Talking about Anne MacCaffrey’s dragons, they certainly could not have flamed continuously for 20-30 minutes iirc - they needed stone to chew. Where does Drogon get the flame from - internal gasses?
The difference is that in Breaking Bad the writers carefully constructed Walter White’s character so that his increasingly evil nature was convincingly revealed which is what happens when the show runners actually care about writing a believable conclusion. The GoT showrunners have made a ridiculous hash out of the final season. They could have constructed a believable character arc for Dany where you could understand why she decided to commit genocide after she had already conquered Kings Landing but instead they made it seem that she did it because she’s having a fit of pique and self-pity. Oh, and they’ve made Tyrion inexplicably stupid and made Jon Snow seem so thick that it’s unbelievable that anyone would think he’d make a capable ruler.
This review captures the problems brilliantly: https://www.npr.org/2019/05/13/722629681/game-of-thrones-season-8-episode-5-let-it-be-fear
I see Drogon as much more independent than many of you do. Remember how he left her in the desert for a long time? (I think it was longer in the books, in the TV series it was over the season break). My son likes to think that he was off laying eggs. If Dany dies, maybe he will just leave? I also think he has some instinctual affinity for Jon. Oh and my son says that being at Storm’s End strengthens the dragons from the dragonstone, so I guess he was all “powered” up for the battle.
As for the frustration with Dany, I can only guess that the intent was so the audience, along with the characters, would be watching the destruction and wondering “why?” I personally think that just one little scene, such as Dany flying by and seeing Cersei in the tower, still appearing confident after the bells, would have been enough to give us some ideas. Or just SHOW what Dany was seeing and what she was thinking. It reminded me of the other big battle where once again Dany was flying around and we were all wondering what the heck she was doing and why.
I think Drogon will go with Jon up north
Earlier i wrote that Tyrion would be sansa’s Hand, but now I think he could rule/guide kings Lamding. Sansa would have Brienne by her side. aryA? bran? Idk
I think Tyrion’s going to die.
Regarding folks being upset over Dany - I disagree with the sentiments expressed by Joblue. But isn’t it great that the show has sparked so much emotional reaction, both for and against the Mad Queen scenario? It’s fun to take part of a cultural phenom by discussing/debating the behavior of people in a fictional world with other watchers of the show.
Looking forward to the finale.
Random thoughts for Season 8, Episode 6:
- Tyrion is toast (literally) as he betrayed Dany twice (last time was releasing Jamie);
- Vary's letter(s) made it to Winterfell and Turmond (and army), Ghost, Brienne, Bran and Sansa arrive in Kings Landing for one last confrontation; major battle ensues;
- During the battle, Jon fights Grey Worm and kills him, while Dany is away, fighting from the air;
- With most of her troops destroyed, Dany orders Drogon to kill Jon but the dragon refuses to obey and flies back to his home in the wasteland;
- Without protection, Arya kills Dany using Grey Worm's face who she thinks is still alive;
- Jon, who never fully healed from his first death and subsequent battles, dies suddenly;
- Sansa takes the Iron Throne with newly knighted Brienne of Tarth, Bran, and Ayra at her side.
I hope Tyrion doesn’t die. One, he is a complex and flawed character and has had wonderful development over the course of the show. Two, he is the only one who really sees the big picture with all its complexities and how fabulous to have the person most unlikely to sit on the throne actually be King. However, since Jon is technically heir my prediction is Jon with Tyrion as his Hand. Probably too neatly tied up for this show but I can hope.
I’ve got to admit, when the bells were ringing in King’s Landing, I was saying to the TV, “Don’t trust Cersei!” I fully expected Cersei/Qyburn to have a few more tricks up their sleeves. It wasn’t very dramatic, but it did rather make sense that Cersei was ultimately crushed by the Red Keep, her center of power.
I get what’s happened to Dany - she has lost every foundation and feels truly alone. But the show should have added a few more scenes to demonstrate that. Also, Dany’s conquering M.O. has previously been to free slaves wherever she goes, but there are no slaves in Westeros and no one was clamoring for a return of the Targaryens. She could not understand how to win over the people of Westeros.
Is it too much to hope Westeros will reject kings and become a representative democracy?
^ I totally agree that they should have demonstrated Dany’s mindset more clearly. Also, the episode director seems to have had a slightly different interpretation:
I feel like…if that was her true motivation, I did not get that at all from the episode.
I think Dany might try to fry Jon and he walks out of the flames and the dragon becomes his and Dany is killed by Arya. Arya had a rough go of it last week!
^^That’s really interesting. I didn’t get that from the episode either. She would have scathed the city by attacking just the Red Keep where Cersei was though. Guess that wouldn’t have been enough scathing…?
The scathing got repetitive and boring.
Marian (#377), as re: what happens to dragons when their rider dies:
I don’t know how the current show writers would handle it, but in the Martin prequel (“Fire and Blood”), dragons live a long time and often are ridden by another Targaryen after a rider’s death.
Thank you, @treemaven.
Maybe Jon could ride Drogon into permanent exile north of the Wall (where the population is spread thin and a dragon couldn’t do much damage) after somebody else kills Daenerys. Jon seems to like it up there anyway.
Having never watched an episode until a few weeks ago I am now caught up. In my perfect world Arya kills Dany protecting Jon who just couldn’t kill her in the end. She may or may not die as a result, doesn’t much matter to me. Jon takes Drogon and goes up north to live with his friends and Ghost.
Sansa rules with Tyrion as her hand or at least with her. Sam and Gilly and a large family live happily ever after.
Ok, probably won’t happen but that would make me happy. I’m not sure I really like many of the characters anymore (except Sam). I think my like factor from best to least right now is Sam, Tyrion, Jon, Sansa, Arya, Dany.
I just don’t want them to kill Tyrion but it could happen.
In a way, Dany’s character arc and the consequent fan reaction reminds me of Walter White in “Breaking Bad” — such a good man at the beginning but pretty loathsome by the finale
The difference is that in Breaking Bad the writers carefully constructed Walter White’s character so that his increasingly evil nature was convincingly revealed which is what happens when the show runners actually care about writing a believable conclusion
I actually thought the series finale of BB was a cop-out because it allowed Walter White to partially redeem himself by saving Jessie, taking out Hank’s murderers, and arranging for his family to receive his dirty money. In other words, they spent five seasons having him morph from Mr. Chips into Tony Montana, only to flinch at the end. For my money, BB was one of the greatest TV series of all time (better than GOT IMHO), but it would have been better if Ozymandias was the last episode. In that sense, perhaps the BB writers made the opposite mistake of what the GOT writers seem to be doing with Dany.
Bittersweet ending: Jon and Dany somehow both end up dead, and Tyrion asks Sansa to join him on the Iron Throne and help build a more just society. She says no and returns to the north, and he ends up alone in King’s Landing. Until the Iron Bank comes to collect its debt.
One thing regarding the succession is that whoever it is has to have a loyal armed force in order to hold the throne at all. Tyrion has none, as far as we know. Jon, Dany, Yara Greyjoy, and Daario do. Sansa may, but only if Jon is dead, because the North and the wildlings chose Jon. The same is true for Arya. Not to mention that perhaps the only person less suited to ruling and organizing a society than Arya was the Hound.
I keep thinking of the last scene of Hamlet, where the foreign prince walks in to rule after everyone else is dead.
Kit Harington says the ending is “bittersweet” so I think Arya and Sansa will survive together.
Tyrion and Dany (and maybe Drogon) just have one more day to live (in our time). Besides that, I expect the unexpected.
Looking forward to tomorrow night. I like how I have been surprised this season. I am not all that easy to surprise and, IMO (I know some others vehemently disagree), the surprises made sense.
What a treat, this show.
Apparently the current odds-on favorite to sit on the iron throne is Bran. Seriously?