school you want to end up at, you will also give yourself additional acceptances that can blunt whatever damage might come from a rejection. Additionally, the schools that are likelier to admit you are also likelier to try and woo you to their schools…with merit money, invitations to select opportunities, and other things that might tip the scales in their favor. And being wooed is not only a great balm to any rejectiions…it can turn in to amazing options that you end up preferring over an admission to a low probability school.
It’s as if you had a friend asking 20 people to a dance on your behalf. If your friend comes back and says that only 1 person was interested, you might feel a good bit of disappointment in thinking about the other 19 who weren’t inclined and not that excited about the 1, even though you told your friend which 20 people you were interested in. But if your friend says that 3 people were interested, then you’re spending your time thinking about which of those three people you want to take to the dance and not thinking about the 17 who said they weren’t interested.
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I’ll be frank. You don’t really have any targets on your list. You have high reaches (almost all of the schools), low reaches and Rutgers (a likely). I could see you with an acceptance at BC if you applied ED and maybe Carnegie Mellon (as you aren’t a STEM student). The rest of the schools have minuscule admission rates and while you have great ECs, and a great test score, your gpa is low for those schools. For context, my S24 had 3.98UW/4.64W/1580 SAT and was rejected at the 3 ivies he applied to and WL at G’town and Northwestern. I do not want to discourage you but do want to interject a note of realism. Of course you should apply to some reaches - you never know how your application will resonate with AOs - but you should really add some schools that are more realistic targets so you are not left with Rutgers as your default choice. Just adding more and more reaches to your list is not going to increase your chances at any one of them and doing a great job with the essays will be really difficult if you have too many reaches on your list.
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- Rutgers NB (maaaayyybe Penn State/American University? finalizing with my parents)
- UVA, UNC, UMich, NYU, Boston College, Wellesley, Georgetown, Carnegie Mellon, maybe Emory
- Northwestern, Duke,
- Ivies + Stanford + Uchicago
Actually…you ARE skipping from Rutgers to a bunch of reach schools. As suggested upstream…I strongly suggest you look for some schools that are not reaches and include them on your application list which right now is top heavy.
Really…you need another sure thing…choices are good to have if it comes to that. I’m not sure why you seem so resistant to this suggestion.
Please read the thread I’m linking here. It’s an older thread but the message is the same. This student was a NMF, class Val, very strong rigor in courses, excellent ECs, excellent LOR. NO ONE expected that he would get accepted no where when he applied as a high school senior, but that is what happened. He really didn’t have an absolute sure thing. And if you are needing the honors college to make Rutgers work…neither do you.
This student had a horrible end to his HS senior year. He was on a couple of waitlists that turned into rejections. He took a gap year and did land on his feet very well…BUT do you want your senior year to be similar?
Read this from the beginning to the end.
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Law at Edinburgh?
It won’t help you get admitted to a law school in the USA, and it’s unlikely you’d find a Scottish firm to help you get working permits if you wanted to stay and practice in Scotland. This is not a well thought out plan.
I don’t understand the logic of wanting to study econ but putting something else. Princeton is LITERALLY not going to care about the distinction between admitting you to study creative writing vs. admitting you to study econ. Since the vast majority of applicants don’t get admitted AT ALL, you are making life MUCH harder for yourself by having multiple majors, many more “why us” essays to write, trying to fit your interests into someone else’s box.
Being authentic is a much better admissions strategy.
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Thanks for your insights! I spoke with my parents and did some research. I’m adding Drexel, Vassar, and William & Mary on the possibility of getting merit. Maybe I’ll be able to get some merit at Drexel, which I especially like because they have a very unique Business Law major and the location is great, along with their career/internship prospects. William & Mary also has a wonderful government major. However, my parents said if I don’t get merit scholarships to those specific schools I’ll just go to Rutgers.
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Please see past replies and my most recent response for clarification.
Please see most recent response! Also, it’s just that my family largely has a “Rutgers is just as good and cheaper” mentality when it comes to safeties/targets.
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- I’m in love with the University of Edinburgh - the institution, the academics, the culture, the history, etc. I’m not looking for a competitive edge in US law school by going to Edinburgh. If anything, I’ve heard that you can really do any major for pre-law, so I would argue Edinburgh is more relevant!
- It’s about getting in first and then transferring/adding majors when applicable. Applying through a less competitive, but still highly relevant, major for my interests is an easier way to get through the door.
I expect that you will most likely get accepted to Rutgers, and I have a very good opinion of Rutgers. I have met multiple Rutgers graduates many ways (in graduate school, coworkers, …) and they have all made it look very good. I think that you can do very well with a degree from Rutgers.
One concern that I have is that I am not completely sure that Rutgers is really a safety. This is something that your guidance counselor should know better than I would. However, I think that you should make sure that you really are applying to at least one safety.
Regarding your long list of reaches, the main issue that I see here is that this implies a lot of essays to write, and it is hard to do a good job when you have so many essays and applications to send in.
When I see “Ivies” on a list, I wonder whether you have taken a close look at each of them and figured out which ones would be a better fit for you.
I didn’t think that Princeton admitted by major. I had thought that it was like MIT (in this one way) where you pick whatever major you want at the end of your freshman year. What do you want to major in? At least to me economics and English seem like very different degrees. I suppose that the only downside of putting English as your major is that (in the unlikely event that you are admitted) you are likely to have an English professor as your freshman year advisor, which is not necessarily a problem.
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Drexel is a co op school. I can’t imagine you’d be happy there given the rest of your list.
W&M is a reasonable reach. And to many, as strong or near as strong as a lot of your list.
If you were seeking merit (your comment on Drexel), your list would look very different.
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Your logic on Edinburgh escapes me. If you are planning on majoring in econ…go study econ.
And you are outlining an expensive and stressful senior year by your approach.
But you seem resistant to advice from people who actually know how many of these colleges make decisions. So you do you. Good luck.
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So many people here have given me wonderful advice that I have taken to heart and I can’t thank them enough! I just happen to disagree with your particular point on Edinburgh. As for majoring in econ, it isn’t possible due to my weaker math background. I’m applying to Oxford for law, and UCAS uses the same personal statement for all UK schools and I can’t try econ for Oxford since they require extensive math qualifications/entrance exams. Everyone has their own reasons, and yes, although many users here are definitely way more qualified than I, there’s no need for that extra bit of condescension you showed - please refrain in the future. Thank you!
Yes…Drexel does seem like a bit of an outlier. But I researched it a lot and actually visited it when I visited UPenn!
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